Jose Mourinho

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It’s always the managers fault isn’t it

Never the useless bunch of clowns on the pitch or those responsible for assembling a team of the aforementioned clowns

It’s practically Pochettino’s team though. Sorry but it’s absolutely absurd to say the manager is at fault when he’s restricted to the limitations compiled together prior to his hire, bar a loaned youngster and a perm that is clearly pretty good.

Jose gets more time for me, anything less than the feast of this season and next is selling a manager with a glittering managerial career far, far too short for personal agendas if you ask me. (Not directed at you, more a tangent based on other responses as I see what you’re getting at)
 
No. Not an "expectation" and certainly not "every game" (that's obtuse of you!) but if one is to be objective about whether or not Poch fixed our mentality it's only right that one considers the crunch games... Rather be the proverbial bridesmaid than stuck at the back of the church unseated with all the plebs, but if our mentality was "fixed" then we would have delivered at crunch time; at least once.

You can relax; in conceding to this point it doesn't mean you have to in turn shower Jose with praise.
I get what you are trying to say and I wasn't attempting to be obtuse, when we lost to West Ham we were on a club record of wins I believe which is why I said it.

I still stand by the fact that a "crunch" game is different for different reasons. West Ham's win yesterday was a crunch game, it might have kept them in the league, does this mean they have a better mentality than say us? Or if they lose the next crunch game (which means the next game) does that put them back in the weak mentality bracket?

Is a relegation game a greater test of mentality than a semi-final or final? If you are playing against the Champions elect and are effectively the underdog and you lose in a final, is that crunch game less of a crunch game than if you were the favourites?

Liverpool got knocked out of League Cup and FA Cup early the past couple of years what does that make of their mentality? Or is mentality only measured to semi-finals and finals? If so what is the mentality of those teams that don't even get to a quarter-final?

My position is if you are regularly getting to semi-finals and finals and are competing at the top end of the league then there isn't too much wrong with the mentality. And to bring this back to this team today, they have achieved those things I don't see mentality as the issue.
 
So Guido 🇺🇦 Guido 🇺🇦 it's clear you've made up your mind about the guy and I know it's hard to be objective in such cases (like me with Aurier who I think is fucking dross) but you wouldn't even give him at least a full season to see what happens? I'm certainly no Jose fan and have been underwhelmed thus far, but I'm finding it hard to fully condemn him when he inherited such a mess and will give him a season albeit just one
 
So Guido 🇺🇦 Guido 🇺🇦 it's clear you've made up your mind about the guy and I know it's hard to be objective in such cases (like me with Aurier who I think is fucking dross) but you wouldn't even give him at least a full season to see what happens? I'm certainly no Jose fan and have been underwhelmed thus far, but I'm finding it hard to fully condemn him when he inherited such a mess and will give him a season albeit just one
Didn't want him here from the get-go. But to park that reason for a second, so assuming that I didn't have this view and I wanted him here, all I can say is I've seen nothing from him that I want to see in my Spurs team.

I have tried to be consistent by saying this season is not about results but how we play. What building blocks is he putting in place, the foundations that underpin this side, something that we can see?
The only influence I can see that shows work on the training field has been what we do off the ball (excluding this game tonight of course). We are showing signs of control, some players know their roles and what's expected. There is effort off the ball to drop into shape and keep spaces compact.

The last two games we've had the ball, or perhaps more to the point that we've played two sides that want the ball less than us. However, I much prefer us to have the ball than to sit in a low or medium block and look to frustrate teams but there is a flaw in this logic and that's we aren't doing a great deal with the ball when we have it.

So the only signs that can be talked about in a positive sense i.e signs that there's been coaching have been centred around what we do when we are out of possession. There is absolutely zero influence from him in how we attack, other than pushing Aurier up the pitch in a wonky 3-3-3-1.

I simply can't get behind this. It's not how the best teams in the world play, it's not how the well-coached lesser teams play. Because of this, I can't get behind it. I can't see how this team playing like this, without any respectable attacking phases demonstrated (other than to get Aurire to cross) we are going to compete.

He has at his disposal one of Europes best-attacking players (Kane, Son, Dele, Bergwijn, Lucas, Ndombele, Lamela, Lo Celso) we should be getting 15'ish shots away each game, we should be an attacking side (Still with problems in central/defensive midfield to fix).

If he was showing his influence on the attacking side to his game then there is reason to give him time. We look like we did under Sherwood (and he had a win % that would blow Jose's out of the water). We have no identity. I would have expected to have seen some evidence of this by now.
 
Concerned about the shite approach to games but still willing to reserve judgement on a manager that’s had one January window, took over in November under the circumstances he did and then had this whole weird season.

One thing is for sure though that this squad is done, and has been for ages. The last manager saw to that, and people living off the scraps of 2016 are delusional.

Star players are playing like squad fillers and that’s the issue........at least Jose was prepared to sell Eriksen and drop Dele though and can see Ndombele for useless 60M lump of lard that he is. What manager actually chased that for 2 years and bought him for 60M instead of 18?
Oh yeah....

