• The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...

    Get involved!

Manager Ange Postecoglou

Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports

Was sacking Ange a good idea?

  • Yes, I think it was a good idea.

    Votes: 73 64.6%

  • No, I think it was a bad idea.

    Votes: 40 35.4%
  • Total voters
    113
manmountainbutters said:
Re-read my post. MF AND attack.

I don't regard Odobert (unproven, played a few games), and Moore (played a few games, unproven) and Richie as constituting "excessive" injuries to MF and attack. Looks like a pretty normal load of injuries to me.

As per my post, across MF and attack, we've have very few injuries to:

Solanke
Werner
Son
Johnson
Sarr
Maddison
Kulusevski
Bissouma
Bentancur
Bergvall
Lankshear
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Odobert and Moore being injured means you have to persist with Werner and an out of form Son/Johnson - you miss the point about injuries, it's not just about key players be missing, it's about having the options to rest and rotate accordingly especially in a period where you're playing back to back, it's relative - Richy being injured means you can't rest Solanke.
 
WillWilliams said:
Our record at the emirates is appalling. Almost as bad as Stamford bridge. 1 win there in the league since they moved there. 2006. Almost 20 years!!
Doesn’t matter who the manager is we just don’t turn get over the line there.

But we managed to get a draw there last season under Ange. So there is some hope!!

Problem is we know they won’t play to our strengths.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We almost won there last season too. Which for us ... counts as a win!
 
manmountainbutters said:
Re-read my post. MF AND attack.

I don't regard Odobert (unproven, played a few games), and Moore (played a few games, unproven) and Richie as constituting "excessive" injuries to MF and attack. Looks like a pretty normal load of injuries to me.

As per my post, across MF and attack, we've have very few injuries to:

Solanke
Werner
Son
Johnson
Sarr
Maddison
Kulusevski
Bissouma
Bentancur
Bergvall
Lankshear

So despite your post - that was evidently based on a mis-reading of my post - I repeat ... we have not had an excessive (i.e. abnormal in this context) load of injuries across MF and attack.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

MF - you are right - Attack you are wrong.

Midfield and Attack are different positions and should be treated as such.
 
Dudski said:
I don't agree that fans turned on him early or, in many cases, at all. The surprising aspect is that it took so long for any criticism to begin. Go back through posts in calendar years 2023 and 2024 and there was little or no criticism of the manager.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Because those, and there are many, who believe charm and self-belief should be supported to the very end.
Time and time again with results and verbal twaddle in press conferences he has shown he is way out of his depth.
This guy Foster could see through him and anyone who knows how a good con man operates, knows charm and self-belief are 2 of the basic attributes needed to pull off a scam!
 
dudu said:
Were we struggling to find consistency in a very competitive league - absolutely - pretty much the same as everyone else bar Liverpool.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Moved reply to the right thread.

I'm not having any of this. We drew Leicester and lost to Ipswich and Palace before the injuries. That's 1 point from matches against clubs currently 15th, 18th, and 19th. With a healthy squad.

I'm so tired of people trying to characterize Ange's struggles as a result of the injuries. Aside from an odd result (City), the results have been poor. The close of last season after the injuries was very poor. He can't manage at this level. He's capable of the odd shock, but he's getting Ramos level results with the 5th or 6th most expensive squad in England.

He's just not good. And we're just going to continue to fail as long as we persist with the fraud.
 
Richard Arlison said:
Incomplete_usernam Incomplete_usernam

If anything that period of form was more important to finishing 5th than the first 10 games.

2ppg pretty much matches Poch's best seasons btw. And we beat all the types of teams that people are frustrated by us not beating in this half of the season.

It's never as straight forward, black and white as the narrative paints. Football is 11 humans against 11 other humans, there's way too many variables to even bother trying to rationalize it into the simple narratives that people seem to need to feel comfortable under. The reality is that it's the most complicated, simple game in the world and that's why it's the beautiful game.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Fair play and thank you for actually providing evidence.

That run from match weeks 16 to 32 was solid and crucial to finishing 5th. Averaging over 2 points per game during that stretch is impressive and does align with Poch’s best seasons, as you pointed out. It’s also true that we took care of the type of games that usually trip us up, not denying that either.

That said, while the narrative about our form after the first 10 games might oversimplify things (and after seeing you provide this evidence I rescind my opinion on that) I’d argue there’s another narrative worth considering: our form SINCE match week 32.

Extending to the end of last season, our points-per-game average dropped to 1.74, with just 7 points from the final 6 games (W2 D1 L3).

And this season as you already know, 24 points from 20 games, averaging just 1.20 points per game with a record of (W7 D3 L10).

That’s a significant decline and you cannot simply blame injuries on that form as the losses were happening BEFORE injuries and continuing from the previous season, were they not?

So, can we agree that while the period you highlighted deserves praise and you were correct about the 16 game run, it also marks the peak before a noticeable downward trend?

Football might be beautifully complicated, but the numbers don’t lie—they tell a story of a team on a downward trajectory mate.
 
I watched the Barcodes last night and was struck by how much Eddie Howe influenced the match.

If we were two nil up away to Woolwich in the first leg after an hour, would Ange take off our main striker and bolster the defence, bringing on some grafters? No, he wouldn’t. He would keep on, right up until the point the third Woolwich injury time goal went in.

I’m not arguing for boring defensive football, but it was illuminating watching a manager change tactics and think bigger picture, instead of just sticking to plan A.
 
Seven Sisters said:
I watched the Barcodes last night and was struck by how much Eddie Howe influenced the match.

