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Article A small plea for Poch

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gibbs131 said:
Cahspur is a grass is greener fan. He wants all change and the truth is Dembele would put half the players he wants in in the dirt if played opposite each other.

Whatever team is doing well, he will want to emulate them. Whatever player is scoring last season he will want to sign them. Whatever player of the month like Kono is in the news he wants it.

If that Dembele vs Utd game just happened, he would want him signed right now because of the hype that generated.

My point is we HAVE those players. And it's not the Dembele's that have ruined our season despite being injured. What we have not had is a manager worth a shit. I don't want to move on another KPB, GDS etc because previous managers mismanaged.

If he gets his way: The gypsy feel we have from players will continue. We will have no identity because players have no affinity for us because of the grass is greener brigade wanting the flavor of the month.

There is absolute dross at the club like Rose who has almost zero ability that should be moved on first. The players with proven ability against the best should be retained and start to gel with the mercurial talent like Lamela and Eriksen.

We know Ade has the ability. We know Dembele has the ability. Now all pointers are positive that Poch can improve players. So the potential is there...We just need to start calling more players like this Yiddo. It would make the world of difference to see how the Jans and Paulinho's would fall in love with the club instead of looking dispondent and all being cold pro's.
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Your allegations toward me are untrue, every single one of them and you know it, and they do nothing but suggest you've not taken the time to consider any of the points given to you. Entering a forum or think tank and criticizing one of the members' points while confessing you are ignorant on the topic at hand only serves to show your blatant disrespect for not only other people but the very fabric of due process of logic. Your accusations were invalidated from the start, and you've done nothing but continue ridiculous accusations based from your own misinterpretations, and all this after my countless attempts to try and be civil with you as well as invite you to private discussion.

Your rudeness and unwillingness to learn from anyone here is a cancer to this board. I can only hope that some day you find it within yourself to find humility, and then from that first step possibly continue towards becoming a valued member of this board.
 
cahspur said:
Your allegations toward me are untrue, every single one of them and you know it
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You want to change nearly half the outfield players in the starting 11. Including Ade and Paulinho.

In 70 prem games Ade has been involved in 47 prem goals. Either scored or assisted. And that is him playing poorly for a whole season. He's had one bad prem season his whole career. But you see the grass is greener for a player who has had 1 good prem season in his whole career. You also want to take away Paulinho's goals and well rounded engine.

Do you know how many players we have signed from having a great season for goals? Siggy, Soldado, Lamela are RECENT ones but the the list goes on and on and on. Pav, Bent, Bentley etc? Also the prem is rife with players on goal sprees who end up being god awful in another club.

I've been talking to fans like you on message boards for over a decade who think we need to go after the flavor of the year. I was one of them back in the day until history taught me how hype can backfire.

Heskey, Andy Carroll, Ibrahimovich, Shevchenko, Veron were slam dunks back in the day. So much can go wrong, it's not even a discussion. You DONT sell.replace your players who are performing. Esp for one season wonders in the prem or minnows/flavor of the month like you have.
 
gibbs131 said:
You want to change nearly half the outfield players in the starting 11. Including Ade and Paulinho.

In 70 prem games Ade has been involved in 47 prem goals. Either scored or assisted. And that is him playing poorly for a whole season. He's had one bad prem season his whole career. But you see the grass is greener for a player who has had 1 good prem season in his whole career. You also want to take away Paulinho's goals and well rounded engine.

Do you know how many players we have signed from having a great season for goals? Siggy, Soldado, Lamela are RECENT ones but the the list goes on and on and on. Pav, Bent, Bentley etc? Also the prem is rife with players on goal sprees who end up being god awful in another club.

I've been talking to fans like you on message boards for over a decade who think we need to go after the flavor of the year. I was one of them back in the day until history taught me how hype can backfire.

Heskey, Andy Carroll, Ibrahimovich, Shevchenko, Veron were slam dunks back in the day. So much can go wrong, it's not even a discussion. You DONT sell.replace your players who are performing. Esp for one season wonders in the prem or minnows/flavor of the month like you have.
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This does nothing but suggest you've not read my rationale for why in any scenario, and preemptively jumped to conclusions.

On an even more basic level, did you not notice Paulinho was in that starting lineup I expected under Poch? Or we're you too busy with your amusingly desperate tirade that you failed to notice it? And as for my rationale for any of it, you've merely suggested you cannot even begin to comprehend why those selections are made, you just jump to your own manipulated and unsubstantiated conclusions.

"Flavor of the year" :levylol: Get that nonsensical bullshit outta here. I was on here pushing for Kono well before he became a popular trend in the Spurs community, and if I was as you suggest I'd be clambering for Ricardo Rodriguez at left back or Fabian Schar at center back with the rest who are more preoccupied with finding the best possible options rather than finding the most conducive. I've put time into understanding tactics, trends of player compatibility to our league, and the traits that allow them to do so and my points reflect this, while you refuse to even read articles posted for you with purely informational intent.

You are blissful ignorance incarnate, spread nothing but manipulated bullshit in desperate attempts to deceive, and offer nothing useful to this board with your refusal to appropriately interact with any given situation.

