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Player Archie Gray

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Zomb said:
Hahahaha I can’t say with some level of certainty that as promising as Gray is, he will never be as good as Carrick
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Different kind of player. Gray seems like he will be an overall better athlete than Carrick was, if nothing else.

Bit of a weird comment though- the kid is 18 and the sky is still the limit with him. I have trouble understanding why a real Spurs fan would be reveling in putting down one of our younger players.
 
bk_spur said:
Different kind of player. Gray seems like he will be an overall better athlete than Carrick was, if nothing else.

Bit of a weird comment though- the kid is 18 and the sky is still the limit with him. I have trouble understanding why a real Spurs fan would be reveling in putting down one of our younger players.
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Not putting him down - agree he’s a better athlete but Carrick was criminally underrated and if he achieves half of what Carrick did, then we have a gem
 
spurs9 said:
At the same age Gray is now, Carrick was struggling to get into Swindon and, then in the second half of the season, Birmingham's sides out on loan.
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He was a skinny, lanky Bambi like teenager, yes. Gray is the opposite and far more of an early developer

Are you suggesting this means he will continue to improve (Gray) and reach levels above Carrick?
 
Zomb said:
He was a skinny, lanky Bambi like teenager, yes. Gray is the opposite and far more of an early developer

Are you suggesting this means he will continue to improve (Gray) and reach levels above Carrick?
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Carrick was no less lanky or "bambi like" playing for us than he was at Swindon or Birmingham.

No, I'm suggesting you couldn't possibly say he will never reach Carrick levels, since he is a better player at the same age.
 
VonnegutBusy said:
Bergvall looked the more impressive during pre-season but Gray now looks much further along.

Would have no qualms with Gray starting PL games at this point.
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nicoclaesen said:
Bergvall has it mate. He’s special too.
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I did not watch pre-season games, but from competitive football, I feel that Gray is two heads above Bergvall.

I see his touch, movement and awareness as being EPL ready while Lucas has been nowhere near it.
Between Gray, Moore and Bergvall - I feel that first two would deserve some serious time, but Lucas has to prove himself much more against lesser opposition before.
 
TheSpurEst said:
I did not watch pre-season games, but from competitive football, I feel that Gray is two heads above Bergvall.

I see his touch, movement and awareness as being EPL ready while Lucas has been nowhere near it.
Between Gray, Moore and Bergvall - I feel that first two would deserve some serious time, but Lucas has to prove himself much more against lesser opposition before.
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Gray has played more this season than Bergvall, and although its been at RB CB and even LB, its all good experience - plus of course he played 40+ games last season in Championship which is a much more highly rated than the Swedish league where Bergvall played less games last season, and has played les this season.

So no surprise the less experienced Bergvall has a bigger gap between the league last season and this season in PL to bridge than Gray - and that's a big difference between him and Gray now.

If Bergvall continues to get minutes in EL and other games he will gradually bridge the gap to becoming a PL level player, we just need to give him time to get the experience such that his talent can come through


.
 
Spursidol said:
Gray has played more this season than Bergvall, and although its been at RB CB and even LB, its all good experience - plus of course he played 40+ games last season in Championship which is a much more highly rated than the Swedish league where Bergvall played less games last season, and has played les this season.

So no surprise the less experienced Bergvall has a bigger gap between the league last season and this season in PL to bridge than Gray - and that's a big difference between him and Gray now.

If Bergvall continues to get minutes in EL and other games he will gradually bridge the gap to becoming a PL level player, we just need to give him time to get the experience such that his talent can come through


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Does Berg have talent though? He’s looked poor and I have more faith in Devine who looked absolutely sharp as a tack in pre season - every inch the kind of player that looks better, with better players.

Obv Bergs young age means you can’t answer my question for 4-5 years, I guess my point is why was he kept on? His age or the fee?
 
Zomb said:
Does Berg have talent though? He’s looked poor and I have more faith in Devine who looked absolutely sharp as a tack in pre season - every inch the kind of player that looks better, with better players.

Obv Bergs young age means you can’t answer my question for 4-5 years, I guess my point is why was he kept on? His age or the fee?
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Bergvall is a very different midfielder to Devine in being a 'flair'/creative player and although its early days likely to be an 8/10 hybrid more in the mould of Maddison or Kulusevski or even a Bentancur when he is playing more forward. At the moment I think Bergvall is finding PL players think and move more quickly than he has been used to in Sweden and he is being caught out by that. I'm sure he's adapting, but it might be next season before we see him having adjusted and he'll then look a good player - how good we'll need to wait and see as even next season at aged 19 we will not see the finished player.

Devine is much more of a 'gritty' player who can certainly play as a no 8/10 with excellent short and long passing which can create chances, but he's also able to drop back into a 'deep lying' creative player' /no 6 role perhaps closest player I can think of being a Michael Carrick but slightly less finesse and more able to look after himself if necessary (eg Devine as a 16 year old making his u21 debut, Chelsea's England midfielder Danny Drinkwater then in his mid 20's decided to 'take liberties' with Devine. After a 2nd incident, Drinkwater was howling on the ground ...... I think Devine's rugby league playing father had taught him some of the 'black arts'). Devine looked very capable last preseason and I think it was 50/50 whether he stayed at Spurs or had another loan to get more first team experience at Westerlo : I think Devine will be a useful addition to first team next season (or even January) categorised as a List B u21 so increasing the size of the squad, rather than taking up a squad place.
 
Spursidol said:
Bergvall is a very different midfielder to Devine in being a 'flair'/creative player and although its early days likely to be an 8/10 hybrid more in the mould of Maddison or Kulusevski or even a Bentancur when he is playing more forward. At the moment I think Bergvall is finding PL players think and move more quickly than he has been used to in Sweden and he is being caught out by that. I'm sure he's adapting, but it might be next season before we see him having adjusted and he'll then look a good player - how good we'll need to wait and see as even next season at aged 19 we will not see the finished player.

Devine is much more of a 'gritty' player who can certainly play as a no 8/10 with excellent short and long passing which can create chances, but he's also able to drop back into a 'deep lying' creative player' /no 6 role perhaps closest player I can think of being a Michael Carrick but slightly less finesse and more able to look after himself if necessary (eg Devine as a 16 year old making his u21 debut, Chelsea's England midfielder Danny Drinkwater then in his mid 20's decided to 'take liberties' with Devine. After a 2nd incident, Drinkwater was howling on the ground ...... I think Devine's rugby league playing father had taught him some of the 'black arts'). Devine looked very capable last preseason and I think it was 50/50 whether he stayed at Spurs or had another loan to get more first team experience at Westerlo : I think Devine will be a useful addition to first team next season (or even January) categorised as a List B u21 so increasing the size of the squad, rather than taking up a squad place.
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Devine looks sharp and gritty - agree with all of that. Certainly not a clogger, he can play and at worse i expect a fee > Winks - ideally he becomes a first teamer
 
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Surely Archie deserves the Steve Archibald chant for himself now...?

"We'll take more care of you, Archie Gray, Archie Gray!"

Could catch on!
 
TheSpurEst said:
I did not watch pre-season games, but from competitive football, I feel that Gray is two heads above Bergvall.

I see his touch, movement and awareness as being EPL ready while Lucas has been nowhere near it.
Between Gray, Moore and Bergvall - I feel that first two would deserve some serious time, but Lucas has to prove himself much more against lesser opposition before.
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Despite what they both said on intstabookX, I think Vocario's outburst has affected Bergvall's confidence.
 
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