I'm gonna be honest with you I can't really argue with that
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I'm always loathe to criticise or second guess the coach, he is with the players day in day out, knows them all inside out and all their foibles but I had a strong hunch for the last week or so that Harry was going to start tonight. In my book it was a calamitous call from Pochettino and I really hope there's no long term fall out from this either with Lucas or the dressing room in general. Harry has not been been fully fit or at his best since he first did the ankle at Bournemouth in March of last year. He's been rushed back too quickly twice already and then again tonight. He's always been a player anyway who needs a run of games under his belt to hit form, even when he's fully fit. The old stat that we joked about every season of not scoring in the month of August. Even when he starts a season in August fully fit he takes 3-4 weeks to get into his stride. Certain players can come in cold at the start of a season or after an injury lay off and hit the ground running first game back. Harry is not one of those players. Look at how we lost possession 10-15 second into the game that led to the penalty. Ball to Harry and Van Dijk barrels through him. That simply wouldn't have happened with a fit Harry on his game.
I hear the point about Lucas probably missing our two best chances on the night, but you'd really wonder what frame of mind he was in after getting dropped on the back of scoring a hat-trick.
I hear the point about Lucas probably missing our two best chances on the night, but you'd really wonder what frame of mind he was in after getting dropped on the back of scoring a hat-trick.
Shit joke, shit post
Fuck the NL. we will get at least 4 points next season (draw at anfield, comfortable win at home).
Scapegoating the loss on starting Kane is bullshit in my opinion. I'm not defending his performance but I think that blaming this for the loss is just looking for an easy explanation to have the result make more sense.
Moura on a hot streak, yes, but this was no time for emotional choices. You go with your best 11 and he is world-class.
Kane was coming back from injury and likely going to be rusty, but what was the excuse for Eriksen, Son or Dele? It honestly seems to me that (in hindsight) starting Lucas in the place of Dele would have been an even better option than swapping out Kane.
Moura on a hot streak, yes, but this was no time for emotional choices. You go with your best 11 and he is world-class.
Kane was coming back from injury and likely going to be rusty, but what was the excuse for Eriksen, Son or Dele? It honestly seems to me that (in hindsight) starting Lucas in the place of Dele would have been an even better option than swapping out Kane.
It's a fair point, but we've seen it countless times already this season and last where Kane and Dele are put in cotton wool and let us down. Woolwich away a classic example. Furthermore, we have seen Kane coming back hinder the team that was in form. Burnley away a good example.
Add to that the fact that playing Lucas from the start meant that, if Lucas wasn't firing, you could sub him for a fresher Kane and Llorente.
Yes, there is no guarantee Lucas would have played well, but there is a guarantee it was the safer option and Poch would have been forgiven more if it did not work out.
Add to the fact that Champions Leagues of the past were won by form players and we sacrificed a few.
In my opinion there were two things Poch could have done to get the best out of Kane for the team. Play a 3-4-3 and sacrifice Eriksen into defensive midfield with Sissoko. Or play Kane on the bench to get the best out of the other players who got us there for two or three months and play Winks and Lucas.
We would have held our hands up and called him a genius if he got it right, but it was a shit decision.
Losing the final meant the lineup would be criticised either way, if Kane starts people would ask why we rushed him back when Lucas scored a hat trick in the semi. If he's on the bench then people ask why we'd leave out our best goalscorer for a squad player who did nothing in the last 2 months except score a hat trick in the semi.
As Poch has said before, if you win then everyone says you are a genius, lose and you are shit. Liverpool took the same gamble as us in using Firmino from the start instead of the semi-final hero Origi, but they won, so nobody will criticise Klopp despite Firmino being utter cack and Liverpool doing nothing except punishing two mistakes. Their overall performance was just as bad as ours and they has an even less sharp centre forward in the starting lineup. But they won, so none of it matters.
As Poch has said before, if you win then everyone says you are a genius, lose and you are shit. Liverpool took the same gamble as us in using Firmino from the start instead of the semi-final hero Origi, but they won, so nobody will criticise Klopp despite Firmino being utter cack and Liverpool doing nothing except punishing two mistakes. Their overall performance was just as bad as ours and they has an even less sharp centre forward in the starting lineup. But they won, so none of it matters.
That's not true. People understand why you start Lucas and it is an easier decision to take him off if the game doesn't go well.
