Jose Mourinho

[COckneY Spurs]

I’d blame the manager if I had not seen this all before in Hoddle, Jol, Santini, Redknapp, AVB, Poch and now Jose. The same consistent level of ineptitude in player recruitment. The same selling to buy, rather than actually investing. When good managers are making progress, the brakes go on and the key players don’t arrive unless someone is flogged first. It’s a joke and keeps on happening.

Poch went into most seasons needing one of two players and games were thrown away which were costly, today - same again. Squad light of players and games thrown away. I can’t blame Jose as it’s all happened before.

I don’t like Jose’s tactics, but I know he’s just the latest manager to be duped by Mr Buyright. Promises you the Earth, gives you bits of dirt.

FUCK OFF ENIC AND FUCK OFF LEVY.

When Levy appointed Pochettino he didn’t sign a manager to take us to the next level, how could he based on Pochettino’s managerial CV....He signed Pochettino as a manager who “improved” any team he managed and done it with a combination of youth and modest signings, and he also played an attractive brand of football, he ticked every Levy box...

Problem was, Pochettino got lucky, he improved the team mentality, got them playing attractive football but what no one banked on was most of his squad peaked during this transition, and with it not only did we smash through the top 4 door we had a run at two titles....With that Pochettino became ambitious (nothing wrong with that) fans expectations grew (nothing wrong with that) but Levy took a minor stroke, he knew this was going to cost money to acquire players which would improve us even more, his answer? No fucking chance, Pochettino can work miracles and he can bloody well keep working them.......

We still wait on Kyle Walkers replacement
We still wait on Danny Roses replacement
We still wait on Dembeles replacement
We still wait on Eriksens replacement
We still wait on Vertonghens replacement
We still wait on that elusive striker

And sorry:
Serge Aurier isn’t Walker
Ben Davies isn’t Rose
Hojbjerg isn’t Dembele
N’dombele isn’t Dembele
LoCelso isn’t Dembele
Winks isn’t Dembele
None of the above are Eriksen either
And No striker isn’t actually a striker


And we wonder what’s went wrong.....

 

[Cravenspurs]

He said that while playing under Conte and winning the league under his management - a very specific context, don´t you think? Again, it was almost 5 years ago. Last week, in retrospective, Hazard said that of all the managers he has worked with - Conte included -, Jose is the one he would like to work with one more time. I´m just very surprised that this quote - again, from last week - doesn´t mean anything to you.

About not coaching the offensive side of the ball: Jose has won 25 major titles in his career - 8 of them coming after the book mentioned by the article. If he has never won anything, I could agree that his coaching methods are bad. It´s simply not the case. Anyway, do you really think that Madrid team would make 100 points and score 121 goals with every other manager? Be serious.

Finally, ask yourself if that article would come if yesterday´s result was different - even if the playing style was the same. It wouldn´t. They just bring it on every time Jose loses a match - or when his side is having problems up front.

Agree to disagree at this point.

46 league goals from Christiano. 22 from Higuain. 21 from Benzema. 89 goals right there. So yeah, they scored a lot of goals that season, but they also had a squad of Alonso, Ozil, Di Maria, Khedira, and many more decent squad players. We are not them currently, so it comes down to the ability to get the most out of the players you have, cause he doesn't have a Christiano or a Hazard that can just take over a game.

 

[Johnboy40]

Am i the only one that thinks it odd that Levy has an office at the training ground? I would much prefer that he was fucking up transfers from another location. The training ground should be the managers domain.

It makes him accessible to the manager and players.
If I were a betting man, its a few of afternoons a week at lilywhite house

 

[Sir Archibald Crooks]

Chelsea 2005 and Real Madrid 2010 are irrelevant at this point. Its been diminshing returns for Mourinho for several years. In 10 months for us the football has been abject, the results mediocre. He will not have a squad here like he had at Chelsea or Madrid. I'm not fussed really about his record years back, the here and now, where and what is his gameplan outside of nick a goal? What are his tactics outside of the attacking right back? Which players are responding to him and improving? We know there is no longevity in a Mourinho appointment, he was brought in to improve us straight away so if he isnt doing that what is the point in all of us being bored to tears?

 

[Ciro]

Agree to disagree at this point.

46 league goals from Christiano. 22 from Higuain. 21 from Benzema. 89 goals right there. So yeah, they scored a lot of goals that season, but they also had a squad of Alonso, Ozil, Di Maria, Khedira, and many more decent squad players. We are not them currently, so it comes down to the ability to get the most out of the players you have, cause he doesn't have a Christiano or a Hazard that can just take over a game.

I´m not saying "we are them", and I really don´t understand why would you understand that from what I said.

My question to you was: do you think that Madrid team would also make 100 points and score 121 goals with every other manager?

