Carlos Vinicius

[HampshireSpur]

Llorente's situation was different, he was a proven player at the highest level and shouldn't have been ignored so much.

Vinicius has never played at this level and has to do a lot more to convince that he is ready. With all the cup games coming up he should be able to show what he can do against a more testing set of opponents than the dross we played in the EL (which he didn't do that well against). Like Bale, if he wants to play in the league he first has to stand out against lesser teams.

I enjoy reading your posts and you come across as one of the sensible ones on here, but I disagree with this.

When Vinny's played he's at least looked useful, pressing the oppo, setting up goals and scoring a few. He could work on his finishing but I've seen enough to think he's worth more minutes than he is getting. Obviously he's second fiddle to Kane and Son but he should definitely be getting a look in with all of the cup games coming up.

 

[StripiestPilot]

I enjoy reading your posts and you come across as one of the sensible ones on here, but I disagree with this.

When Vinny's played he's at least looked useful, pressing the oppo, setting up goals and scoring a few. He could work on his finishing but I've seen enough to think he's worth more minutes than he is getting. Obviously he's second fiddle to Kane and Son but he should definitely be getting a look in with all of the cup games coming up.

I agree that he definitely deserves a few more minutes in the league. If the team had been performing better and killing matches off I think we would have seen more of him, but when we are labouring at 1-0 Mourinho's nature is to minimise risks, which means leaving Kane on not turning to an unproven player.

It's not easy for any striker to take league minutes away from Kane or force the manager to play with two strikers. Hopefully tonight he shows what he can do.

 

[HampshireSpur]

I agree that he definitely deserves a few more minutes in the league. If the team had been performing better and killing matches off I think we would have seen more of him, but when we are labouring at 1-0 Mourinho's nature is to minimise risks, which means leaving Kane on not turning to an unproven player.

It's not easy for any striker to take league minutes away from Kane or force the manager to play with two strikers. Hopefully tonight he shows what he can do.

My own view is Vinny could play with Kane or Son as they do different things. He could be a target man with Kane as a deeper '10' and using his passing range. I would like to see this at a few points but Mourinho is pretty cautious so I doubt you will see two out and out strikers much.

 

[Sonofa]

Bit of a funny one as I think he was mainly bought in to give Kane a rest in the cups, and to come in if the worst happened and he picked up an injury. Don't think theres much chance of him working himself into the starting 11 in the league unless we get an injury to somebody.

You can only beat whats in front of you and think he's not let anyone down when he has played. Equally not set the world on fire.

 

[skywalker68]

Bit of a funny one as I think he was mainly bought in to give Kane a rest in the cups, and to come in if the worst happened and he picked up an injury. Don't think theres much chance of him working himself into the starting 11 in the league unless we get an injury to somebody.

You can only beat whats in front of you and think he's not let anyone down when he has played. Equally not set the world on fire.

Think he needs time to settle before we really judge

 

[stevee]

I enjoy reading your posts and you come across as one of the sensible ones on here, but I disagree with this.

When Vinny's played he's at least looked useful, pressing the oppo, setting up goals and scoring a few. He could work on his finishing but I've seen enough to think he's worth more minutes than he is getting. Obviously he's second fiddle to Kane and Son but he should definitely be getting a look in with all of the cup games coming up.

I think he's looked very good so far, albeit against lower opposition.
Obviously cant' judge as a PL player as he's only had 24 minutes in total, but int the cup games he's been fine.

EL
5 apps, 3 goals, 3 assists

FA Cup
1 app, 3 goals (fair enough, Marine)

EFL Cup
1 app, nothing

Total

7 app, 6 goals, 3 assists.

I'd take that.

 

[sudoku]

Offside a lot so far tonight.

 

[The Swellhead Spur]

Didn't work for him today but put a shift in

 

[El flaco]

He plays like a converted centre half. His movement is terrible.

 

[Andersen]

He is not cut out for the big leagues. Shampoo ship.

 

[Totti]

6 goals and 3 assists in 497 minutes this season (About 5 and a half games).

Just like Llorente, he's producing when given the chance, but not given enough oppertunities because he has one of the worlds best strikers in front of him.

It genuinely doesn't matter who our back up striker is. Fernando Llorente, Carlos Vinicius, Danny Ings... they have Harry Kane in front of them and we never play 2 up front, meaning their minutes are limited.

If we ever want a back up striker to get more games, then he'll have to also be able to play as a wide forward quite successfully. In the same way Man Utd could play any of Greenwood, Martial or Rashford up top but mostly out wide.

