Premier League star arrested on suspicion of rape

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All I’m trying to say is that you’re innocent until proven guilty so for a serious charge such as rape make sure the case is watertight as some women do cry rape when nothing of the kind happened!

Imagine it yourself what happened to a mate of mine years ago spending the night with a woman after meeting her in a club , full consensual sec but her boyfriend got to hear about it so she claimed rape

True story but her claim didn’t stack up fortunately and she should have been prosecuted for wasting police time

So I’m not belittling the gravity of the offence but better ten rapists go free rather than an innocent man imprisoned, with all that entails inside, for a crime he didn’t commit


And that’s all I’m going to say on the matter so waffle on as you do all you like
Is it better that 10 rapists go free rather than an innocent man imprisoned? I understand the sentiment of what you're saying and you're mate had a lucky escape for sure but would you literally want 10 freed rapists? Harsh as it may seem, I'm not sure I could, in all good conscience, agree with that sentiment..it's a dilemma isn't it.
 
Your compassion for rape victims really shines through. Nice one mate.
I'm.not sure he's not showing compassion but perhaps, after what happened to his mate, is a bit more cautious based on that experience. It is such a horrible dilemma and I'm sure there is compassion for true victims of this most hateful crime...but, given his mate's experience, I can see how it leads.to doubts.
 
Is it better that 10 rapists go free rather than an innocent man imprisoned? I understand the sentiment of what you're saying and you're mate had a lucky escape for sure but would you literally want 10 freed rapists? Harsh as it may seem, I'm not sure I could, in all good conscience, agree with that sentiment..it's a dilemma isn't it.

Yes it is and of course I wouldn’t want to see any rapist get away with it but on the other hand I wouldn’t want to see an innocent man go to prison either

You can imagine what happens to nonces inside some if you are innocent that’s not justice imv
 
Yes it is and of course I wouldn’t want to see any rapist get away with it but on the other hand I wouldn’t want to see an innocent man go to prison either

You can imagine what happens to nonces inside some if you are innocent that’s not justice imv
is it really worth 10 rapists going free to rape and ruin lives for the sake of one innocent? I know your mate had a shit experience and I've no wish to jail the innocent....but that versus letting 10 actual rapists walk around and continue raping? Statistically, your argument doesn't make sense, but, emotionally it does. Head versus heart right?
 
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is it really worth 10 rapists going free to rape and ruin lives for the sake of one innocent? I know your mate had a shit experience and I've no wish to jail the innocent....but that versus letting 10 actual rapists walk around and continue raping? Statistically, your argument doesn't make sense, but, emotionally it does. Head versus heart right?
It's not about knowingly letting 10 rapists get away with it, it's letting 10 possible rapists get away with it.

It's important to have high threshold of evidence when it comes to the state doling out punishment to individuals. Any one individual is almost completely powerless against the state, if the state wants to fucking destroy them.

That is exactly what happens all across the world, including the rich and developed countries. Police planting drugs in people's vehicles, giving false testimony agianst the accused, prosecutors hiding evidence that could prove defendant's innocence. Convictions secured through all sorts of dubious means.

This is despite the principle of letting possible criminals get away because we want to be sure before the state deprives a person of their rights.
 
is it really worth 10 rapists going free to rape and ruin lives for the sake of one innocent? I know your mate had a shit experience and I've no wish to jail the innocent....but that versus letting 10 actual rapists walk around and continue raping? Statistically, your argument doesn't make sense, but, emotionally it does. Head versus heart right?

Ridiculous.

Easy for you to say but what if you were that innocent?

No, no innocent person should ever have their freedom taken away.

Ever.
 
Ridiculous.

Easy for you to say but what if you were that innocent?

No, no innocent person should ever have their freedom taken away.

Ever.
There’s always a line you have to draw. If the standard of proof was so high that you made sure 100.000000000% of guilty people were guilty, there might be hundreds or thousands of murderers that walk and end up killing someone else. It’s about finding the right balance because pure perfection in a process is almost never attainable.

Obviously you don’t want to put away dozens of innocents to make sure you catch every guilty person either. It’s a difficult balance and opinions differ on where the line should be drawn.

I just read today about a 37 year old well known physical trainer who was arrested in California today for sexual assault on at least two 14-15 yr old girls. He was arrested back in 2010 for raping an unconscious woman but acquitted. Looks like the law didn’t do its job (and he probably got off due to connections/wealth) and now there’s 2 more victims.

Here’s the quote from the 2010 woman,
"They just believed whatever he said," the woman, who asked to remain anonymous due to the sensitivity of the situation, told ESPN in a phone call. "The whole narrative through the trial was that nothing happened. ... It was just gross. I just felt alone and like they made me out to be crazy."

