Germany vs England

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We don't have anyone who makes the runs Son does on a regular basis. Sterling will do it occasionally (but playing the same way with him as we do with Son would be a bad idea anyway, he isn't clinical) yet still not enough. Most of our pacey wide players want it to feet so they can dribble.

Rashford would've fit the bill as a Son type player, not as good obviously but a couple of years ago he was looking like a discount Mbappe. Fast, powerful runner, quick feet & good finisher. Now his game has gone to shit.

Son isn't clinical either. He's hot and cold. Let's not pretend that for all the goals he scores, he doesn't also miss chances. He has games where he is absolutely rotten. His numbers would be insane if he scored the majority of the chances he does get. But as a wide player he can be forgiven, and so can Sterling.
 
Son isn't clinical either. He's hot and cold, Let's not pretend that for all the goals he scores, he doesn't also miss chances. His numbers would be insane if he scored the majority of the chances he does get.

Son is insanely clinical. Far more so than someone like Sterling .. come on. He exceeds his xG by a major amount every single season. Obviously he misses chances (he's not a robot) but he scores a higher % of them than most attacking players.

He also scores many you wouldn't expect him to score, which someone like Sterling won't do because whilst he's very good off the ball, his ability to strike the ball is poor.
 
Son is insanely clinical. Far more so than someone like Sterling .. come on. He exceeds his xG by a major amount every single season. Obviously he misses chances (he's not a robot) but he scores a higher % of them than most attacking players.

He also scores many you wouldn't expect him to score, which someone like Sterling won't do because whilst he's very good off the ball, his ability to strike the ball is poor.

Never once said he wasn't more clinical than Sterling. But in my eyes I still wouldn't describe him as someone who is clinical. I can think of numerous sitters he has missed this season off the top of my head without even thinking too hard.

But of course, Son is the best player ever and can do no wrong.
 
An offside goal doesn't count when it's clearly offside., You're clutching at straws a bit there.

Not at all... I'm eager not to place much emphasis on last night, but you keep dragging it back to being a debate that exclusively focuses on that match and won't acknowledge what most see as being a poor first 70mins.

I also never said that Germany didn't have some dangerous moments.

No. You did however say that England were the more threatening. The fact remains Germany could have been out of sight before we showed out teeth.

Just that considering they had almost 70% of the ball, England still had more of them.

(See above.)

And so we should, as I wouldn't swap Kane, Sterling, Foden and Grealish for Werner, Gnabry, Havertz and an ageing Muller. That's for sure.

No-one for a moment said our probelm is not having good attacking players; so this is a completely moot comment... In fact it serves to further the point of the doubters; not yours.

England's performances have been far from great since we beat Ukraine 0-4, in a game I thought we were excellent. You're acting like I've said all is perfect

No I've not..... You're being massively disingenuous by deploying such spin at this juncture. It's not just me that's pointed out to you that you've not been willing to acknowledge valid concerns that don't suit your narrative; not to mention slinging around unfounded, childish barbs about me not being happy unless we lose and making out I"ve been scathing when I really have not been.

You're not accepting of any criticism with regard to England.... Until you're feeling rattled and throwing around your own mid-match that is. The below 'politically' mild concession does little to change that.

and there's not a thing wrong or nothing to improve on, which is nonsense. But the facts are that England rarely lose games, they have one of the best defensive records around and the fact that Southgate hasn't unlocked anything like the true attacking potential of the side yet (perhaps he never will) it can only be a good thing for our national side going forward.
 
Son isn't clinical either. He's hot and cold. Let's not pretend that for all the goals he scores, he doesn't also miss chances. He has games where he is absolutely rotten. His numbers would be insane if he scored the majority of the chances he does get. But as a wide player he can be forgiven, and so can Sterling.

Are you kidding me? :D


This was published Jan 2021 by the way and he's been even more consistent since then

If you're performing well above your XG it means you are scoring chances you should have no right to score which normally means you're taking an extraordinary high amount of chances.
 
Never once said he wasn't more clinical than Sterling. But in my eyes I still wouldn't describe him as someone who is clinical. I can think of numerous sitters he has missed this season off the top of my head without even thinking too hard.

But of course, Son is the best player ever.

Then not a single player currently playing is clinical. Son has got plenty of weaknesses of his own, but ability to finish chances isn't one of them.

And if you think Son is clinical, you think he's the best player ever now? Chill, I don't even think he's the best player on our team, just the best in front of goal ffs.
 
Not at all... I'm eager not to place much emphasis on last night, but you keep dragging it back to being a debate that exclusively focuses on that match and won't acknowledge what most see as being a poor first 70mins.



No. You did however say that England were the more threatening. The fact remains Germany could have been out of sight before we showed out teeth.
hrowing around your own mid-match that is. The below 'politically' mild concession does little to change that.