If we were two nil up away to Woolwich in the first leg after an hour, would Ange take off our main striker and bolster the defence, bringing on some grafters? No, he wouldn’t. He would keep on, right up until the point the third Woolwich injury time goal went in.

I’m not arguing for boring defensive football, but it was illuminating watching a manager change tactics and think bigger picture, instead of just sticking to plan A.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Howe also adapts to who he's playing.

People mistakenly think we keep losing to them despite "outplaying them"

Once maybe. 3 times in a row?.
They're happy playing with or without the ball and they are adequately prepped for game to game.
 
Nobody3 said:
Because those, and there are many, who believe charm and self-belief should be supported to the very end.
Time and time again with results and verbal twaddle in press conferences he has shown he is way out of his depth.
This guy Foster could see through him and anyone who knows how a good con man operates, knows charm and self-belief are 2 of the basic attributes needed to pull off a scam!
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
He has great sales skills. The question is whether he has convinced himself his system will work, or if he's talked himself into a job and is coming to realize it won't. The third option is to think he really has cracked the code and is going to bring innovations that have a lasting impact. My guess is he's gotten one step too far in his career, but I'm no expert. It's interesting to think that maybe he is onto some good ideas but needs to adapt to make them work. If he had a stronger coaching staff and a trusted lieutenant to bounce ideas off of he would probably have a better chance of success.
 
Matt1882 said:
Howe also adapts to who he's playing.

People mistakenly think we keep losing to them despite "outplaying them"

Once maybe. 3 times in a row?.
They're happy playing with or without the ball and they are adequately prepped for game to game.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Ange defenders don't seem to understand that in the macro you are what the table says you are, and if you're losing then you aren't outplaying your opposition.

There are no points for possession or having the better of the chances. None for winning the first 60 minutes, nor for winning the first 20 minutes after halftime. None for staying true to who you are and doggedly refusing to adjust to the situation on the pitch.

Players are properly judged by individual performances, managers by the table. We think we're a top 6 club but we've got the 12th best manager at most. Probably worse, when you consider the clubs ahead of us and what their talent levels and wage bills are.

I don't care to hear any more moaning about the injury crisis, we are likely to deliver the same thin broth every time out no matter who's playing.
 
kcspurs said:
Ange defenders don't seem to understand that in the macro you are what the table says you are, and if you're losing then you aren't outplaying your opposition.

There are no points for possession or having the better of the chances. None for winning the first 60 minutes, nor for winning the first 20 minutes after halftime. None for staying true to who you are and doggedly refusing to adjust to the situation on the pitch.

Players are properly judged by individual performances, managers by the table. We think we're a top 6 club but we've got the 12th best manager at most. Probably worse, when you consider the clubs ahead of us and what their talent levels and wage bills are.

I don't care to hear any more moaning about the injury crisis, we are likely to deliver the same thin broth every time out no matter who's playing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We're not even winning the "better chances" league anymore either.

You know the difference to us playing well, and say when Chelsea and Liverpool played well against us?
We played "well" second half against Newcastle and.....didn't score......and had a few half chances.
Chelsea ran us so ragged we gave away 2 penalties and scored a further 2.
Liverpool scored SIX fucking goals.

That's playing well. Not passing the ball around the outside of the box dithering from left to right trying to create your one and only goal scoring position.
 
Ange Postecoglou says even in-form Liverpool forward Mohamed Salah would find life a struggle at the moment in the Tottenham team he manages.

Spurs are set to face the Reds in the first leg of their Carabao Cup semi-final on Wednesday (20:00 GMT), during a difficult run of form.

Tottenham have lost three and drawn one of their past four matches, including a 6-3 Premier League defeat by Liverpool on 22 December.

Egypt international Salah scored twice in that game and has netted 21 goals from 27 appearances in all competitions during a particularly eye-catching campaign.

However, under-pressure Postecoglou believes even having an "unbelievable player" in Salah at his disposal would have done little to improve their fortunes.

"Mo is a world-class player, but if you put him in our team now I'm not sure he'll have that same level of performance because of the situation we're in as a group," said the Spurs boss.

"His attacking play, who do you need? You need a team that's kind of in good form, creating opportunities, playing on the front foot, having a really solid foundation of a defence that is cohesive. None of these things exist at the moment."
 
Matt1882 said:
We're not even winning the "better chances" league anymore either.

You know the difference to us playing well, and say when Chelsea and Liverpool played well against us?
We played "well" second half against Newcastle and.....didn't score......and had a few half chances.
Chelsea ran us so ragged we gave away 2 penalties and scored a further 2.
Liverpool scored SIX fucking goals.

That's playing well. Not passing the ball around the outside of the box dithering from left to right trying to create your one and only goal scoring position.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Exactly why I expect us to get a paddling today. A team like Liverpool isn't going to be bullied into playing our way. We can't impose our will on another side unless there's a lack of talent or a lack of discipline (basically, unless they have the problems we often exhibit), and Liverpool is unlikely to have a day like that. We won't play any other way, so the hope lies in individual errors by the opponent or the miraculous.
 
Spaniel said:
"Mo is a world-class player, but if you put him in our team now I'm not sure he'll have that same level of performance because of the situation we're in as a group," said the Spurs boss.

"His attacking play, who do you need? You need a team that's kind of in good form, creating opportunities, playing on the front foot, having a really solid foundation of a defence that is cohesive. None of these things exist at the moment."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
"Not even a world class striker could score for my team" is quite an admission.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top