Hopefully in time Kane will also see a stint on the bench and the likes of Lloris etc moved on.

Id be happy to see us play the kids and benchwarmers from here on in.
Use this season as an extra pre season.

Jose is getting all wrong with the tools he has, and that’s no one else’s fault.
But the tools are fucking blunt to be fair.
 
Concerned about the shite approach to games but still willing to reserve judgement on a manager that’s had one January window, took over in November under the circumstances he did and then had this whole weird season.

One thing is for sure though that this squad is done, and has been for ages. The last manager saw to that, and people living off the scraps of 2016 are delusional.

Star players are playing like squad fillers and that’s the issue........at least Jose was prepared to sell Eriksen and drop Dele though and can see Ndombele for useless 60M lump of lard that he is. What manager actually chased that for 2 years and bought him for 60M instead of 18?
Oh yeah....

Hopefully in time Kane will also see a stint on the bench and the likes of Lloris etc moved on.

Id be happy to see us play the kids and benchwarmers from here on in.
Use this season as an extra pre season.

Jose is getting all wrong with the tools he has, and that’s no one else’s fault.
But the tools are fucking blunt to be fair.

And this is one of the problems. Like you I would like to see him play kids more. But there is no chance of that because Mourinho doesn’t seem to be interested in developing our young talent. Look at what Lampard has had to do during Chelski’s transfer ban. I am not saying that they are world beaters at the moment and as against W Ham they are a group of young players that can still have off days, but ignoring Abramovichs money which teams future looks rosier? Is it the team who has stuck with players on their way down or is it the team who has given their young players game time and experience?
This has impacts on not only the development of our young players but also on our ability to attract quality youngsters to the club. What is the point in joining Spurs’ under 23 set up or coming through the academy if you are unlikely to develop further by being given first team chances. Skipp and Parrot etc should all be getting minutes. I know Tanganga was before he got injured but he seems to be the exception to the rule.
 
Aside from that, you look at the squad and it's a mix of a few good but not world class players (Son, ?) a couple of promising young talents (Lo Celso, Bergjwin), mid-table standard players (Winks, Davies, Dier) players with questionable attitudes (Aurier, Ndombele) and those who at times barely belong on a football pitch (Sissoko, Sanchez, Lucas).

So, our White players are mid table standard and our Black players have bad attitudes and don't belong on a football pitch.

Right oh.

It's rather interesting that most fans see Lo Celso as excellent, hard working and first name on the team sheet. Meanwhile, Ndombele is lazy, bad attitude, fat, unfit.

GLC - 0 goals. 0 assists in 21 games.
Ndombele - 2 goals, 2 assists in 19 games (most of which as a sub).
 
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We are genuinely a massive pull for a Manager, they have all the conditions for them to succeed.

My concern that I simply can't get my head around this constant change of profile of coach/manager. I didn't want Poch to be sacked but I get that something needed to change. But why not replace Poch with a similar coach is absolutely dumbfounding. We were heading in the right direction, bring in someone who plays the same, tweak somethings etc but just build on the previous chap. If he doesn't work, then get another in a similar mould et. etc. But to get a manager miles away from what we have built just takes the direction further way for a new guy to replace Jose (assuming we change to a progressive coach that is).

Yes yes yes , its the change of coach/philosophy that is the problem. So fucking frustrating. It's not Jose's fault in the sense everyone knows what they are getting when they hire him. I really think the chairman needs to take a long hard look at himself and ask whether he is the right man for the footballing side of the club. I think the job is now beyond is capabilities.
 
So, our White players are mid table standard and our Black players have bad attitudes and don't belong on a football pitch.

Right oh.

It's rather interesting that most fans see Lo Celso as excellent, hard working and first name on the team sheet. Meanwhile, Ndombele is lazy, bad attitude, fat, unfit.

GLC - 0 goals. 0 assists in 21 games.
Ndombele - 2 goals, 2 assists in 19 games (most of which as a sub).
:adegrin2::adesalute:
 
So, our White players are mid table standard and our Black players have bad attitudes and don't belong on a football pitch.

Right oh.

It's rather interesting that most fans see Lo Celso as excellent, hard working and first name on the team sheet. Meanwhile, Ndombele is lazy, bad attitude, fat, unfit.

GLC - 0 goals. 0 assists in 21 games.
Ndombele - 2 goals, 2 assists in 19 games (most of which as a sub).

:avbhumph:
 
So, our White players are mid table standard and our Black players have bad attitudes and don't belong on a football pitch.

Right oh.

It's rather interesting that most fans see Lo Celso as excellent, hard working and first name on the team sheet. Meanwhile, Ndombele is lazy, bad attitude, fat, unfit.

GLC - 0 goals. 0 assists in 21 games.
Ndombele - 2 goals, 2 assists in 19 games (most of which as a sub).
There all shit dude , black and white .
The core of the team has been left to rot .
Upstairs is the biggest piece of shit.
 
