Eric Dier

[mikes01666]

Eric was fantastic v Burnley on Saturday. IMOe isn't fit enough at the moment to do 2 a week but Jose wants to get him match fit.
He won't play v Wolves.

I'm afraid our respective definitions of 'fantastic' differ fantastically.

He was OK at best versus Burnley (Burnley!!) and did many (not all) of the things expected of an £80K a week PL footballer.

Other than that he's been consistently woeful - a caricature of his former excellent past. Someone dining out (!) on past performances. Rather like Dele for a long time - but he appears to have turned a corner and is playing consistently well.

 

[mikes01666]

How long do. We give you?

You've been posting negative shite on a daily basis for well over a year now.....

Probably needs a poll.... Will Mike ever post anything positive?

I'm afraid you're mixing me up with someone else. Check the post above re. Dele.

I can't see anything negative about asking how long it takes to achieve match fitness. I've suggested four games on the bounce. And your contribution to this discussion is...?

 

[RomanzoCriminale]

I'm afraid you're mixing me up with someone else. Check the post above re. Dele.

I can't see anything negative about asking how long it takes to achieve match fitness. I've suggested four games on the bounce. And your contribution to this discussion is...?

I believe in giving a player more than 4 or 5 fucking games before throwing him under a bus, especially one that's been injured and ill for a long time. I don't believe in slagging different players off every week because they have a bad game.

 

[mikes01666]

I believe in giving a player more than 4 or 5 fucking games before throwing him under a bus, especially one that's been injured and ill for a long time. I don't believe in slagging different players off every week because they have a bad game.

Nor do I. However the discussion was about regaining match fitness, not form.

As my post above says, four games in quick succession should see a player approaching match fitness.

You really are making this up. From memory, Lamela was the last Spurs player I took issue with.

Universal support for our team and players unless they turn in non-performances like yesterday, Burnley, Everton etc etc.

Anyway, I'm not here to defend my posting history - more important things to do.

Additionally I do not post every day!

 

[Reidy]

Of course Mourinho isn't the man for us. He's a short term fix.

The question is, what sort of fix is he.

The other question is, if Poch had lost the dressing room and players weren't playing under him, why did we go with a short term fix (who obviously was ready to start literally at a moment's notice...hmmm) why didn't we go all out for the next manager who could build a strategy over a number of years.

 

[StripiestPilot]

How many games do we give him?

I think I'm right in thinking he's played in all Mourinho's games? That makes four on the bounce - he should be approaching match fitness.

It shouldn't take more than this, and yet yesterday he just lumbered around without an apparent care in the world.

I've got this feeling that he'll play against Wolves and turn in another woeful performance. Skipp may be an answer but I don't think he'll get a chance before Middlesborough.

He didn't even have a preseason due to that emergency operation he had when they found something wrong on his first day back, he needs more than 2 weeks and 5 matches to reach his best condition. You only have to look at him to see he is clearly too heavy.

I'm not making excuses for him but you can't expect someone who has only just returned to the starting XI after a year of injuries and ilness to reach their peak form 2 weeks after a new manager turns up. By all accounts the training has become less intense since Mou came in so he's going to need time.

 

[Hairy Cane]

Watch the Coutinho goal again. Dier is barely putting forth an effort when BM attackers are running amuck.
Jogging around likes he’s in warm ups.

:mourfacepalm:

 

[Clynelish]

Watch the Coutinho goal again. Dier is barely putting forth an effort when BM attackers are running amuck.
Jogging around likes he’s in warm ups.

:mourfacepalm:

More a lack of ability rather than effort, but still very sad to see one of our players like that in the Champions League.

I don't question his mentality.

 

[Claud601]

Used to be a great player but now he's joined the ranks of players that need to be cleared out. The team needs a new cdm so badly

 

[Wallander]

This is a guy who would continously play a washed Matic because he had a hard on for him.

I wouldn't count on him ousting Dier so quickly.

I remember very well when Ivanovic was being roasted by every left winger in the league and Mourinho stuck by him to the very end. Fellaini being hated by the United fans but loved by the manager was weird too. I think if you're in his good books it will take an extraordinary turn of events for him to give up on you but if you're in his bad books he'll not take notice of you (Schweinsteiger, De Bruyne).

The fact is Dier was someone he wanted to sign for big money two summers ago. In Poch's book he recounted a story when Dier and Mourinho were embracing before a game at OT. If we sold him the supporters would have gone into meltdown. It's easy to say now we should have cashed in. Dier was a very good player at that time but his mobility has sharply deteriorated. If you want to play CM you have to be able to cover ground and be sharp on the turn. He can't anymore. But he could make a good CB where his passing suddenly goes from totally ordinary for a CM to quite good for a CB.

 

[NorseYid]

Some of the criticism is way OTT.

He was a lynchpin of our best modern day team. The physicality is compromised, but he is no worse as a footballer.

Good news is, that physical shape can be rebuilt.

I am quite suprised about some of the bile around here, when players like Sissoko, Aurier and Lamela over the lenght and costs over their contracts have been absolutely stealing a living around here.

 

[Freundian slip]

I remember very well when Ivanovic was being roasted by every left winger in the league and Mourinho stuck by him to the very end. Fellaini being hated by the United fans but loved by the manager was weird too. I think if you're in his good books it will take an extraordinary turn of events for him to give up on you but if you're in his bad books he'll not take notice of you (Schweinsteiger, De Bruyne).

