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Transfers Summer 2021 - Transfer Thread

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Spurs are sliding at speed and route back up is packed with obstacles​

Tottenham reflect on their Carabao Cup final defeat by Manchester City at Wembley on Sunday.


At a time when money is tight the club need six new players and another new manager, and doubts surround Kane and Son

Jonathan Wilson

Jonathan Wilson
@jonawils
Mon 26 Apr 2021 05.30 EDT


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Fans from both sides at a game between two English clubs? Nature is healing. Delays on the Jubilee and Metropolitan lines on Cup final day? Nature is healing. Manchester City winning the League Cup, again? Nature is healing. Everywhere you looked on Sunday, English football was returning to normal. And there is nothing, perhaps, quite so familiar in English football as the prospect of Tottenham wondering where they go next.
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If they still had hope in the final 10 minutes it was only because of the eternal truism that a side that have had dozens of chances and failed to score will inevitably then concede to the first opportunity they give up. But for Tottenham the chance never came: Opta may have recorded that Spurs had two shots to City’s 21, but you’d be hard-pressed to remember them. At least one xG model felt the need to go to two decimal places to get Tottenham above zero.



Premier League and Carabao Cup: 10 talking points from the weekend
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There was much talk about whether Ryan Mason had been too defensive, whether he had been mistaken to have his side camp around the edge of the box like a José Mourinho tribute act. In truth, it probably wasn’t by choice. Deploying a low block and being utterly outplayed can look very similar.
Not even the Chas & Dave numerology could save Spurs, and it’s going to be another 10 years till the year next ends in one – although increasingly it looks as though the superstition only applied in the 20th century. The onslaught of money has killed that, like so much else of the old football.
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So where next for Tottenham? The Carabao Cup, really, was an opportunity to add a cosmetic sheen to the upheavals that have followed defeat in the 2019 Champions League final – the links between the two occasions underlined by the way Harry Kane stumbled about ineffectively in both having returned from ankle injury (and despite the obvious precedent of Madrid, this was by far the more understandable selection given how bad every Spurs player other than Kane has been for the past month).
Mauricio Pochettino had made clear in the buildup to that final that his squad had gone stale and needed major reinvestment; there was only so much he and his universal energy could achieve. There’s only so much negativity a bowl of lemons on the desk can absorb.
The grand new stadium, the most potent symbol of Tottenham’s elite status, was also the financial burden that prevented them remaining at that level, an irony inflated by the way the pandemic has meant it has lain empty for months. (And if the underlying logic of the proposed Super League is correct, and the future is the global fan watching on their apps, to what extent do vast stadiums matter any more?)
Harry Kane was ineffective in the cup final on his return from injury. Will he want to stay at Spurs beyond this season?

Harry Kane was ineffective in the cup final on his return from injury. Will he want to stay at Spurs beyond this season? Photograph: Tom Jenkins/The Guardian
Failure to rejuvenate the squad cost Tottenham the manager who had done more than anybody to elevate them to that elite level. Pochettino’s reward for being proved right was to be sacked. In that context the appointment of Mourinho in November 2019 can be seen as a desperate gamble to try to reinvigorate a weary squad. It failed, as Mourinho increasingly does these days, as did the desperate gamble to try to reinvigorate a weary squad by sacking him.
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So what are Spurs left with? The promise of two years ago has dissipated quickly. Kane and Son Heung-min, clearly, remain top-class talents, and Hugo Lloris, after a mid-season blip, has returned to form. But who else has played consistently well enough recently for a new manager to consider them indispensable? There have been flickers from Tanguy Ndombele; Toby Alderweireld and Eric Dier had good finals; and Sergio Reguilón is popular, although he struggled at Wembley. Others may prosper in a happier set-up.
But Kane is 27 and Son 28. Both may be considering their futures, particularly if, as seems likely, Tottenham fail to qualify for next season’s Champions League. The great consolation for Daniel Levy is that he got both to agree contracts until they are 30: if they are to leave, there will at least be reasonable recompense – although quite what that means in a world in which Covid has hammered everybody’s finances is unclear.

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Four miles to the south-west, Woolwich offer a grim warning of how quickly a club can slide, yet Tottenham seem to be following them step-by-step: investment in a great stadium diminishes revenue available to develop the squad, leading to a downturn in results and the departure of the manager who brought the success – although with Woolwich the manager was at least to an extent responsible for structures that looked increasingly outmoded. Tottenham, it seems, got rid of Pochettino because it was easier and cheaper than replacing half a dozen players.
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But now there is still the need for half a dozen new players, compensation to be paid to Mourinho – and the toxicity he inevitably leaves to be cleaned up – plus the expense of appointing a new manager and his staff. The next appointment feels crucial. Tottenham could easily find that the next time a Super League is discussed, they are no longer invited.

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Variations on a theme? These managers views on how the game should be played and the players required to do it are polar opposities. Hoddle to Santini, Redknapp to AVB, Poch to Mourinho. There is no logic or identity there and its why we seem to constantly need 6 or 7 new players when a new manager shows up to suit their style of play, that and terrible recruitment.
Santini/Jol, Ramos, AVB and Poch are the four managerial projects Levy has put together with time to think about it. (Whereas Hoddle, Redknapp, and Mourinho were all shotgun weddings)

Forward thinking, and the idea that tactical nous and especially player development can overcome resource disadvantages.

