Ange Postecoglou

[manmountainbutters]

Ughhh, okay… I’ll try to keep it short.

1. I’ve not enjoyed one single minute of the football we played this year. We regressed greatly and it doesn’t look better than the shit served in the previous season, with a possession stat padding.
2. The tactics don’t seem to work and I think they won’t work even if we buy better players.
3. He’s not improved any players individually, otherwise you’d not see so many desperate attempts to save face that he needs loads of players in the summer.
4. Doesn’t look like he wants to adapt to the amount of tiny little things you have to consider in this league.
5. Haven’t given young players a chance.

As for the other question, I think there are lots of managers out there who would get a better tune out of the current team: Marco Rose (at Leipzig, Klopp influenced), Marco Silva (Fulham), Amorim (Sporting), Inzaghi (Inter, unlikely he’d leave though).

Yeah, I'm not Ange out at this point, but there is a lot of truth in your points.

Earlier this season many on us on this forum were saying how Madders, Biss, Sarr, and Bent was one of the best two or three midfield line-ups in the league. Does Ange have no responsibility for the collapse in performances by all four?

 

[AussieYiddo]

Stop lying. A lot of the losers did, yes. But a lot of fans who are more interested in seeing our club winning said absolutely no such thing.

55% of this poll ticked 'exciting football and squad refresh'

Competition - Hopes for the 2023/24 season? 🤔

So, the pain is over again for another season...... till August! No European football to side track us, so what are your hopes and/or your fears for next season?

thefightingcock.co.uk

Most of the comments basically wanting to look forward to a Spurs game again and play more exciting football.

 

[JimothyCF14]

That wasn't the point of Zin's post.

he was saying that even the greatest managers have things that you can use to diminish their achievements if you are inclined that way.

If you win things, you win them.

Backfires a bit, because SAF's numbers in Scotland are absolutely staggering when you consider who he managed and there's no escaping it. His achievements in Scotland will never, ever be surpassed. Bringing them into a discussion about Ange is always going to get the same response.

 

[Richard Arlison]

The one blip in SAF's career was the early part at Man U. Which of course is somewhat analogous to where Ange is right now. I would stress tho that SAF arrived at Man U having pulled off an almost incredible managerial feat over a few years at Aberdeen. Ange has a decent CV, but nowhere close to SAF on arrival in Div 1.

How many times have Australians have managed in Europe's top leagues?

About as many times as Aberdeen have won the UEFA Cup.

Ange doesn't have a decent CV, he has a CV that has never been done before, that's better than decent.

Not saying he's going to be SAF but as you say the early struggles were worth sticking it out for UTD and they are for us with Ange.

 

[Richard Arlison]

Backfires a bit, because SAF's numbers in Scotland are absolutely staggering when you consider who he managed and there's no escaping it. His achievements in Scotland will never, ever be surpassed. Bringing them into a discussion about Ange is always going to get the same response.

just replied but what Ange has done just to be here has also never been done before:

How many times have Australians have managed in Europe's top leagues?

About as many times as Aberdeen have won the UEFA Cup.

Ange doesn't have a decent CV, he has a CV that has never been done before, that's better than decent.

Not saying he's going to be SAF but as you say the early struggles were worth sticking it out for UTD and they are for us with Ange.

 

[Malibu]

In the four leagues Ange has coached, in the second year he has won the title.

Let him do his thing.

I know what will happen if he gets us within a sniff of the title next season, all the doomers on here will be saying "Oh I have always backed Ange, he's a top Manager".

TWP's

We may improve next season but a lot would be dependent on which players we upgrade our starting squad with. We also need to upgrade some of our coaching staff - especially with regard to set pieces.

We can’t keep on buying average players at high fees. Our scouting has to improve from the Ndombele, Gil and Royal days. More due diligence needs to be done when scouting for new players.

I also think that Ange needs a bit more flexibility in his tactics and give more game time (at least 15 or more minutes, if/whenever they are used), to those players with potential from our youth squads - whenever our first teamers are off-form and there isn’t quality cover on the bench. I still believe that we could have salvaged something from the home game against Chelsea, by not playing the defensive highline after going 1, and later, 2 men down - especially after losing both our first choice CBs, in that game.

