Joe Rodon

[TheSpurEst]

I've not said anything of the sort (I'm more than aware that a back 3 doesn't automatically equate to parking the bus thx).

Funny however, that you're considering Skipp & PEH as attacking MFs tho. (Yet; see below)

.....You seem to be overselling your position.



Not sure why you'd say Dele has been a weak link....



We haven't played 3CDMs though.....

1 x DM / 2 x #8s.... 2 of which you're simultaneously describing as AMs (See above).



My point is/was simple..... Against CP i'd like to think our FBs would be given license to attack even without an extra CB.

As per your suggestion; we'd be switching up a working system to accommodate 2 likely rusty CBs rather than 1.

1) Never said that Skipp and PEH are attacking MF's. Specifically said we play 3 CDMs. Just look at the game. Look at their contribution to defense and attack - they all have similar numbers + they constantly keep flat line of 3. I get that some like to remember Alli glory days and how he was creating etc, but this has very little to do with how he plays now.

2) Dele being weak link - against City - all 3 were really good. But look at last two games. Look how much Skipp and PEH were involved and look how little Dele was involved. This also reflects in stats.
Wolves game -
Alli 32 passes 81,3% accuracy, 4 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 2
Skipp 47 passes 83% accuracy, 4 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
PEH 46 passes 81,3% accuracy, 2 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 2
Alli disposessed 4x, Skipp and PEH 0
Watford game -
Alli 33 passes 84,9% accuracy, 0 long balls, 0 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
Skipp 73 passes 93,2% accuracy, 2 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
PEH 91 passes 86,8% accuracy, 14 long balls, 9 accurate, key passes 1, tackles 3
Alli disposessed 3x, Skipp and PEH 0

So he is doing same amount of defensive work than others, but is less involved in build up-play and moving the ball around, he does not create chances and or move the ball upward with any more success, yet he gets disposessed much more than his midfield counterparts - hence - across all 3 games he has been our weakest midfielder by clear margin.

3) How are accommodating 2 rusty CBs when up to now Tanganga has played all games as member of back four and in two of the games he has been doing much more defending then attacking. I don't see it.

 

[Paul Gascoigne]

Please don't get injured, we are dropping like flies !

 

[Airfixx]

1) Never said that Skipp and PEH are attacking MF's. Specifically said we play 3 CDMs.

My mistake.... Looks like I misread your post somewhere. Appologies for that.

Just look at the game. Look at their contribution to defense and attack - they all have similar numbers + they constantly keep flat line of 3.

They're not keeping a flat line of 3.

I maintain what I've said:

1 x #6
2 x #8s

I don't need stats for that.... It's visibly evident that Skip is sat deeper than the other two and that the other two are more commonly found joining the attackers at the edge of the oppo box.

I get that some like to remember Alli glory days and how he was creating etc, but this has very little to do with how he plays now.

Can you please stop straw-manning on me. Much like I haven't said 343 can only be "super defensive"; I have not harked back to anything with regards to Dele's past either.

2) Dele being weak link - against City - all 3 were really good. But look at last two games. Look how much Skipp and PEH were involved and look how little Dele was involved. This also reflects in stats.

OK

Wolves game -
Alli 32 passes 81,3% accuracy, 4 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 2
Skipp 47 passes 83% accuracy, 4 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
PEH 46 passes 81,3% accuracy, 2 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 2

There's LITERALLY nothing between those figures.

1% less passing accuracy and Skipp having 1 more tackle?????

FFS!

This was my point earlier... You're over-egging things without my original comment providing any significant cause to do so.

Alli disposessed 4x, Skipp and PEH 0

What was Dele trying to do when being dispossessed?

Something more progressive than a mere 5 yd pass would be my guess.

Watford game -
Alli 33 passes 84,9% accuracy, 0 long balls, 0 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
Skipp 73 passes 93,2% accuracy, 2 long balls, 1 accurate, key passes 0, tackles 3
PEH 91 passes 86,8% accuracy, 14 long balls, 9 accurate, key passes 1, tackles 3

So he saw a lot less of the ball in this one. I see a player less involved in 1 game out of three..... This hardly constitutes being a clear "weak link" so far this season.

