Europa League 2020-21 - Quest For Glory

[Ossie Wembley]

You think this team is good enough to win the EL so it will be down to mourinho if we don't. I don't think we are good enough which is down to the owners in my view. I think its very harsh to expect mourinho to get this team to win the EL. But others think we are more than capable so mourinho can have no excuses as he had a good team. No right or wrong.

The UEFA cup yes - he won it with a far worse United team.

 

[1991Spurs]

Always liked EUFA Cup/Europa nights down the lane. They were always affordable and easy to get tickets for and could enjoy a few post work pints before kick off. I wish they would stop the no alcohol on European nights nonsense. I've had a hangover at full time before.

 

[Sean]

Always liked EUFA Cup/Europa nights down the lane. They were always affordable and easy to get tickets for and could enjoy a few post work pints before kick off. I wish they would stop the no alcohol on European nights nonsense. I've had a hangover at full time before.

You can get a beer at the ground now

 

[Paul Allen's Omen]

We definitely have the squad for the EL and top 4.

In the group stages we can easily play a mainly back-up squad with and rotate in some starters.

No reason that a team such as can't be the basis for a EL squad to face the likes of the teams we will see in the group stage:

Gazzaniga
Tanganga-Dier-Kim/New CB-Sess
Moura-Fernandes-Winks
Lamela-New Striker-Alli

Replace any guys sold with their replacements brought in and accounts for Skipp being on loan

That still leaves a EPL starting 11 of something like:

Lloris
New RB-Toby-Sanchez-Davies
GLC-Hojbjerg-Ndombele
Berg-Kane-Son

Once the knockout stage comes in you can put more of the starters in there and still not over run them even with League Cup and FA Cup games. The only question I would have is whether that starting 11 is top 4 quality but that has nothing to do with EL and everything to do with us not having/bringing in enough quality.

'kim, New CB, New Striker,New RB,Hojbjerg and Berg'

 

[scott]

I think it harming in the league is very overrated and an excuse used by teams that are too weak to do much in the league in the first place.

If we are too weak to compete for top 4 and EL it is most likely that the actual case is just that we are too weak to compete for the top 4.

These are the teams that Woolwich and Man United faced in the group stage: Eintrecht Frankfurt, Standard Liege, Vitoria, AZ, Partizan, Astana. There is no reason that my first team listed could not win a group with these teams without a single player from our starting 11.

In the knockout stage Woolwich, Wolves and United were matched with Olympaikos, Espanyol and Brugge and that was with Woolwich and Wolves failing to win their groups. Again 3 teams we can beat without having to use a ton of our first team starters.

Obviously with other Cups we are likely to have a few players overlapping but not enough that it should wipe out their stamina or fitness. When we have big EPL games coming up we can easily keep any players that are at risk at home and still be fine for the EL.

The biggest issue we have with top 4 is not the supposed drain that EL will have on us, it is the fact that we are at best the 5th best team in the EPL and maybe lower after the transfer window is done.

Yeah, some good points. Another theory is that we are too weak to get top 4 so let's prioritise the europa anyway. It would be a better way to get CL qualification.
I get what you are saying about such & such team should beat this europa team. But we should have been able to beat norwich & sheffield united but couldn't. So I don't like going down that route. Even palace who had lost 7 on the trot were too strong for us to overcome.

 

[Igula]

Yeah, some good points. Another theory is that we are too weak to get top 4 so let's prioritise the europa anyway. It would be a better way to get CL qualification.
I get what you are saying about such & such team should beat this europa team. But we should have been able to beat norwich & sheffield united but couldn't. So I don't like going down that route. Even palace who had lost 7 on the trot were too strong for us to overcome.

Those are quite different situations though.

Norwich is the closest in that it was a Cup competition but we outplayed them, got unlucky to go to Pens but most importantly did not take the game seriously. If we likewise do not take EL seriously, especially in the KO stage then yes we could lose.

CP was the last game of the season in which we needed a draw based on the results in other games and got that draw. Not sure that it has much relevance to the Europa Leauge.