Because, since Jose doesn´t work in his attacking players movements, I´m assuming Cristiano´s 46 goals, Higuain´s 22 goals, Benzema´s 21 goals - etc - happened in spite of Jose´s work, and not because of it - which is basically what you´re saying here.

So do you agree? If that Madrid team was managed by any other manager, they would have scored the same amount of goals and would have won the league against the best Barcelona of all time?

Thanks.

 

[FightingIllini]

We still wait on Kyle Walkers replacement
We still wait on Danny Roses replacement
We still wait on Dembeles replacement
We still wait on Eriksens replacement
We still wait on Vertonghens replacement
We still wait on that elusive striker

Aurier (and now Doherty as attempt #2)
Sessegnon
Ndombele
Lo Celso
Sanchez
Pending

Almost 200 million spent.

Our transfer business has actually been very specifically and consciously dedicated to replacing those players.

 

[Matt1882]

Aurier (and now Doherty as attempt #2)
Sessegnon
Ndombele
Lo Celso
Sanchez
Pending

Almost 200 million spent.

Our transfer business has actually been very specifically and consciously dedicated to replacing those players.

Replacing players that leave maybe, badly, but what we have never really done is add to the squad.
Too long it's one out one in. Where other teams ofren have back up in most positions that can step straight in, we often don't have 1 good player for that role.

 

[Elias]

Hazard also said, just last week, that Jose is the manager he would like to work with for a second time...

Yup. I found Hazard's quotes genuinely surprising.

Given the whole Eva Carneiro clusterfuck was because she ran onto to the pitch to treat an injured Hazard, and incurred the wrath of Mourinho for doing so, I would have thought a tad more loyalty to Carneiro was in order.

But given he's now turned up for two pre-seasons fat and unfit, far more so than Tanguy, after his big money, lucrative contract, move to Real Madrid, I can only conclude that Hazard is a complete & utter fucktard.

Still, at face value, his comments that he would want to work with Mourinho again more than any other of his former coaches is fascinating, and suggests Jose does genuinely inspire loyalty in some, not all, but some of his players. Including very attack-minded ones.

 

[hiatus]

This is interesting. We don't really get a glimpse into practice in the documentary, but I would love to hear more ex-players talk about this.

Didn't Hazard also say there is more direction under Conte than Jose who just said to run around?

Get him out of the club ASAP. He's going to start turning up his public criticism of players, mark my words.

I don't think the casual observer needs to be in on training to understand that what we are doing in the final third is not planned. Our best scoring chances yesterday was Doherty/Kane connecting on a simple one-two (great ball by Kane) and a counter attack. There's no steady plan of attack compared to other clubs.

The Leeds example is a good one - you watch them for two minutes and you can tell they have a plan of how to progress the ball, attack, recycle possession. Our plan is long balls, counter, and individual moments of brilliance. That's why I said the only difference between pre and post lockdown was a healthy, fit and firing Kane.

 

[hiatus]

Silly article from The Athletic. Whenever someone wants to criticize Jose, they bring in Diego Torres´ book.

As I said, Jose got it wrong yesterday. Some of the players conditions were not the best and I think he should have known that before the game. Our best CB partnership is Toby-Sanchez, yet he insisted with Eric Dier. And of course, I think he got it wrong at half-time - not by replacing Dele Alli, but by bringing in Sissoko instead of a more dangerous player for RW, such as Bergwijn.

By the way, I´m amazed. There are so many Spurs fans that choose not to see how ineffective Dele Alli can be. "Oh, but he almost scored", "We were worst in the second half". I don´t get it, honestly. Dele Alli interrupted our best way to score, which is counter attacking football. He likes to play in between Sonny and Kane, as a second striker on the left, which was also a problem. And even more important, he is clearly not aware of what the team wants from him - and he plays in a vital position in terms of coordinating attacks. Yesterday´s team was a entirely different beast than when Lo Celso plays in front of the double pivot.

I saw Alasdair Gold´s article today and, even though I like him very much, it was full of BS as well. At some point he suggested that Ndombele was "too conservative, too restricted to his positioning", as to say Jose was taking out his creativity - again, something silly to say; just an old narrative.

It doesn´t matter what you think of Ndombele, he should not be criticized in relation to yesterday´s game because he came in late, we were not a team at the time, etc. But if he didn´t change the game by his own or something, it was not because he was being conservative in his positioning - what does that mean anyway? Should he be out of position so we could praise Jose for giving him freedom? Nonsense. He tried to create. He made mistakes with his passing. He was bad, just like everyone else. It was a mess after Everton scored.

My point is that sometimes, even though Jose make mistakes - like yesterday -, people just jump into narratives so they can criticize him.

The point is Mourinho has no attacking philosophy, only a defensive one. You can't just expect players just to wing it, especially when they are expected to be so disciplined defensively.