The woman said she had "zero connection" to people in the current case. But she added: "I knew this day was coming, but this is even worse than I thought."

Calif. trainer charged with sexually abusing minor
 
Guardian football podcast touched on the subject today, apparently PL are now enforcing permission awareness courses for all players.
Yep, and absolutely nothing to do with any recent players that were arrested for rape. Just a coincidence.
Dr Evil Whatever GIF
 
Guardian football podcast touched on the subject today, apparently PL are now enforcing permission awareness courses for all players.
Permission awareness? What the fuck sort of young men is society (schools, parents, etc) raising that they need a course for this stuff?

Fucking hell. :(
 
There’s always a line you have to draw. If the standard of proof was so high that you made sure 100.000000000% of guilty people were guilty, there might be hundreds or thousands of murderers that walk and end up killing someone else. It’s about finding the right balance because pure perfection in a process is almost never attainable.

Obviously you don’t want to put away dozens of innocents to make sure you catch every guilty person either. It’s a difficult balance and opinions differ on where the line should be drawn.

I just read today about a 37 year old well known physical trainer who was arrested in California today for sexual assault on at least two 14-15 yr old girls. He was arrested back in 2010 for raping an unconscious woman but acquitted. Looks like the law didn’t do its job (and he probably got off due to connections/wealth) and now there’s 2 more victims.

Here’s the quote from the 2010 woman,
"They just believed whatever he said," the woman, who asked to remain anonymous due to the sensitivity of the situation, told ESPN in a phone call. "The whole narrative through the trial was that nothing happened. ... It was just gross. I just felt alone and like they made me out to be crazy."

The woman said she had "zero connection" to people in the current case. But she added: "I knew this day was coming, but this is even worse than I thought."

Calif. trainer charged with sexually abusing minor

Ok well I stand by my opinion.

I do understand but that’s what I believe 👍🏾
 
Ridiculous.

Easy for you to say but what if you were that innocent?

No, no innocent person should ever have their freedom taken away.

Ever.
So by that logic, freeing 10 rapists who may rape 2.or.3.people.each (20 to 30 in total) is ok? Surely that destroys the innocence of 30 people who would not have been raped had those 10 been locked up. Like I said before, it's head versus heart and undoubtedly of it was a friend of mine them my view would change....but using ONLY cold logic, the good of the many outweighs the needs of the few ( cliche bit a good point).
 
Permission awareness? What the fuck sort of young men is society (schools, parents, etc) raising that they need a course for this stuff?

Fucking hell. :(

It's not about knowingly letting 10 rapists get away with it, it's letting 10 possible rapists get away with it.

It's important to have high threshold of evidence when it comes to the state doling out punishment to individuals. Any one individual is almost completely powerless against the state, if the state wants to fucking destroy them.

That is exactly what happens all across the world, including the rich and developed countries. Police planting drugs in people's vehicles, giving false testimony agianst the accused, prosecutors hiding evidence that could prove defendant's innocence. Convictions secured through all sorts of dubious means.

This is despite the principle of letting possible criminals get away because we want to be sure before the state deprives a person of their rights.
No. The argument raised was specifically let 10.rapists free if it meant no innocent people went to jail. Your points above are excellent though so many thanks for your input
 
So by that logic, freeing 10 rapists who may rape 2.or.3.people.each (20 to 30 in total) is ok? Surely that destroys the innocence of 30 people who would not have been raped had those 10 been locked up. Like I said before, it's head versus heart and undoubtedly of it was a friend of mine them my view would change....but using ONLY cold logic, the good of the many outweighs the needs of the few ( cliche bit a good point).

No logic there at all. Lots of ifs, buts, and maybes.

I stand by my opinion and yours disgusts me.

I’m out. Ridiculous conversation…don’t bother replying.
 
is it really worth 10 rapists going free to rape and ruin lives for the sake of one innocent? I know your mate had a shit experience and I've no wish to jail the innocent....but that versus letting 10 actual rapists walk around and continue raping? Statistically, your argument doesn't make sense, but, emotionally it does. Head versus heart right?

Sorry this is dumb for so many reasons
 
is it really worth 10 rapists going free to rape and ruin lives for the sake of one innocent? I know your mate had a shit experience and I've no wish to jail the innocent....but that versus letting 10 actual rapists walk around and continue raping? Statistically, your argument doesn't make sense, but, emotionally it does. Head versus heart right?

I think you could do with brushing up on some old school philosophy (incl. legal philosophy).

In dubio pro reo (Aristotle) ring any bell?

Blackstone’s ratio, perhaps?

People are faulty and do terrible things to each other, including rape. We, as a society, punish them. But society must not be as faulty as the people and imprison those that are innocent!

You’ve made a terrible comparison and applied a faulty logic. Learn some of the ABC’s, man.
 
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