Remember, Mourinho won silverware at every club since his Porto days until he came here. So nothing is set in stone - even with Ange’s past records at his previous clubs.

But we’re all Spurs fans and we want the best for our club.

 

[Sir Archibald Crooks]

55% of this poll ticked 'exciting football and squad refresh'

Competition - Hopes for the 2023/24 season? 🤔

So, the pain is over again for another season...... till August! No European football to side track us, so what are your hopes and/or your fears for next season?

thefightingcock.co.uk

Most of the comments basically wanting to look forward to a Spurs game again and play more exciting football.

I said i wanted top 6, really good football and a sense we were building something come the end of the season. We'll achieve top 6 but i dont think our football is entertaining and as for building something, we're not much if any further along than 12 months ago. Even Ange seems to agree with talks of player clearouts and new coaching staff. I was happy enough with the appointment but really dissapointed with what we've seen to date.

 

[manmountainbutters]

How many times have Australians have managed in Europe's top leagues?

About as many times as Aberdeen have won the UEFA Cup.

Ange doesn't have a decent CV, he has a CV that has never been done before, that's better than decent.

Not saying he's going to be SAF but as you say the early struggles were worth sticking it out for UTD and they are for us with Ange.

Don't want to labour this, but regarding the level of achievement before arriving in Div1/Prem, SAF was miles ahead. There isn't an "Australian handicap" allowance applied in the PL or any other trophy we might compete for! I do agree Ange has done very well to get where he has got to however.

 

[Auscock]

Yeah and the season after he won the J League they finished 9th or something, no one seems to talk about that for some reason.

Then he went to one of the 2 biggest clubs in Scotland after Rangers had to come up back through the leagues after properly rebuilding.

(Cretin disagreeing with which fact in the above post?)

Read Cretin,
He won the J League and the next year was runner up in the cup.
Isn't Spurs crying out for silverware?
FWP

 

[manmountainbutters]

I said i wanted top 6, really good football and a sense we were building something come the end of the season. We'll achieve top 6 but i dont think our football is entertaining and as for building something, we're not much if any further along than 12 months ago. Even Ange seems to agree with talks of player clearouts and new coaching staff. I was happy enough with the appointment but really dissapointed with what we've seen to date.

How different it would feel if the first half of this season had been the second half!

 

[Tottenham Sean]

How different it would feel if the first half of this season had been the second half!

We would all be looking forward to next campaign a lot more...

 

[False 9]

We're the only big club in world football allergic to winning trophies. Yet our fans turn their noses up at defensive proficiency, the primary way teams actually win titles. Offense wins games, defence wins titles. Maybe one day people will figure this out

 

[Richard Arlison]

55% of this poll ticked 'exciting football and squad refresh'

Competition - Hopes for the 2023/24 season? 🤔

So, the pain is over again for another season...... till August! No European football to side track us, so what are your hopes and/or your fears for next season?

thefightingcock.co.uk

Most of the comments basically wanting to look forward to a Spurs game again and play more exciting football.

And regardless of the convenient revisionism, the football has been a different world for entertainment.

People have forgotten how would destroyingly dull Conte ball was in his first full season. We get men forward on EVERY attack. Not some attacks, every attack and we have scored dramatic late winners all season as well. Even that Liverpool game you never thought we were fully out of itb because we can score in bunches. I don't care if we didn't deserve it over 90mins, that was a blatant penalty for 4-3 on Johnson and then who knows?? That is entertaining.

People saying the football hasn't been better are disingenuous or have really terrible memories.

 

[JimothyCF14]

In the four leagues Ange has coached, in the second year he has won the title.

Let him do his thing.

I know what will happen if he gets us within a sniff of the title next season, all the doomers on here will be saying "Oh I have always backed Ange, he's a top Manager".

TWP's

I'm getting horrid flashbacks to Jose winning the Europa League every time he'd managed in it. Until he managed us in it.

Patterns like this work until they come into contact with Tottenham Hotspur, and then they get lost in the bermuda triangle of ambition.