 

[TonySoprano]

These conversations about Jose are exactly what Utd fans were saying in 2017/2018. The turgid football, the defensive tactics, the blaming of players, lack of fitness, no attacking flair. And this was after the thick end of 400M spent on players.

Why are we expecting it to have a different outcome here?

 

[Ciro]

The point is Mourinho has no attacking philosophy, only a defensive one. You can't just expect players just to wing it, especially when they are expected to be so disciplined defensively.

Ask yourself: would we be seeing this article if yesterday´s result was different - playing exactly the same style of football? It´s just an opportunistic narrative, they use it every time. "The Sun" mentioned Torres´ book when Madrid lost a CL semifinal to Bayern - on penalties.

The year was 2012 and the title was: "You´re not special anymore".

Sounds familiar?

You can expect players to work in Jose´s system because that´s what happened through all his career - including the period of Torres´book, mentioned by the article.

 

[prinmemo]

He said that while playing under Conte and winning the league under his management - a very specific context, don´t you think? Again, it was almost 5 years ago. Last week, in retrospective, Hazard said that of all the managers he has worked with - Conte included -, Jose is the one he would like to work with one more time. I´m just very surprised that this quote - again, from last week - doesn´t mean anything to you.

About not coaching the offensive side of the ball: Jose has won 25 major titles in his career - 8 of them coming after the book mentioned by the article. If he has never won anything, I could agree that his coaching methods are bad. It´s simply not the case. Anyway, do you really think that Madrid team would make 100 points and score 121 goals with every other manager? Be serious.

Finally, ask yourself if that article would come if yesterday´s result was different - even if the playing style was the same. It wouldn´t. They just bring it on every time Jose loses a match - or when his side is having problems up front.

Every time we lose a game, the pundits say, “how many more losses” or “how much time” before Jose is sacked. Many pundits want him and therefore Spurs to fail.

 

[Ciro]

Every time we lose a game, the pundits say, “how many more losses” or “how much time” before Jose is sacked. Many pundits want him and therefore Spurs to fail.

Thanks.

 

[Joshking5]

Silly article from The Athletic. Whenever someone wants to criticize Jose, they bring in Diego Torres´ book.

As I said, Jose got it wrong yesterday. Some of the players conditions were not the best and I think he should have known that before the game. Our best CB partnership is Toby-Sanchez, yet he insisted with Eric Dier. And of course, I think he got it wrong at half-time - not by replacing Dele Alli, but by bringing in Sissoko instead of a more dangerous player for RW, such as Bergwijn.

By the way, I´m amazed. There are so many Spurs fans that choose not to see how ineffective Dele Alli can be. "Oh, but he almost scored", "We were worst in the second half". I don´t get it, honestly. Dele Alli interrupted our best way to score, which is counter attacking football. He likes to play in between Sonny and Kane, as a second striker on the left, which was also a problem. And even more important, he is clearly not aware of what the team wants from him - and he plays in a vital position in terms of coordinating attacks. Yesterday´s team was a entirely different beast than when Lo Celso plays in front of the double pivot.

I saw Alasdair Gold´s article today and, even though I like him very much, it was full of BS as well. At some point he suggested that Ndombele was "too conservative, too restricted to his positioning", as to say Jose was taking out his creativity - again, something silly to say; just an old narrative.

It doesn´t matter what you think of Ndombele, he should not be criticized in relation to yesterday´s game because he came in late, we were not a team at the time, etc. But if he didn´t change the game by his own or something, it was not because he was being conservative in his positioning - what does that mean anyway? Should he be out of position so we could praise Jose for giving him freedom? Nonsense. He tried to create. He made mistakes with his passing. He was bad, just like everyone else. It was a mess after Everton scored.

My point is that sometimes, even though Jose make mistakes - like yesterday -, people just jump into narratives so they can criticize him.

Jose keeps instructing our ball playing midfielder (winks/Ndombele) to be deepest in the pivot, where as Hojberg is told to roam, hunt down the ball and even join attacks at times. He was also doing it with Lo Celso as the deepest midfielder last season partnered with sissoko at times.

This is what Ali G is getting at in his article when he says Ndombele is being conservative. It’s not something you can deny it’s just facts.

I get it, Jose played some amazing, ruthless counter attacking football back when he was at Madrid with arguably the best players in the world, and he did the same with a Chelsea team twice that had unlimited investment.

But you have to face facts, he is not adapting his philosophy to this team. He has no fresh new ideas or solutions and the team look like strangers whenever they reach the final 3rd.

We literally are fucked every time the opposite team scores first, you can’t keep hanging on to the Jose of old he is not that manager anymore and he has no solid track record of succeeding at clubs with the kinds of budgets we have anyway.

All managers go stale apart from SAF, it’s happened to all of the rest of them. His time has come.

