Liverpool vs Tottenham Hotspur. May 7th. Saturday – 7.45 PM.

[Borks]

If you don't count any of the shots we had then our xG was 0. Conte out.

 

[bus-conductor]

I have my preference for how I want us to play and it's not favourable to playing a low block. That said Conte's low block vs Mourinho's is chalk and cheese I can at least watch Conte's system whereas I found Jose's literally unwatchable.

There has been a difference between Conte's bus and Mourinho's but it wasn't very different today is all I'm saying.

I'm not apoplectic with rage, I'm not over the moon either.

With Conte we don't hoof the ball up the pitch

Sometimes we actually do. See Villa.

we play through the thirds of the pitch from back to front and I like how aggressive we are in either our defensive line as it was today but sometimes that's higher up in midfield.

Agree. We are generally more aggressive and Conte has actually got Son working a bit harder in our defensive shape/phase".

The physiology of football though is a strange one as I recall many a game under Poch where many fans (could have been me on occasion too) hoped Poch dropped his high-line and wish we sat deeper and countered when playing against certain teams that pressed very well, or teams that possessed a lethal counter-attack where we were picked off and lost with that teams only shot on goal.

We've played like Liverpool did today under Conte and there were a ton of complaints as we didn't get behind the defence, or play quick enough, just sending in endless crosses into a crowded penalty box that can be defended.

Again, as I said, I'm not averse to a bit of smart pragmatism, and I realise Conte quite likes to suck teams out and blow them back, it's part of his thing, I just think we didn't do any blowing out today, or anywhere near enough.

I praised his tactics and set up against Liverpool at home very highly, a game we also drew, but it was chalk and cheese to this game, tactically. We gave Liverpool far more to think about all over the pitch in that game and second half we weren't just reactive either. It was the best performance against them since Poch's Wembley mullering - and we also didn't dominate possession in that game either, we were just much smarter, aggressive and ambitious.

Maybe that was the plan today, but if it was, it didn't work.

 

[Deuterz]

In what world should one strike off our goal.... ?????

Another day when XG on its own proves to be bollocks.

PEH hit the post, Davies & PEH could have scored....

I can't think of a noteworthy chance of theirs.

VVD hit the top side of the bar?

Did Hugo make a notable save?

Liverpool had few to no clear cut chances (hard to when we packed the box in that manner) but they sieged us for the entire game, so all their blocked shots, headers from corners etc etc add up a lot when it comes to xG.

xG was actually proven right in this case ... they were expected to score 1 goal with all their little chances which added up, and they did.

 

[Dudski]

The place was silent at 0-1

I thought the same thing watching it on TV. The Liverpool fans went from being silent to a period of about ten minutes before their goal where they were showing their discontent. But once the game was tied up you would have thought they were singing and cheering to beat the band.

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

Yes the points are the same but not the mentality, confidence, pressure, the overall picture of the season, the impact of losing. Therefore the approach is also different. Liverpool more then likely lost the title in this game because they could go a point above if they win. They wouldn't have known that the last time they drew a game (before the city game). Same applies to us for those two games. We knew exactly what it meant if we won or if we didn't. I agree with you on the WBA game and battle of the bridge being the same. But both were in the run in. Compare that west brom game home that season. also a draw. Totally different situation back then. We didn't know we were going to be in a title race, so the second game we should have been thinking differently..maybe more pressure was on us. Leeds doing us a favour would be massive. We then basically know we must win all the games because we will get top 4 if we do and we know it....6 months ago we would not have gone into the games thinking that

For me, the only difference is with the fan's feelings.

The thing is Liverpool would be clearly ahead in the title race had they taken all 3pts against us earlier in the season, had they had done they could have maintained their winning run(???), maybe those dropped points knocked them mentally and lost their momentum, that's why they lost against Leicester and drew against chavs (7 pts dropped)??? Maybe the same happens again in their next 2 games???

All if's and buts and why I will always maintain the points won and dropped are the same no matter the oppo.