Sheffield United were games in the middle of a EPL season against a team that finished two spots below us in the table. All I can see that is applicable is that yes you can lose to teams that are in a similar tier to you.

The EL is not a guaranteed win for us but again we will be playing zero teams much better than us and are going to be one of the favorites. There is zero reason to think we can't win it.

 

[scott]

Who will be better in the EL than us?

I mean it is hard to tell right now not knowing who will come from the CL but using the current Europa League season the only teams better than us would be Manchester United and Inter. Both teams that we could easily beat in a one off final.

The year before you would be looking at Inter, Napoli, Chelsea as teams that are comparable to us currently.

So we likely are looking at having a team or 2 from Italy, likely their 3rd or 4th best, another English team in this case Wolves or Leicester and maybe a 2nd tier team from Germany or Spain. Not a guarantee that we win by any means but not a single terrifying team or a team that we have no business beating.

At the very worst come the knockout stage we are likely 4th favorites at worst more likely top 2.

So why again is this not a tournament we can win?

For starters if any of chelsea, united, liverpool or city finish 3rd then you would be brave to back us to win. Same with the likes of atletico madrid. By your logic we would have progressed further this season in the cups but the likes of Norwich, Colchester & red bull were too much for us. So I don't get why you put so much in to the who's better than us theory.

 

[scott]

It's not fair to expect a manager to win any given competition in which he's given a competitive squad, but in English football those opportunities compound.

If in two years Mourinho hasn't won anything, having been handed a built, mature squad on the precipice of doing so, then he's either failed or we've performed so well in the league that the allocation of resources away from the cups was a mistake.

You mean if he gets us top 4 & no trophies it was a mistake?

 

[scott]

Those are quite different situations though.

Norwich is the closest in that it was a Cup competition but we outplayed them, got unlucky to go to Pens but most importantly did not take the game seriously. If we likewise do not take EL seriously, especially in the KO stage then yes we could lose.

CP was the last game of the season in which we needed a draw based on the results in other games and got that draw. Not sure that it has much relevance to the Europa Leauge.

Sheffield United were games in the middle of a EPL season against a team that finished two spots below us in the table. All I can see that is applicable is that yes you can lose to teams that are in a similar tier to you.

The EL is not a guaranteed win for us but again we will be playing zero teams much better than us and are going to be one of the favorites. There is zero reason to think we can't win it.

Are you sure we didn't take the Norwich game seriously? I can't remember but that seems odd from a mourinho team.

 

[Igula]

For starters if any of chelsea, united, liverpool or city finish 3rd then you would be brave to back us to win. Same with the likes of atletico madrid. By your logic we would have progressed further this season in the cups but the likes of Norwich, Colchester & red bull were too much for us. So I don't get why you put so much in to the who's better than us theory.

No we would have progressed further in the Cups if we had taken them seriously. I have already addressed that as a potential pitfall of the Europa League.

i have also addressed the possibility of a bigger team dropping into the EL, but as that hasn't happened in the past two years and would likely mean that team is having a poor season and not likely as big a threat then it really shouldn't be that concerning. The chances of a fully firing Liverpool/City/AM/Chelsea/United finishing 3rd in their CL group is fairly small.

Also, since your big thing seems to be competing for top 4 if we are worried about playing Chelsea or United in the late stages of the EL then I don't see how you expect us to finish top 4.

I would also say that "being brave" to back us to win is far from guaranteeing anything. If one of those teams drop it makes it tougher to win but far from impossible. It is also a terrible reason to not want to play in EL or try to win.

 

[SpiderSpurs]

Could cost him his job. We don't have the squad to cope with EL & a top 4 race. So if he goes all out for the EL we will suffer in the league. Levy might not accept another season of no CL football.

We win the EL, then Levy gets his CL football.

 

[SpiderSpurs]

I don't get people who love ENIC/levy now saying how important trophies are. I thought it was just consistency in the league.
Trophies are important. But trophies aren't suddenly important when defending levy/ENIC

If we (Poch) hadn't bottled semi finals and finals then we'd have a few trophies. The tools have always been there, the craft to use them has been lacking.... till now...