 

[El Magnifico]

6 goals and 3 assists in 497 minutes this season (About 5 and a half games).

Just like Llorente, he's producing when given the chance, but not given enough oppertunities because he has one of the worlds best strikers in front of him.

It genuinely doesn't matter who our back up striker is. Fernando Llorente, Carlos Vinicius, Danny Ings... they have Harry Kane in front of them and we never play 2 up front, meaning their minutes are limited.

If we ever want a back up striker to get more games, then he'll have to also be able to play as a wide forward quite successfully. In the same way Man Utd could play any of Greenwood, Martial or Rashford up top but mostly out wide.

I think a young striker will also need the minutes to develop, and we might actually be better off signing an old warhorse (like Giroud, Cavani), who can perform when needed.

Also agree on the need to go for a WF/CF than a pure CF

 

[TheSpurEst]

6 goals and 3 assists in 497 minutes this season (About 5 and a half games).

Just like Llorente, he's producing when given the chance, but not given enough oppertunities because he has one of the worlds best strikers in front of him.

It genuinely doesn't matter who our back up striker is. Fernando Llorente, Carlos Vinicius, Danny Ings... they have Harry Kane in front of them and we never play 2 up front, meaning their minutes are limited.

If we ever want a back up striker to get more games, then he'll have to also be able to play as a wide forward quite successfully. In the same way Man Utd could play any of Greenwood, Martial or Rashford up top but mostly out wide.

FFS another case of when stats are looked at absolute isolation and all of the context has been removed. Two fundamentally important points -

1) His contribution -
- 3 against 8th level side. These guys are full amateurs. Yet people keep banging that drum. Did you watch the game? Did you see how he passed it to the net?
- 2 goals + 1 assist against Ludogorets - Bulgarian league side who lost every single Europa League game with GD of -12 (!)
- 2 assists against 4th team in Austrian Bundesliga

By whatever way you look at it, 5 goals + 1 assists have been scored against teams that ... I am not sure how to end the sentence... lets just stick with term "half professional".
Is that really standard to rate a Spurs player?!?

2) Whoever comes out with "you can only beat what is in front of you" - NO. That is absolute crap. You can prove your worth to the team in training and earn chances against stronger sides. His total tally of minutes is not some kind of magical mistreatment of him. It is reflection of his quality or lack of it.

Though he had earned enough credit against so weak sides that he was trusted to start in FA cup against weakest side in Championship. But he failed to build up on that. And apart from taking ball down during 1st or 2nd minute, essentially all of this touches after that were poor or bad (I would like to see video with all of his involvements actually). He never threatened the goal of Championship last team (!) while for the most part we were in absolute control and attacking players had a lot of room to do so. And he never really set up other team-mates well enough either. I remember that in 2nd half he took the ball down, but the pass to teammate was hopelessly weak and inaccurate. There were more than 1 times where he failed to time his run to avoid offside, but despite earlier start he still did not arrive to the ball before the defender (!) if that is not a warning sign I don't know what is.

When he joined, I was also hoping that he could be someone who could help to take pressure off Kane. And I still hope he actually gets up to speed with us. But yesterdays display was very bad and it eroded large chunk of this hope from me. I will happily eat my words if he will actually prove me wrong and can actually step up with goals or assists against any team even close to EPL level.
But as things stand, I am quite certain that his spell with us will last for one season and not a second longer.

 

[Totti]

FFS another case of when stats are looked at absolute isolation and all of the context has been removed. Two fundamentally important points -

1) His contribution -
- 3 against 8th level side. These guys are full amateurs. Yet people keep banging that drum. Did you watch the game? Did you see how he passed it to the net?
- 2 goals + 1 assist against Ludogorets - Bulgarian league side who lost every single Europa League game with GD of -12 (!)
- 2 assists against 4th team in Austrian Bundesliga

By whatever way you look at it, 5 goals + 1 assists have been scored against teams that ... I am not sure how to end the sentence... lets just stick with term "half professional".
Is that really standard to rate a Spurs player?!?

2) Whoever comes out with "you can only beat what is in front of you" - NO. That is absolute crap. You can prove your worth to the team in training and earn chances against stronger sides. His total tally of minutes is not some kind of magical mistreatment of him. It is reflection of his quality or lack of it.