That's not all on Ange, of course it isn't but there needs to be a degree of pragmatism sometimes with lineups. We can't have Emerson at LB again this Saturday because he's our only fullback and that's the only way Ange wants to play. We can't. It's not fair on us, the team or Emerson himself.

 

[Richard Arlison]

We're the only big club in world football allergic to winning trophies. Yet our fans turn their noses up at defensive proficiency, the primary way teams actually win titles. Offense wins games, defence wins titles. Maybe one day people will figure this out

Offense can be defense.

We have had one of the best pressing units in the premier league this season. Defending doesn't need to be sitting in a deep block for 90mins. In case I need to remind you, we just had a defensive coach who prioritized defending and we still conceded lots of goals.

There is more than one way to create a team that is tough to score against. We have seen this season that with all the pieces in place and the players confident this system can keep clean sheets.

 

[Shadydan]

We're the only big club in world football allergic to winning trophies. Yet our fans turn their noses up at defensive proficiency, the primary way teams actually win titles. Offense wins games, defence wins titles. Maybe one day people will figure this out

I dunno mate, maybe because this team isn't in it's final form just yet?

Last year our fans were screaming for an attacking coach because we were boring, well now we have him so we can't have it both ways.

What fans didn't bank on is that whilst attacking footy is all fun and games it kinda takes more than a season to get the balance right, it might be a time to chill and show a bit of patience I reckon.

 

[Deuterz]

I dunno mate, maybe because this team isn't in it's final form just yet?

Last year our fans were screaming for an attacking coach because we were boring, well now we have him so we can't have it both ways.

What fans didn't bank on is that whilst attacking footy is all fun and games it kinda takes more than a season to get the balance right, it might be a time to chill and show a bit of patience I reckon.

We are shit going forward as well.

What balance?

 

[Hotspurpaul]

Ah yes, in the couple of months since I've joined the team has been flying, playing brilliant football and giving me hope that we can actually progress towards challenging for trophies all over seen by a tactically adept and prove competitor at this level, so much to be positive about.

It's not like it's been terribly boring, sterile possession based football overseen by a man clearly out of his depth, with the team getting progressively worse and playing as less than the sum of their parts, how dare I not get in line and mindlessly cheer the new saviour?

Just let me know the daily quota of positivity needed to prove my support to a nobody on the internet.

??......we're all nobodys on the internet, no?..
Are you some sort of famous cunt that i aint heard of then?.....

 

[Maureen]

It’s arrogant.

It’s not really the attacking style mentality as such. As dippers attacked us with gay abandon but were able to press and and play high up as well. Thing is look at ya and robbo they stay wide not coming into midfield. They get into good crossing positions and when they need to defend they are already out wide. Not having to make up 20/30 yards to catch the oppo wide player. Look at our FBs they are forever having to play catch up from the middle of the pitch to run out wide to “close down”. It ain’t going to work. Also the whole team needs to press. How can they stop us getting out of our own half yet they Waltzed through our team from back to front?

 

[Tomo]

If we dont have the players to play that way then why not try something different? Again good Tottenham managers are flexible in their approach, ones wedded to a system like Hoddle or Conte tend to not last long.

Why is it better to plough on getting spanked when you know the players dont fit the system? Not buying that he's getting them used to it, good chance that a lot will be gone in the summer anyway so if he's insistant on the same system why not pick Donley or Moore for a few games. Players that will be around in the future. Picking Emerson and bringing on Bryan Gil is just muddled thinking, between picking up points here and now and thinking of the future and doing neither.

Problem with flexible managers like Redknapp or Jol is for various reasons the ceiling on that football limits the future. Pep and Klopp will make minor changes but mostly are very inflexible with their principles, Pep won’t change the system for Kalvin Philips, even supernatural talents like Haaland have to bend to a good degree.

If we can’t support a ‘system’ manager who wants plan A to be perfect and to build an elite team to make it happen then we can’t support glory in modern football. We will be forever 4-8th in a perpetual ground hog day. Fixing the club isn’t just getting tight arse Levy to spend, it’s also breaking down the mental aspects that limit us.

A ‘flexible’ manager might be a great short term solution but it fixes none of the underlying issues.