Alli disposessed 3x, Skipp and PEH 0

Again, we're talking about the 1 of the 3 players who actually has the inclination to beat a man himself or try some a bit high risk/high reward.

So he is doing same amount of defensive work than others, but is less involved in build up-play and moving the ball around, he does not create chances and or move the ball upward with any more success, yet he gets disposessed much more than his midfield counterparts - hence - across all 3 games he has been our weakest midfielder by clear margin.

"Accross all 3 games" - Well this is clearly not the case, is it.....? One game out of 3 is far more truthful and even then extreme in the choice of phrasing.

3) How are accommodating 2 rusty CBs when up to now Tanganga has played all games as member of back four and in two of the games he has been doing much more defending then attacking. I don't see it.

Surely I don't need to tell you how different FB and CB are in terms of positioning and responsibilities....?

This is all a bit silly; you genuinely can't see the simple net attacking defecit of taking one of Berg/Lucas/Dele out of the team and replacing him with Joe Rodon? ...In a game where we'd want the FBs to be pushing fwd regardless?

Benteke vs 3CBs when their most (Only?) dangerous player plays on the wing, you'd rather we have 1 genuine wide player on each flank rather than two?

.....A game where we'll likely be reliant upon attacking overloads (or a quick counter involving 1 of our 2 other fwds running ahead of Kane) due to them sitting deep and narrow?



Look, we could bicker about tactics all day; but back to my original and simple point: To change the way we're playing (and more specifically how we line-up) for a game against CP seems drastic and un-necessary to me.

 

[TheSpurEst]

My mistake.... Looks like I misread your post somewhere. Appologies for that.



They're not keeping a flat line of 3.

I maintain what I've said:

1 x #6
2 x #8s

I don't need stats for that.... It's visibly evident that Skip is sat deeper than the other two and that the other two are more commonly found joining the attackers at the edge of the oppo box.



Can you please stop straw-manning on me. Much like I haven't said 343 can only be "super defensive"; I have not harked back to anything with regards to Dele's past either.



OK



There's LITERALLY nothing between those figures.

1% less passing accuracy and Skipp having 1 more tackle?????

FFS!

This was my point earlier... You're over-egging things without my original comment providing any significant cause to do so.



What was Dele trying to do when being dispossessed?

Something more progressive than a mere 5 yd pass would be my guess.



So he saw a lot less of the ball in this one. I see a player less involved in 1 game out of three..... This hardly constitutes being a clear "weak link" so far this season.



Again, we're talking about the 1 of the 3 players who actually has the inclination to beat a man himself or try some a bit high risk/high reward.



"Accross all 3 games" - Well this is clearly not the case, is it.....? One game out of 3 is far more truthful and even then extreme in the choice of phrasing.



Surely I don't need to tell you how different FB and CB are in terms of positioning and responsibilities....?

This is all a bit silly; you genuinely can't see the simple net attacking defecit of taking one of Berg/Lucas/Dele out of the team and replacing him with Joe Rodon? ...In a game where we'd want the FBs to be pushing fwd regardless?

Benteke vs 3CBs when their most (Only?) dangerous player plays on the wing, you'd rather we have 1 genuine wide player on each flank rather than two?

.....A game where we'll likely be reliant upon attacking overloads (or a quick counter involving 1 of our 2 other fwds running ahead of Kane) due to them sitting deep and narrow?



Look, we could bicker about tactics all day; but back to my original and simple point: To change the way we're playing (and more specifically how we line-up) for a game against CP seems drastic and un-necessary to me.

Look, I don't want to go letter by letter.