 

[Cravenspurs]

I´m not saying "we are them", and I really don´t understand why would you understand that from what I said.

My question to you was: do you think that Madrid team would also make 100 points and score 121 goals with any/every other manager?

Because, since Jose doesn´t work in his attacking players movements, I´m assuming Cristiano´s 46 goals, Higuain´s 22 goals, Benzema´s 21 goals - etc - happened in spite of Jose´s work, and not because of it - which is basically what you´re saying here.

So do you agree? If that Madrid team was managed by any/every other manager, they would have scored the same amount of goals and would have won the league against the best Barcelona of all time?

Thanks.

Yes, I think Madrid would have been successful no matter what. They were a unit. From 2009-2017 they scored over 100 goals a year in La Liga. Over that period, they averaged 91pts a year. That was under Jose, Carlo, Rafa, and Zidane. The latter three won the CL with Real, Jose didn't.

Jose of course works on the offensive side of the ball. I am not saying he just sits in the back half of the pitch every session, but players have been quoted as saying he isn't the most focused on the side of the pitch. We can see in our teams movement that we are lacking an identity. Watched Leeds on Saturday, they have an attacking identity. They scored 3 against one of the best defensive sides in the league. They don't have our quality, but they played as a unit and tore through that team.

And most would say the best team at Barca was that 08-09 year when they won the treble. Either way, we don't see eye to eye on this subject.

I do appreciate the back and forth though. Everyone has an opinion and we all feel like we are right, but that's the beauty of it, no one is right.

 

[LeeMcl]

Chelsea 2005 and Real Madrid 2010 are irrelevant at this point. Its been diminshing returns for Mourinho for several years. In 10 months for us the football has been abject, the results mediocre. He will not have a squad here like he had at Chelsea or Madrid. I'm not fussed really about his record years back, the here and now, where and what is his gameplan outside of nick a goal? What are his tactics outside of the attacking right back? Which players are responding to him and improving? We know there is no longevity in a Mourinho appointment, he was brought in to improve us straight away so if he isnt doing that what is the point in all of us being bored to tears?

It’s certainly a weird experience with Jose. He was quite widely written off on arrival as a “has been” although he’s younger than Ancelotti who is getting sucked off left right and centre after yesterday and has won about half of the things José has. Funny world.

I still think footballs simple. The more you pay the better your players and the better your players the more you win. Jose has Dier and Toby at CB, if that was the CB paring at West Ham we would all be laughing at them.

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

Kane is the only forward with a brain in our squad.
Son is too greedy. He only passed to Dele because his own chance dimished the longer he held onto it yesterday. It wasn't because he thought Dele was better placed, it was greed.
Lucas has NFI what to do with the ball when he's got it. His only choice at that point is to draw a foul.
He might be better if he got it in the penalty box, but I rarely recall seeing him there since Ajax
Dele has struggled lets face it. He's brilliant in the spur of the moment, but I'm not sure he is at his best when he has time on the ball.
GLC may be quality but plays deeper.
That leaves BenchwarmingBergwijn. Why he's not starting games over Lucus defies belief to me.
Seen Jose with a J say today that he was the only one that looked fit. That worries me as it just means he's gonna get more starts and more chances to run into walls.

The point to the article is Jose inability to coach attacking phases. It's NOT a personnel thing it's a coaching thing.

 

[COckneY Spurs]

Aurier (and now Doherty as attempt #2)
Sessegnon
Ndombele
Lo Celso
Sanchez
Pending

Almost 200 million spent.

Our transfer business has actually been very specifically and consciously dedicated to replacing those players.

Tragic when you think about it....

 

[Maureen]

I don’t really care about how many trophies his won with other clubs and apart from Chelsea first time and Porto CL win the teams his managed have always won trophies on a regular basis. Plus his always had a big budget to spend and can anyone actually say any of his team revolutionised football. Any way to the hear and now and what we see with our own eyes is a manager who is offering nothing special no imagination either from open play or even set pieces. In fact have we tried anything clever from a set play. The football is worse than Pulis in his prime in fact is a big fan of Maureen. He always has an excuse as if no other team can use the same excuses. Has improved any one player in our squad? He has always relied on ready made top
Players. Has improved sissoko poimting, winks ability to pass incisive balls forward improve the movement of the attacking players, interchangeability of players and positions and on and on. If anyone is lazy it is him as has clearly not done or worked on any of the above it would be too much like hard work. Easier to keep spouting BS team talks with c words mentality passion etc no of which we show either. If anyone can see they seen one iota of improvement in our team / play let’s see the evidence. The guy is picking up a hefty check and hardly working for it. Coaches like potter and Beilsa have far less talent to work with but they invested their time in improving their respective teams style which harder to do than just send 11 players playing hope for the best football and trying hit the RB.