We are genuinely a massive pull for a Manager, they have all the conditions for them to succeed.

I don't think they have all the conditions to succeed. Yes a great training centre, yes a 61k stadium, yes Kane and Son. However any manager needs more to be successful. We don't have Utd, City or Chelsea type money, we don't have a player recruitment department like Liverpool have, we don't have a footballing philosophy we stick to, our scouting is not fit for purpose, the squad is needs a massive overhaul, the chairman is penny wise pound foolish. Yes we have pretentions to be a big club but we don't act like one
 
I get what you are trying to say and I wasn't attempting to be obtuse, when we lost to West Ham we were on a club record of wins I believe which is why I said it.

I still stand by the fact that a "crunch" game is different for different reasons. West Ham's win yesterday was a crunch game, it might have kept them in the league, does this mean they have a better mentality than say us? Or if they lose the next crunch game (which means the next game) does that put them back in the weak mentality bracket?

Is a relegation game a greater test of mentality than a semi-final or final? If you are playing against the Champions elect and are effectively the underdog and you lose in a final, is that crunch game less of a crunch game than if you were the favourites?

Liverpool got knocked out of League Cup and FA Cup early the past couple of years what does that make of their mentality? Or is mentality only measured to semi-finals and finals? If so what is the mentality of those teams that don't even get to a quarter-final?

My position is if you are regularly getting to semi-finals and finals and are competing at the top end of the league then there isn't too much wrong with the mentality. And to bring this back to this team today, they have achieved those things I don't see mentality as the issue.
Mentality has always been a massive problem for us if you can't see this you are clueless.
Every we come to a big game we freeze hence apart from 2008 we have lost every big game we have appeared in. How many semi finals have we lost at wembley in the last 30 years
 
I don't think they have all the conditions to succeed. Yes a great training centre, yes a 61k stadium, yes Kane and Son. However any manager needs more to be successful. We don't have Utd, City or Chelsea type money, we don't have a player recruitment department like Liverpool have, we don't have a footballing philosophy we stick to, our scouting is not fit for purpose, the squad is needs a massive overhaul, the chairman is penny wise pound foolish. Yes we have pretentions to be a big club but we don't act like one
WHL, top 8 team, the odd CL qualification and win a few cups playing the way we did in 2010, a squad full of academy and our most expensive player around the 20M mark.

I’d swap it all for that.
 
Not everything is Mourinho's fault clearly. Levy takes the largest share of the blame for our pathetic transfer dealings between 2016 to 2018 and some of the players we have clearly aren't very good. Having said that i look at Arteta and Ancelloti who took over at a similar time with 2 clubs with at least as many weaknessess as us and whilst inconsistant you can see an improvement. Who can say there has been an improvement or a sign of any plan of what is to come with us? We do have talent but the whole team just looks like a rabble, tactically no real idea of what we're trying to do.
 
This defeat ( which I predicted) has cut deep with a lot of spurs fans. Obviously the realisation the cl football will not be played next season is one reason, but I think a realisation of actually how bad we actually are. Even though we have been heading this way for the past 18 months .

There are no doubt some fans that think we are fine, it’s just our manager and his team selection and tactics . And as soon as we replace him things will be fine again. Who ever thinks this way i believe is wrong .
We are in a bad place because of the standard of some these players .
Blaming this on mourinho is a mistake. He selected, la Celso, son, Lucas, kane . That’s an attacking line up. The fact these 4 can’t make music is not his fault. There is something seriously wrong how 4 very good attacking players cannot create one decent chance with 70 percent possession. This was exactly the same under the last season and half under Poch. So it can’t be solely down to mourinho.

I actually believe mourinho has no intention of having these full backs next season. Now we are floating around mid table , out of all cups I’m hoping he may start to experiment a bit now in preparation for next season. I don’t want to harp on about the faults of our full backs but in the modern game where they now are also effectively wingers , you can’t have full backs that simply can’t cross and have no attacking instinct . They have to go.

I trust mourinho to be rebuild. And I think he will start with the defence . Once this is sorted and we have much better full backs I think we will start to see a much better attacking shape and some confidence will come back.

I think we will have to sell a big player , I don’t think it will be Kane ( although the following season I think he will be gone ) but my money would be on Dele Ali and ndombele . That should bring in some wedge for some full backs .

These last 6 or 7 games will be painful . I just hope we can qualify for the europa. For the cl lovers here, if you think being out of Europe will help us get 4th , forget it. If you want cl , then winning the europa is the route .

We are only 1 point below Woolwich . Offer me a europa spot and finishing above them , with all this bulls*** I would happily take that now.
 
I think Mourinho is spot on with his comments about our weak mentality.

What I saw last night was exactly the same as what I saw in the CL final. A team who gave up after one setback and never attacked the game. I don’t think any manager is going to get into the CL with this squad, the players are too soft.
 
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