It wasn't a poor 70 minutes though. We were second best against a good Germany side in their own backyard but at no point were we really hanging on and having our goal peppered. I always felt we were in the game due to us creating chances and moments. But the last 20 minutes or so we were significantly the better side. The first 20 were pretty even too, albeit Germany had more of the ball. So that's 40 minutes of a 90 minute game in which England were at least equal to the Germans.
 
Are you kidding me? :D


This was published Jan 2021 by the way and he's been even more consistent since then

If you're performing well above your XG it means you are scoring chances you should have no right to score which normally means you're taking an extraordinary high amount of chances.

My point is that he still misses chances. As does Kane. As does Sterling. But Sterling's record for England over the last two years is as good as any wide player in football, so calls for him to be dropped after one bad game like he's been shite for months is absolutely ridiculous.
 
Never once said he wasn't more clinical than Sterling. But in my eyes I still wouldn't describe him as someone who is clinical. I can think of numerous sitters he has missed this season off the top of my head without even thinking too hard.

But of course, Son is the best player ever and can do no wrong.

He is clinical though. Backed up by the stats. Kane's missed sitters in the past and I would laugh in the face of any dumbass who said HE wasn't clinical.

My recommendation: Get new eyes!

:harrylol:
 
That's not true though, is it? The fact that you think Hungary played much better than us is complete nonsense. Match stats show that. Your own eyes should show you that. England were poor by what they can and should be capable of but let's not pretend that Hungary dominated the game. They wouldn't have scored without us and/or the referee helping them if they were still playing that game now.

And while Germany did dominate the ball yesterday, they certainly didn't dominate chances created, and for me that's far more important that knocking the ball around in defence and midfield. England created more in the last 15 minutes than Germany did all game.
Yes you're right 2 outstanding performances from the lads. Should of been 6 points from 6 100%. The lads showed a fantastic attitude looked really up for it and interested and outplayed both sides 👍. You use the stats I'll use my eyes thanks.
 
Yes you're right 2 outstanding performances from the lads. Should of been 6 points from 6 100%. The lads showed a fantastic attitude looked really up for it and interested and outplayed both sides 👍. You use the stats I'll use my eyes thanks.

I think you need to check your expectations a little.
 
It wasn't a poor 70 minutes though. We were second best against a good Germany side in their own backyard but at no point were we really hanging on and having our goal peppered. I always felt we were in the game due to us creating chances and moments. But the last 20 minutes or so we were significantly the better side. The first 20 were pretty even too, albeit Germany had more of the ball. So that's 40 minutes of a 90 minute game in which England were at least equal to the Germans.

Yours is the minority take.... Die on that hill if you must.

Again.... I'm more concerned with the bigger picture.
 
It wasn't a poor 70 minutes though. We were second best against a good Germany side in their own backyard but at no point were we really hanging on and having our goal peppered. I always felt we were in the game due to us creating chances and moments. But the last 20 minutes or so we were significantly the better side. The first 20 were pretty even too, albeit Germany had more of the ball. So that's 40 minutes of a 90 minute game in which England were at least equal to the Germans.

What absolute tosh. Blimey, I know you like to be, er, positive, shall we say, about England but you're talking shite here son.

The first 20 minutes were NOT even. England were only ever in the game once Grealish came on lol. Fact, not fiction, please guvnor.

England were second best in that game, by a distance, and frankly the Germans should have converted more than they did.

Obviously I would have preferred an England win to a German win, but let's not re-write history and pretend England were anything other than shite for 70 minutes of that match
 
My point is that he still misses chances. As does Kane. As does Sterling. But Sterling's record for England over the last two years is as good as any wide player in football, so calls for him to be dropped after one bad game like he's been shite for months is absolutely ridiculous.

Everyone misses chances mate

Salah misses chances as does Ronaldo, as does Benzema

That doesn't make them any less clinical because they score a high amount of chances they take.
 
What absolute tosh. Blimey, I know you like to be, er, positive, shall we say, about England but you're talking shite here son.

The first 20 minutes were NOT even. England were only ever in the game once Grealish came on lol. Fact, not fiction, please guvnor.

England were second best in that game, by a distance, and frankly the Germans should have converted more than they did.

Obviously I would have preferred an England win to a German win, but let's not re-write history and pretend England were anything other than shite for 70 minutes of that match

Another who thinks that possession in football is absolutely everything.

Worry about your own shower of shite. You managed to lose against us even when we were absolutely dog shit under Roy Hodgson for fucks sake. :mourpointlaugh:
 
Everyone misses chances mate

Salah misses chances as does Ronaldo, as does Benzema

That doesn't make them any less clinical because they score a high amount of chances they take.

Well I still wouldn't describe him as clinical. His finishing in some games can be world-class, and in others it can make him look like the Asian Matej Vydra. But ultimately he's our second best player, and is a wonderful player.
 
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