This is true. However, you are missing the point that we were underdogs going into the fight and needed to take advantage of Klopp's mistakes, not excuse our own with his. Poch had to do better than Klopp tactically. He did so with the four at the back and Winks. But the forward line was not clinical and he needs to take responsibility.
Last night was Poch saying that it was more important that Kane got to play the CL final than increasing our odds for winning. To me, and I know a lot of other fans, it was clear as day that if Kane would start he would be bad. It is not something we say now in hindsight. We have seen it so many times in the past.
Furthermore, it seemed that other players got in on their standing with Poch as well. Winks in particular. And Son/Alli over Moura was disastrous. Moura has been playing his heart out some of our games lately while our other offensive players have been stale.
Poch conceded the game with his line-up. One of his biggest faults is that he disregards form and will choose his favourites no matter the circumstances, as long as they are fit.
NB! I love Poch, and I am not one of those who are desperate for titles.
Furthermore, it seemed that other players got in on their standing with Poch as well. Winks in particular. And Son/Alli over Moura was disastrous. Moura has been playing his heart out some of our games lately while our other offensive players have been stale.
Poch conceded the game with his line-up. One of his biggest faults is that he disregards form and will choose his favourites no matter the circumstances, as long as they are fit.
NB! I love Poch, and I am not one of those who are desperate for titles.
Klopp did exactly the same thing with Firmino. Managers go with the players they trust the most, this is normal. Harry Kane is one of the best forwards in the world and our best player. Poch knows more than anyone else about the physical condition and sharpness of the players, if he felt he was ready then he was ready. He just didn't play well, none of our players played well.
Let's not pretend that Lucas made a huge impact when he came on, he had two good chances and fluffed both of them. We win and lose as a team and we didn't do enough as a team to win. It's not about this or that player. We played against one of the best defences in Europe, not against a naive Ajax team who couldn't handle long balls, and neither our playmakers or goalscorers could really disturb them.
My criticism is not a hindsight one. It was a bad decision. I told everyone who said stuff like "You will have Kane ready for the final" in the days leading up to the game that that was a problem, that we would be better off with him being unavailable. I said it as soon as the lineup was released, that ours was bad, that Kane should've definately not started.
It's not a good decision to start Kane. Everytime he has come back from injury he has needed many games to get started. Every season start he has needed several games to get going. Last spring, when he got back from injury, we went from winning to losing. This season, we went from winning to losing. That we would struggle with him going straight into the team from injury shouldn't be a surprise to anyone - it is a historical fact.
Would Poch have been criticised if we lost with Harry Kane starting on the bench? Sure, by some people unable to regard the history and see that it was a good decision. Such is the life of a manager (or a chairman): No matter what you do, some will find a way to criticise it. That should not stop themfrom making good decisions, even if controversial.
Starting Kane was not a good decision. Based on historical evidence, the consequence of it could not come as a surprise to anyone.
I posted several times that Kane should not start. However whilst he did nothing, neither did Eriksen, Dele or Son and it did not really improve when Moura and Llorente came on. Our attacking stars just did not perform or were well controlled by Liverpool's defence. After watching that will Southgate pick Kane who played 90 mins?
The whole match was an anti climax and I really never got excited by the play. Disappointing
The whole match was an anti climax and I really never got excited by the play. Disappointing
Question is why does Poch feel the pressure to select Kane?
People say Moura wasn't great when he came on, but Kane was still on the pitch doing nothing but taking up space. His presence obviously means the others have to be in different spaces, whether or not he's doing anything.
It was the wrong call and obviously Kane can't say "Don't pick me, gaffer." but we've seen this anonymous, useless performance every single time he's been rushed back. Why the fuck then, does Poch keep doing it?
Dropping Moura was a mistake. We may still have lost, but I don't think it would've been as pathetic as what we saw.
People say Moura wasn't great when he came on, but Kane was still on the pitch doing nothing but taking up space. His presence obviously means the others have to be in different spaces, whether or not he's doing anything.
It was the wrong call and obviously Kane can't say "Don't pick me, gaffer." but we've seen this anonymous, useless performance every single time he's been rushed back. Why the fuck then, does Poch keep doing it?
Dropping Moura was a mistake. We may still have lost, but I don't think it would've been as pathetic as what we saw.
This is a good question. I can only think that Poch genuinely believes Kane is one of the best strikers in the world, which is untrue based on last nights performance, or he is really fucking up a lot in his judgement of a 50% Harry Kane being of any value to the team.