 

[Deuterz]

I thought the same thing watching it on TV. The Liverpool fans went from being silent to a period of about ten minutes before their goal where they were showing their discontent. But once the game was tied up you would have thought they were singing and cheering to beat the band.

Even the scousers I know admit the anfield atmosphere is a myth. The idea it's some terrifying ground to go to has long since been some weird lie that the English media have decided to perpetuate, maybe because the reality is that no English top clubs really have an intimidating atmosphere.

On big European nights it'll sometimes be bouncing, but usually only for the YNWA bit at the start and then if they're on top. For your run of the mill league games its a library 9/10 times.

 

[db_spurfan]

Is this a shot from Royal or was this a cross? The stutter-step makes me think he was going for goal.

 

[bus-conductor]

Liverpool had few to no clear cut chances (hard to when we packed the box in that manner) but they sieged us for the entire game, so all their blocked shots, headers from corners etc etc add up a lot when it comes to xG.

xG was actually proven right in this case ... they were expected to score 1 goal with all their little chances which added up, and they did.

Airfixx

Exactly this. It's also exactly right for us. We had one massive (high XG 0.86) chance and scored from it, and fuck all else (three/four tiny x/g chances) and didn't.

This game is literally validating XG. Not showing it bollocks.

 

[Airfixx]

Liverpool had few to no clear cut chances (hard to when we packed the box in that manner) but they sieged us for the entire game, so all their blocked shots, headers from corners etc etc add up a lot when it comes to xG.

xG was actually proven right in this case ... they were expected to score 1 goal with all their little chances which added up, and they did.

We scored too, but bus-conductor says we need to remove that from our XG stat.

We nullified their alleged irresistible, best in the world attack and created the better and more plentiful chances.... While they relied upon a jammy defelction.

There's no good reason to talk that down as mere bus parking and us not trying to win.

 

[Airfixx]

Airfixx

Exactly this. It's also exactly right for us. We had one massive (high XG 0.86) chance and scored from it, and fuck all else (three/four tiny x/g chances) and didn't.

This game is literally validating XG. Not showing it bollocks.

The way you've tried to use XG against us IS bollocks.


You saying we didn't play to win is also bollocks.

 

[db_spurfan]

I appreciate the creativity from this team here. Just should have been a shot to goal.

 

[Guido 🇺🇦]

There has been a difference between Conte's bus and Mourinho's but it wasn't very different today is all I'm saying.

I'm not apoplectic with rage, I'm not over the moon either.




Sometimes we actually do. See Villa.



Agree. We are generally more aggressive and Conte has actually got Son working a bit harder in our defensive shape/phase".





Again, as I said, I'm not averse to a bit of smart pragmatism, and I realise Conte quite likes to suck teams out and blow them back, it's part of his thing, I just think we didn't do any blowing out today, or anywhere near enough.

I praised his tactics and set up against Liverpool at home very highly, a game we also drew, but it was chalk and cheese to this game, tactically. We gave Liverpool far more to think about all over the pitch in that game and second half we weren't just reactive either. It was the best performance against them since Poch's Wembley mullering - and we also didn't dominate possession in that game either, we were just much smarter, aggressive and ambitious.

Maybe that was the plan today, but if it was, it didn't work.

Totally agree about the earlier game with them, we should have scored 6 against them that day. Perhaps the difference was their midfield though (yes we too didn't field what we know to be our best 11), had Fabinio been booked in the first 10mins as he should have done (or seen red for his elbow in Son's face) then maybe we could have worked the space better???

I didn't think Kane was sharp today, a lot of how we play goes through him, oppo know about it but it's not always possible to prevent him popping the ball off but today he could get his passes off and lost many of his duels (Son too in the 1st half). The only thing I don't get with Conte is why he hasn't played more games with a midfield 3, I think our best games have been with 3. My only guess is that he wants his plan A as slick as possible and therefore has us play it every game so come next season it's muscle memory and therefore more effective/better??