Though he had earned enough credit against so weak sides that he was trusted to start in FA cup against weakest side in Championship. But he failed to build up on that. And apart from taking ball down during 1st or 2nd minute, essentially all of this touches after that were poor or bad (I would like to see video with all of his involvements actually). He never threatened the goal of Championship last team (!) while for the most part we were in absolute control and attacking players had a lot of room to do so. And he never really set up other team-mates well enough either. I remember that in 2nd half he took the ball down, but the pass to teammate was hopelessly weak and inaccurate. There were more than 1 times where he failed to time his run to avoid offside, but despite earlier start he still did not arrive to the ball before the defender (!) if that is not a warning sign I don't know what is.

When he joined, I was also hoping that he could be someone who could help to take pressure off Kane. And I still hope he actually gets up to speed with us. But yesterdays display was very bad and it eroded large chunk of this hope from me. I will happily eat my words if he will actually prove me wrong and can actually step up with goals or assists against any team even close to EPL level.
But as things stand, I am quite certain that his spell with us will last for one season and not a second longer.

The stats were more to show that he hasn't actually been given an oppertunity at all. Not highlighting his goals and assists.

You can only score against the team put infront of you.

Or were you expecting plenty of goals and assists in the whopping 24 minutes he's played over 4 games in the league?

I don't expect him to be here next year. Not because of his ability, or even his fee. But because he'd be fucking stupid to waste his career.

 

[Sir Archibald Crooks]

If people like Ally Gold are to be believed he was who Mourinho really wanted. Seems bloody odd he hasnt really given him a chance. I certainly dont see us spending £40m to make it permanent, doubt we'd do it for half that. Another summer of looking for a back up striker incoming.

 

[Nikesh]

Llorente's situation was different, he was a proven player at the highest level and shouldn't have been ignored so much.

Vinicius has never played at this level and has to do a lot more to convince that he is ready. With all the cup games coming up he should be able to show what he can do against a more testing set of opponents than the dross we played in the EL (which he didn't do that well against). Like Bale, if he wants to play in the league he first has to stand out against lesser teams.

didnt think he did that in our recent cup games including yesterday. Can't see us making him permanent in the summer.

 

[VonnegutBusy]

Don't think we make it permanent unless he goes on a crazy run somehow or is thrown in at the deep end due to injuries (heaven forbid).

If we do bid it will be nowhere near £40m either.

I think he is a decent deputy but is basically untested against good opposition so hard to say whether he is good enough for that role long-term or not.

 

[ChiversRegal]

The back up strikers job at our club is just bollocks, it really is. It's a thankless task, if you haven't banged in a couple of goals in the odd appearance after 60 minutes then off you come to be replaced by Kane. Posters saying Bale needs minutes but this guy is supposed to be up to speed and impressing with hardly any minutes on the pitch ( and no i'm not comparing him to Bale, just his situation ).
Danny Ings would be a mug to come here and spend his time sitting on his arse on the bench, he would get the same shit thrown at him if he doesn't bang the goals in on his few appearances or god forbid has an underpar performance.
Divok Origi has a champions League winners medal but i wouldn't want him as a back up striker.
The lad needs some patience and perseverance from us fans. No one is going to pay 40 mill for him so there's probably a deal to be done if we're still interested at the end of the season.

 

[bk_spur]

Idk about others but as just about any other team in the league I'd be glad to buy this guy for 40m including bonuses. I don't know if he has quite played enough yet, but it's not his fault, and when I've seen him he's always looked pretty good. I think if he were a starter and taking some pens for whoever he'd easily be a 20 and 10 striker. But... Kane.

As long as Kane is around Vini will never quite get enough time. A combo CF/WF type player would be able to get a lot more minutes and be a better fit for us overall.

 

[Spursidol]

He's done the basics of what Spurs brought him in to do - played 5 of the 6 EL matches and scoring/assisting enough (with others) to ensure Kane was given a decent rest, although not quite convincing enough so Kane started against Antwerp.

Likewise he played in a couple of other cup games - last night against Wycombe he wasn't good enough in the first 60 minutes so was subbed for Kane. But at least Kane only played 30 minutes.

Big step up from the Portuguese to playing PL, and whilst Vinicius is doing 'ok' in EL and domestic cups, he's rarely saying 'pick me' (other than the hattrick v non league Marine).

I hope he makes a bigger impression in the 2nd half of the season, as there are plenty of games that Kane doesn't need to play in but based on the first half season, I'm not optimistic, so think he will play as much in the 2nd half as the first half of the season.

However even with what he's done in the first half season , he's given Kane a reasonable respite, so for that I'm grateful, but do not think he will be here next season ? .