Let's Be Brutally Honest - Our Matchday Squad is No Longer Top 6 Quality

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Are We Still Top 6 Quality?


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Good post. The only additional point I’d make is that I haven’t given up on Toby yet. It’s too easy when a player has a bad patch and they’re over 30 to say they’re done, but it isn’t always the case. It can just be a bad patch.

Gary Cahill looks excellent at Palace this season after being written off by Chelsea as “shot“ a year ago.

Injury has precluded it, but I would have really enjoyed a run with Toby and Tango CB, with Japhet being able to learn from easily the most intelligent defender at the club.

I guess without even adequate DCM protection in front, our defence is always overly exposed though.

Look how good Morgan and Huth looked with Kante in front!

I think it's likely that under the right system, with the right defensive midfielder in front of him, therefore limiting the chances opponents get against us, Toby could quite well be a great option for his experience and reading of the game alone - I just think perhaps we need to start thinking of the future when it comes to it - playing Toby ahead of Sanchez, Dier or Tanganga does nothing for their development. Unless of course you're suggesting Toby is right sided centre half with one of Dier/Sanchez/Tanganga on the left side?
 
Good post. The only additional point I’d make is that I haven’t given up on Toby yet. It’s too easy when a player has a bad patch and they’re over 30 to say they’re done, but it isn’t always the case. It can just be a bad patch.

Gary Cahill looks excellent at Palace this season after being written off by Chelsea as “shot“ a year ago.

Injury has precluded it, but I would have really enjoyed a run with Toby and Tango CB, with Japhet being able to learn from easily the most intelligent defender at the club.

I guess without even adequate DCM protection in front, our defence is always overly exposed though.

Look how good Morgan and Huth looked with Kante in front!

Christ I had forgotten all about Tanganga!

:mourfacepalm:

How long is he out for?
 
Hmm... I’d say 6th is where we are currently. In a highly competitive season where someone surprises like Sheffield and wolves have that puts us where we are today. When we get lucky like last season It’ll put us 4th.
It's highly competitive BECAUSE we are shit.

Look at the 15/16 team. We've regressed at literally every position. Except for those who remain like Kane, Lloris, Son, Toby et al - but they've all regressed too.

We are even with Everton in the table right now - can you honestly say that you would not take some of their players?

Digne > Davies
Mina > Sanchez
Gomes > Sissoko
Richarlison > Lucas

Even two years ago - there's no way we'd even entertain the notion to put an Everton player in our first XI. Now a combined XI would be almost 50% Everton, in all honesty.

Next year, Woolwich, Wolves, Everton, Chelsea, Leicester & United will undoubtedly strengthen. Will we? If not, will Mourinho's managerial abilities make up a 5-10 point difference to get us back into just the EL - not even aiming for the CL..?


Need to improve fast. Look what happened to Liverpool after their CL wins 15 years ago or Woolwich when they built their stadium; failed to push on and spent a decade being shit. And that was when the division was far weaker than today...
 
I think it's likely that under the right system, with the right defensive midfielder in front of him, therefore limiting the chances opponents get against us, Toby could quite well be a great option for his experience and reading of the game alone - I just think perhaps we need to start thinking of the future when it comes to it - playing Toby ahead of Sanchez, Dier or Tanganga does nothing for their development. Unless of course you're suggesting Toby is right sided centre half with one of Dier/Sanchez/Tanganga on the left side?
Personally I don’t see a pathway for either Sanchez or Dier to be a good enough CB to start for us, hence my leaning towards Toby and Tango until we’re able to bring a quality defender in this summer.

I do get the point about building for the future though, that I’m all for.
 
Top post

My thoughts exactly.

The only Caveat I will put in is that Poch did not want a DOF and Levy went along with it. We got this bullshit transfer committee instead.

Let’s hope a DOF is appointed soon as I think José will be on board with that
 
Personally I don’t see a pathway for either Sanchez or Dier to be a good enough CB to start for us, hence my leaning towards Toby and Tango until we’re able to bring a quality defender in this summer.

I do get the point about building for the future though, that I’m all for.

With the right DM and partner though - do you not think one of Sanchez/Dier could be more than capable?

You said it yourself, Morgan and Huth won the Premier League with Kante in front of them - and Dier and Sanchez are arguably better than both of them.
 
With the right DM and partner though - do you not think one of Sanchez/Dier could be more than capable?

You said it yourself, Morgan and Huth won the Premier League with Kante in front of them - and Dier and Sanchez are arguably better than both of them.
I don’t really no. I think they can both be better in the right system and with the correct players around them (look how good Matip looks with VVD next to him, how good Wimmer looked playing in our excellent team) but I don’t rate either highly individually.

With Sanchez he’s just so poor on the ball it’s always going to be an issue. I’m more nervous when he has the ball under pressure than I am when he’s faced with a one on one. I haven’t seen any real development in that side of him since he arrived.
 
Let’s hope a DOF is appointed soon as I think José will be on board with that
I was kind of checked out from football during the corona-break but whatever happened to Campos? Why did he never join us? He is probably the most successful (financially anyway) DOF in the world right now. Was it just rumors or did talks break down?
 
I was kind of checked out from football during the corona-break but whatever happened to Campos? Why did he never join us? He is probably the most successful (financially anyway) DOF in the world right now. Was it just rumors or did talks break down?

Word was he's not prepared to break his contract so IF he's gonna come here then, much like a player, he won't be 'signed' until the summer window is underway.

Gut tells me it's not happening though cos the rumblings have stopped; which is a shitter...
 
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What I find a sad indictment of our current situation is that the thread title implies we are no longer a top six side and yet currently Leicester and Wolves are. If someone had told me that would have been the situation a few seasons ago I would have laughed in their face.
We should be there amidst the heat of battle for a top three/four slot not trying to salvage a top ten finish with the likes of Burnley, Newcastle and Southampton snapping at our fucking heels.
This fiasco goes a lot deeper than just the manager and players.
 
I think there are three concerns that work together to exacerbate our problems, and have led to a team that is right now lesser than the sum of its parts:

1) Our weaknesses are not evenly spread on the pitch. Instead they are concentrated on the back half, across our back line and at #6, leading to too many weak goals, too many leads conceded, and this leads to an overall lack of confidence in the club.

2) We consistently run out three players who are somewhere between deficient and dumb: Aurier, Lucas, and Sissoko. Aurier is a physical specimen with great speed and a great first touch, but he is brain-dead on the pitch: he commits defensive lapse after defensive lapse, and his crosses are sprayed without forethought or precision. Trippier was slow defensively, but at least his crosses were good. Lucas I will always love for Ajax, but he runs with his head down, he too frequently costs us width and runs into blind alleys, and he ends up costing Kane space to operate. He should be used strictly off the bench. And Sissoko clearly has no idea what that round thing is at his feet, especially in the final third where something like a blind panic sets in. I appreciate his motor and the desperate coverage he provides for the idiot Aurier, but he is far below the level we should aspire to.

3) I do not know how much this is related to 1 and 2, but there is something clearly wrong with the mentality of this club as constructed. Colchester, Brighton, Sheffield, so many examples of a team that seems to lack fight. I am not fully ready to let Poch and Mou off the hook, but at some point, we should admit that there is a lack of leadership and determination on this roster. Perhaps this is one more way in which the stagnation and lack of turnover from windows past have created a problem.
 
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