The fact is Dier was someone he wanted to sign for big money two summers ago. In Poch's book he recounted a story when Dier and Mourinho were embracing before a game at OT. If we sold him the supporters would have gone into meltdown. It's easy to say now we should have cashed in. Dier was a very good player at that time but his mobility has sharply deteriorated. If you want to play CM you have to be able to cover ground and be sharp on the turn. He can't anymore. But he could make a good CB where his passing suddenly goes from totally ordinary for a CM to quite good for a CB.

Don't you think he's looking a bit sharper each week in the prem though? Thought he looked terrible when he first came back and last night wasn't a fair reflection, up against three proper top midfielders with a half baked team around you and away from home = nightmare.

 

[mikes01666]

He didn't even have a preseason due to that emergency operation he had when they found something wrong on his first day back, he needs more than 2 weeks and 5 matches to reach his best condition. You only have to look at him to see he is clearly too heavy.

I'm not making excuses for him but you can't expect someone who has only just returned to the starting XI after a year of injuries and ilness to reach their peak form 2 weeks after a new manager turns up. By all accounts the training has become less intense since Mou came in so he's going to need time.

Pre-season was in July.

He's been training for the last couple of months but not playing under Pochettino.

Mourinho has chosen him, so he's had a run of games - he should be approaching match fitness.

My view is that four games in quick succsession should see him approaching match fitness. How many would you give him? 10, 20? Come on give us a number.

 

[Wallander]

Don't you think he's looking a bit sharper each week in the prem though? Thought he looked terrible when he first came back and last night wasn't a fair reflection, up against three proper top midfielders with a half baked team around you and away from home = nightmare.

Not sure I agree to be honest. We still look very susceptible defensively. Ideally we'd have someone like peak Wanyama who can protect the defence and turn defence into attack. Maybe Mourinho throwing Vic on last night was a sign that his chance will be next? I think he has a clear idea of his best eleven minus the two in CM.

 

[Freundian slip]

Not sure I agree to be honest. We still look very susceptible defensively. Ideally we'd have someone like peak Wanyama who can protect the defence and turn defence into attack. Maybe Mourinho throwing Vic on last night was a sign that his chance will be next? I think he has a clear idea of his best eleven minus the two in CM.

Yeah possibly, guess he just needs to get one of them firing, I've got more hope of Dier getting back to full fitness than Vic but who knows...

 

[Airfixx]

How many games do we give him?

I think I'm right in thinking he's played in all Mourinho's games? That makes four on the bounce - he should be approaching match fitness.

It shouldn't take more than this, and yet yesterday he just lumbered around without an apparent care in the world.

I've got this feeling that he'll play against Wolves and turn in another woeful performance. Skipp may be an answer but I don't think he'll get a chance before Middlesborough.

Luckily, we as fans have the luxury of not having to make that call.

As for 4 games..... Is that in any way an informed opinion? Personally, the view from my armchair doesn't afford me that kind of insight into health and fitness rehabilitation at an elite sporting level.

Edit: Apparently MindNumb is either compelled to know or is in fact a fitness expert..... Curious.

 

[TheSpurEst]

Some of the criticism is way OTT.

He was a lynchpin of our best modern day team. The physicality is compromised, but he is no worse as a footballer.

Good news is, that physical shape can be rebuilt.

I am quite suprised about some of the bile around here, when players like Sissoko, Aurier and Lamela over the lenght and costs over their contracts have been absolutely stealing a living around here.

You are kidding, right?
Cause I had to double check the meaning of the term -

Lynchpin - one that serves to hold together parts or elements that exist or function as a unit

It is true he was everpresent this season. But he was never someone that was holding anything together.
This was the season when Moussa Dembele played 29 matches for us... here, look at his playing. That man at his day could be called "lynchpin". And Wanyama also played 30 games, he was in good form. It was an awesome team this season, but Dier was even then among weaker links rather than reason of success.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

Or maybe we're not in a transfer window, so the so called miser can't put a bid in? Just a thought....

You keep believing I've seen enough.

 

[Super Jan Fan]

He’s clearly not 100% health-wise. What the root cause is and whether he can get back to the monster he was a few years back I don’t know, but more game time is the way we’ll find out.
Suspect once it becomes clear whether Toby and Jan are actually off soon, we’ll see him revert to CB.

I agree, he looks weak physically. The way he holds himself, it looks like his own body weight is a burden. Font know what is wrong but diesnt look like someone just short of match fitness. He's finished. Why do all our CDMs break?

Palacios (mental)
Sandro (knee)
Wanyama (knee)
Dier (?)

Parker the only one i remember surviving, just old age caught up.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

I agree, he looks weak physically. The way he holds himself, it looks like his own body weight is a burden. Font know what is wrong but diesnt look like someone just short of match fitness. He's finished. Why do all our CDMs break?

Palacios (mental)
Sandro (knee)
Wanyama (knee)
Dier (?)

Parker the only one i remember surviving, just old age caught up.

I'm very sadly inclined to agree, something deeper appears wrong. I would love him to get right....I dont know what the unnamed illness post surgery was but this looks like more than a core fitness issue. Barrios, Zakaria, Rice. Any two from three. I like Dier, Rose, Jan, Victor, and Toby. Pivitol in some wonderful times as a Yid. ALL of them MUST be replaced. All of them are finished at the highest level.