I cannot believe that you saw that we were discussing the viability of Dembele in Poch's system, you would admit to refusing to understand Poch's system, and then drastically fail to appropriately correspond to the topic by discussing the mere quality of the player instead while dropping personal insults in the process. That is just a violation of due process of logic to the highest degree. Simply nothing short of shocking. You have insulted every philosopher that ever walked this earth with such antics, and the classical Greek fathers with their stepwise algorithms towards finding Truth in particular. You ought to be ashamed of yourself. :disdain:
 
cahspur said:
For sure. Given the work rate of Schneiderlin and Wanyama (when he was healthy), our CM's are gonna have to bust it in every single game if they want to keep their places. It's for this reason why I'd like to see Poch promised time, as I think him punishing quality players who don't give it their all by cutting back on minutes will only work for the best in the long run. His style is very demanding of effort, so if they're not giving it all I'd rather a kid have a run about if he'll do the work.
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When you put it like that its hard not to imagine Holtby finally finding his place
 
I have to be hoenst, I think a fit Dembele could thrive in Pochettinos system, playing the slightly more advanced of the 2 at the base of midfield. Scheiderlins role.

If fit Ive no concerns over his pace or anything. He is a rare player in that he can genuinely boss a midfield. And has proven with Sandro in a similar position that as a pair they are about as good as it gets. Sandro sitting, Dembele bossing. Love it.

If I have a concern about him in that role its his passing. Or more the speed of his passing. He holds the ball a little too long for my liking for that position.

However, with, say, Eriksen right in front, Lamela or Chadli available and Ade ahead (not to mention Full Backs getting up) I would hope Pochettino can make sure Dembele always has a simple pass to a more capable player.

Movement / runners was always the achilles heel in AVBs system for me. Players just stopping, and not moving on and making space, or a passing opportunity. Had AVB cracked that I genuinely think we could have done what Liverpool did, we really werent far off.

That was with Dembele and Sandro in a midfield two, and without a balanced or inventive attack. If Pochettino can solve that puzzle (and his Southampton set up suggests he can) then I would be delighted to see Dembele in the team in that position.

Also - IF FIT - Ive no concerns over Sandro in that deeper position, none at all. However I do have big concerns about the IF FIT element with him.
 
I have a love/hate opinion of Dembele. Love his, strength on the ball. His combativeness and his work rate when 100% fit. And he can score, when played higher up the pitch. But this is the hate bit. He is,nt "fluid" enough for me. The argument against this is, in a system where he has more options to find a team mate, then he would be more fluid in his play. Never had that with a AVB system. And TS, played him deep. These would be good arguments against my accusations of him. But I just feel, his natural game, is when he receives the ball, his first instinct is to hold on to it and work to find an out, when maybe it was already available! If he played, instinctively more with his head up, then the earlier ball, even a simple one would be the better option. And with Pochettino's expected style, I,m not sure where Dembele fits? Having said that, if Tino can get him or the system of play, can
get him playing with his head up more and therefore in a more fluid style, then Dembele would become a world class mid-filed player for me!

COYS!!
 
cahspur said:
Lennon, Siggy, Dawson, Dembele, and Sandro
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Lennon to me has the work rate, just has no guidance, if The Potch can guide him to the ways of completing a cross :kaboullol: then he'll do well under his system. However if not then it will cause a lot more work for the team that will be tired sooner in the early season due to his pressure and training.
Siggy goes missing in games and then scores a cracker, agree with you here.
Dawson is someone I've already said in other topics.
Dembele is a work horse, I have to disagree here. He has a bit of everything, tuned well and not injured he'll thrive under The Potch.
Sandro needs to come back from injury well in order to fit, I don't want to think about the contrary. :walkercry:

Friedel can't handle a high line.
Naughton will do well under the system.
Townsend needs to be less greedy or will fail under it.
If Soldado can improve his confidence he will get scoring.:townhmm:
 
cahspur said:
Your rudeness and unwillingness to learn from anyone here is a cancer to this board. I can only hope that some day you find it within yourself to find humility, and then from that first step possibly continue towards becoming a valued member of this board.
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He's a catalyst of discussion, far from a cancer. Just because he does type mostly bollocks, it doesn't mean he isn't a valuable member. :adeohshit:
 
moley said:
He's a catalyst of discussion, far from a cancer. Just because he does type mostly bollocks, it doesn't mean he isn't a valuable member. :adeohshit:
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Your humanity for this poster is most commendable!
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cahspur said:
On an even more basic level, did you not notice Paulinho was in that starting lineup I expected under Poch?
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I'm going from other information you have put out there. Like 100's of posts in the Paulinho thread. You are the who's who of anti Paulinho posters. "You want to get rid of Paulinho" is a fact.

Reasons: Grass is greener. Wages and transfer fee put to better use.
 
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Lister said:
However, with, say, Eriksen right in front, Lamela or Chadli available and Ade ahead (not to mention Full Backs getting up) I would hope Pochettino can make sure Dembele always has a simple pass to a more capable player.
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What I like from Chadli in the second half of the season was he did not fade. Some teams would blow out their lungs by the 70th and he is still pretty much ticking like he was in the 10th.

That is why him and Paulhino will be important for us over a long season. Its that kind of of grit we need IMO. The same things we got from Dembele and Sandro (after a slow Sandro start) last year.

If we give Chadli more of a solid foundation, he can be a dark horse for goals and assists IMO. If he's babysitting more kids like Rose or Naughton then he'll get poor reviews regardless.
 
I think it might have been yesterday I was saying - really didnt "see it" with Chadli at all all season.

Then around the Benfica game (Newcastle was about then wasnt it?) he gave a glimpse of what he can do and suddenly Im very curious about what he can produce this season.
 
Lister said:
I think it might have been yesterday I was saying - really didnt "see it" with Chadli at all all season.

Then around the Benfica game (Newcastle was about then wasnt it?) he gave a glimpse of what he can do and suddenly Im very curious about what he can produce this season.
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Its his position that confuses me like Siggy. Neither are real wingers as they are not mobile/quick enough, they don't dominte the centre so are not CM's, perhaps number 10's or free players in a 4-3-3 type formation?
 
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