 

[Deuterz]

We scored too, but bus-conductor says we need to remove that from our XG stat.

We nullified their alleged irresistible, best in the world attack and created the better and more plentiful chances.... While they relied upon a jammy defelction.

There's no good reason to talk that down as mere bus parking and us not trying to win.

Our goal was included in the xG.

We created one proper chance. Defensively we were brilliant no doubt, heroic blocks and tackles all over the place. But it’s easier to defend and nullify an attack when you’re in a low block.

Tonight we were very good defensively (seriously, aside from a couple of lapses they were all brilliant) but offensively our counter attacking threat wasn’t quite there as it was vs City for example. Struggled to transition properly (kept succumbing to their press) and when we did get in to the final third were guilty of some sloppy play.

The one time we did put together a really well crafted move from start to finish, we scored. I think we were good value for a point but neither team really deserved more, and on our own end we were obviously the team happier to settle for it, considering some of the time wasting.

 

[LeParisien]

I think that game highlights the deficiencies of xg as well. A good chance to score is only created (according to xg) if a shot is taken. The Hojbjerg and Royal (cross which hit Son) chances were invisible on xg but were clearly good opportunities to score.

 

[bus-conductor]

The way you've tried to use XG against us IS bollocks.

Bollocks.

You saying we didn't play to win is also bollocks.

I said we didn't do enough offensively. I said if that was our aim, we failed. The reality, without spurs goggles, is outside of our goal we did very little attacking, caused them very few problems defensively, even on the counter and spent most of the game in our own third/half.

It's Liverpool away, so I'm not incandescent with rage, I'm just a bit nonplussed.

 

[bus-conductor]

We scored too, but bus-conductor says we need to remove that from our XG stat.

Did I bollocks. I said if you take that (goal chance) out there was fuck all else. IE our x/g was 0.98. The goal was 0.86 of that.

How hard is that to understand?

 

[Airfixx]

Our goal was included in the xG.

I know but:

bus-conductor said: "As I said, solid enough defensively, but they managed to limit us to an XG of 0.12 if you take off Son's goal,"

WhyDF would one do that if they're choosing to view the game purely through an XG lense?

We created one proper chance.
Defensively we were brilliant no doubt, heroic blocks and tackles all over the place. But it’s easier to defend and nullify an attack when you’re in a low block.

- PEH hit the post.
- Son(?) from edge of the box that Alison scooped up that should have been more testing.
- Davies at the back post
- Son at the back post
- PEH late header
- Kane chance he got panned for.

Meanwhile our 'heroic blocks' prevented them from anything notable apart from the VVD crossbar (which was actually the upside/back of the bar).

One really shouldn't need XG to assess the balance of chances in that game and in doing so it's got Blakey tying himself up in knots cos the style of football offends his purist tendencies.

Tonight we were very good defensively (seriously, aside from a couple of lapses they were all brilliant) but offensively our counter attacking threat wasn’t quite there as it was vs City for example.

Indeed it wasn't.... But at it's best it's absolutely lethal.

 

[Airfixx]

Bollocks.

I said we didn't do enough offensively. I said if that was our aim, we failed. The reality, without spurs goggles, is outside of our goal we did very little attacking, caused them very few problems defensively, even on the counter and spent most of the game in our own third/half.

It's Liverpool away, so I'm not incandescent with rage, I'm just a bit nonplussed.

Only one team deserved to win that game on the basis of chances created.... And they weren't wearing red.

 

[Son Spurs]

Only one team deserved to win that game on the basis of chances created.... And they weren't wearing red.

Says it all that they needed a poxy deflection to score. 2 best chances of the game were the Son goal and the Hojbjerg header at the end. They created fuck all.

 

[Fazz]

My favourite moment of the game was when Salah cut in on to his favoured left foot and was in a position he usually scores from.

Out of nowhere Benazir Davies and his gigantic balls pop up and shut the Liverpool chance down.

Not today Mr Salah, not today.