Just few general points -
- Out of those 7 times disposessed, I can remember like 3 separate occasions when he was either standing or moving way too slowly with the ball and it was just taken from him. That is just poor and giving ball away. Even if he would in fact try to do something creative with the ball as you suggested - then he is doing it very-very poorly. No assists, no key passes, very little long-balls etc. So if he is tasked to be creative part of midfield, he has not delivered on that role at all, while giving ball away and exposing the team.
- It is all nice and dandy to pick the closest differences, but 32 passes with 81% accuracy means 26 accurate passes. Witch means he managed to complete a pass for every 3,5 minutes on the field. Skipp on the other hand with 47 passes and 83% of accuracy translates to 40 successful passes - one successful pass for every 2,25 minutes.
BTW, I corrected slight issue in initial data - PEH pass completion was 93,5% in tha same game. Which means with his 46 passes he completed 43 passes. One for every 2,1 minutes.
The way this looks for me is based on those two games we can make one out of two conclusions -
- conclusion A - Dele Alli was tasked to play similarly as at least one out of two other CMs but did it worse based on the numbers
- conclusion B - Dele Alli was tasked to be creative part of this CM trio and failed in this, cause on upside he did not create anything but on downside contributed with giving ball away 7 times

Either way, up to now he has been poorer of the 3 up to now.
It is not saying that we should write him off for good. Nor that under no circumstance should he start in next game(s). No. All I am saying that in midfield trio PEH, Skipp, Alli, they have been in this order in terms of their overall contribution so far this season.
Hence, if we'd have to pick a player to sacrifice, it would be Dele.

 

[sudoku]

It's the Rodon thread.

 

[Boltonspur]

It's the Rodon thread.

Since when did that matter on TFC?

 

[sudoku]

If you see people ruining threads with off-topic discussion, arguing or personal abuse, use the 'Foul' link at the bottom of their post to vote for them to be sent off. More info

 

[TheSpurEst]

It's the Rodon thread.

And we are discussing matter either it is good idea to sacrifice Alli so that Rodon could have more convinient option of playing in CB trio or not.

Chill, people.
I get that this is not 100% to Rodon topic. But it is also not 100% not related.
If preferred so, I am okay if this post is transferred to some other topic.

 

[Airfixx]

If you see people ruining threads with off-topic discussion, arguing or personal abuse, use the 'Foul' link at the bottom of their post to vote for them to be sent off. More info

Foul me then, but you'd best stay on topic and stop making crap jokes left right and center whilst you're at it.

(Or perhaps if you weren't purposely myopic you'd realise that the talk of Dele extends from whether or not to play RODON in a back 3 on Saturday.)

 

[sudoku]

Joe Rodon an unused sub tonight.
Wales drew 0-0.

 

[spursmalc]

Joe Rodon an unused sub tonight.
Wales drew 0-0.

Glad he did not play as we need him Saturday.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

Glad he did not play as we need him Saturday.

He needs games to get sharp mate we needed him to play

 

[ArcspacE]

Joe Rodon an unused sub tonight.
Wales drew 0-0.

Looks live we've signed another dud

 

[SpursAllTheWay]

Since when did that matter on TFC?

Exactly. Case in point, when KaneDomBadBoy makes every thread a 'We play better without Kane... checkout these stats' thread

 

[FightingIllini]

Did pretty well!

 

[Yiddy]

Never let's the side down. How he hasn't played more for us I don't know. The only real positive for me today was his performance

 

[sudoku]

Thought he was VG today.

 

[JDK]

Thought he was really solid until we went down to 10 and things got out of hand. Impressive because coming in ten minutes to the game it can be tough to get a foothold.

Still think we’ve got a good one here, just needs health and minutes. Minutes might quickly become abundant considering our CB situation.

 

[Ulrika Jonsson]

The Palace third goal wholly sits with Rodon. He was doing a Sissoko point whilst running towards Gallagher who already had 2 Spurs players around him leaving his man Eduoard unmarked.

Very poor defending.

 

[NorseYid]

The Palace third goal wholly sits with Rodon. He was doing a Sissoko point whilst running towards Gallagher who already had 2 Spurs players around him leaving his man Eduoard unmarked.

Very poor defending.

Yup.

He looked good for a while, then fully flapped for the goal.

I don't agree that he's a "dud", but he certainly haven't proved that he is anything but a back seat warmer in the 25 man squad so far.