 

[FightingIllini]

You mean if he gets us top 4 & no trophies it was a mistake?

Well if he gets us 4th and 4th with Redknapp-era point totals, then I'd just call it a failure. Not shameful failure, not a catastrophe, but a failure.

On the other hand, Mourinho's best Premier League side was his first with Chelsea, an absolutely imperious 95 points, then a PL record. That performance would have won none of the last three PL titles, and would have come 3rd two seasons ago. If we perform like THAT but go out of all the cups with understrength sides, then yeah, that's a mistake.

IMO the absolute prime objective for Spurs in THIS moment, in THIS Premier League, with THIS squad, must be silverware above all else, whatever your view may be on the cups-versus-league position argument in general.

 

[scott]

We win the EL, then Levy gets his CL football.

All or nothing. A very big ask to win Europa. We shall see if you're right & we do. Much better way to get it than top 4 anyway.

 

[scott]

If we (Poch) hadn't bottled semi finals and finals then we'd have a few trophies. The tools have always been there, the craft to use them has been lacking.... till now...

I think many saying that aren't as confident. Fa cup this season they said. Mourinho found norwich too much of a hurdle to get over. Although I do feel more confident with mourinho in a 1 off cup game against a top team. It just seems the lesser teams suprise us.

 

[scott]

No we would have progressed further in the Cups if we had taken them seriously. I have already addressed that as a potential pitfall of the Europa League.

i have also addressed the possibility of a bigger team dropping into the EL, but as that hasn't happened in the past two years and would likely mean that team is having a poor season and not likely as big a threat then it really shouldn't be that concerning. The chances of a fully firing Liverpool/City/AM/Chelsea/United finishing 3rd in their CL group is fairly small.

Also, since your big thing seems to be competing for top 4 if we are worried about playing Chelsea or United in the late stages of the EL then I don't see how you expect us to finish top 4.

I would also say that "being brave" to back us to win is far from guaranteeing anything. If one of those teams drop it makes it tougher to win but far from impossible. It is also a terrible reason to not want to play in EL or try to win.

I don't expect us to get top 4 or win anything unfortunately. A good draw in the league cup or FA cup seems our best hope. Not sure what is best in the grand scheme anymore. As we weaken our domestic cup chances even more if we prioritise EL & league. So there's an argument for that being a bad idea.

 

[SpiderSpurs]

I think many saying that aren't as confident. Fa cup this season they said. Mourinho found norwich too much of a hurdle to get over. Although I do feel more confident with mourinho in a 1 off cup game against a top team. It just seems the lesser teams suprise us.

Do you think Norwich would have beaten us post lockdown?

 

[Igula]

I don't expect us to get top 4 or win anything unfortunately. A good draw in the league cup or FA cup seems our best hope. Not sure what is best in the grand scheme anymore. As we weaken our domestic cup chances even more if we prioritise EL & league. So there's an argument for that being a bad idea.

I think of all the Cups Europa should be the priority as that is a trophy plus CL next season.

 

[spursmalc]

Yeah, some good points. Another theory is that we are too weak to get top 4 so let's prioritise the europa anyway. It would be a better way to get CL qualification.
I get what you are saying about such & such team should beat this europa team. But we should have been able to beat norwich & sheffield united but couldn't. So I don't like going down that route. Even palace who had lost 7 on the trot were too strong for us to overcome.

Clearly we were too weak to get Top 4 this season. However as you say we had some disasters including injuries and yet we were only 7 points away from top 4. The season started dreadfully but since Mourinho was appointed results put us in 4th place. Therefore it would appear it would not take a much better season to get top 4 and yet it should not need much improvement to be in contention. The players now know what Mourinho wants and if we can improve in the transfer market even though we know we will not spend big then we will be in the hunt for top4.

 

[hiatus]

I wanted us in Europa if we couldn't make the CL, and it's a trophy worth winning.

But man, the Thursday-Sunday slog is going to get old quick for me. The squad loses a lot of the flexibility/advantages of playing Tuesday/Wednesday going into the weekend.