Daniel Levy's entire project is dedicated to the proposition that English football is collectively numbskulled and that success can be achieved by being smarter and more progressively minded than your competition. That idea is his life's work.

And the tragedy: he was exactly right in 2003. And now he's lived long enough to become the dinosaur others are out-maneuvering, not to mention that the clubs with the money have (at least in City and Liverpool's cases) gotten smarter and more sophisticated than Spurs are.
 
Santini/Jol, Ramos, AVB and Poch are the four managerial projects Levy has put together with time to think about it. (Whereas Hoddle, Redknapp, and Mourinho were all shotgun weddings)

Forward thinking, and the idea that tactical nous and especially player development can overcome resource disadvantages.

Daniel Levy's entire project is dedicated to the proposition that English football is collectively numbskulled and that success can be achieved by being smarter and more progressively minded than your competition. That idea is his life's work.

And the tragedy: he was exactly right in 2003. And now he's lived long enough to become the dinosaur others are out-maneuvering, not to mention that the clubs with the money have (at least in City and Liverpool's cases) gotten smarter and more sophisticated than Spurs are.
Dont disagree with most of that. His transfer policy was good in 2003 as well when he could buy cheap, young British players. We're floundering now an average player like Clarke costs £10m. Its why we need fresh eyes and a new approach. The bloke is stuck in a timewarp.
 
If we got Ten Hag in as manager and he smuggles a few of the Ajax boys in his luggage, we might stand half a chance.
:freund:
A manager who is

a) used to losing his best players
b) bringing through and developing a plethora of youth players
c) used to rebuilding
d) plays attacking football first and foremost.

A complete no brainer now that Nagelsmann is not an option
 
Santini/Jol, Ramos, AVB and Poch are the four managerial projects Levy has put together with time to think about it. (Whereas Hoddle, Redknapp, and Mourinho were all shotgun weddings)

Forward thinking, and the idea that tactical nous and especially player development can overcome resource disadvantages.

Daniel Levy's entire project is dedicated to the proposition that English football is collectively numbskulled and that success can be achieved by being smarter and more progressively minded than your competition. That idea is his life's work.

And the tragedy: he was exactly right in 2003. And now he's lived long enough to become the dinosaur others are out-maneuvering, not to mention that the clubs with the money have (at least in City and Liverpool's cases) gotten smarter and more sophisticated than Spurs are.

Partly agree.

But our early success was built on buying and developing young Britsh talent (something pushed by David Pleat) and buying players not really wanted by others eg Modric, VDV etc

Our problem is we gave up on that model to buy more ready made players (Sissoko, Aurier, Moura et al) with variable results but few outright successes.

Leicester have beeen mopping up the players we stopped buying whether it was James Justin (Luton) or Tielmans.

We probably need to go back into that market, at least in part, over the next couple of transfer windows to get the number of players we need - plus develop a couple of our own academy products every year (crazy thing is every european manager knows PL academies are producing some of the best youngsters in europe .... but PL managers rarely play them, hence reason why some now go abroad)
 
Santini/Jol, Ramos, AVB and Poch are the four managerial projects Levy has put together with time to think about it. (Whereas Hoddle, Redknapp, and Mourinho were all shotgun weddings)

Forward thinking, and the idea that tactical nous and especially player development can overcome resource disadvantages.

Daniel Levy's entire project is dedicated to the proposition that English football is collectively numbskulled and that success can be achieved by being smarter and more progressively minded than your competition. That idea is his life's work.

And the tragedy: he was exactly right in 2003. And now he's lived long enough to become the dinosaur others are out-maneuvering, not to mention that the clubs with the money have (at least in City and Liverpool's cases) gotten smarter and more sophisticated than Spurs are.
Ramos was flavour of the month, there was no planning there
 
I think its a two year re-build at best.

The 16 player core team to rebuild round :

GK - Lloris, Hart, Whiteman
Defenders : Alderwereld (one year left), Rodon, Tanganga, Reguilon, Sessegnon
Midfield : Ndombele, Lo Celso, Hojbjerg, Skipp
Forwards : Kane, Son, Moura, Bergwijn

A couple such as Moura I'm not struck on, but we cannot throw everyone out.

We won't move all the others on, so we will need to keep a couple but I'd try to move on Aurier, Doherty, Sissoko, Lamela (injury record) and listen to offers for Sanchez, Dier, Foyth, CCV, Winks, Dele whilst Rose contract is at and end as are loans for Bale and Vinicius.

Problem in moving players on are their wages - Spurs pay more than 75% of other clubs in Pl and most in europe so some won't want to move

Who we can or need to bring in is a but of a lottery but I'd expect we might want :

RB - Dumfries (PSV)
CB -
CM - Sabitzer
AM -
Striker -

Think we may struggle to do more than that, even if we want them, Might need to look at one or two u21's to be included as back up players.



Oh and we want a coach who can develop younger players ,,,,,, and someone good at recruitment
 
The Supporters Trust must send a petition to the club demanding Winks and Sissoko are sold on the first day of the window. They embody the club's slide to mediocrity over the last couple of years. We must get shot of the pair of them ASAP.
 
Feeling really pessimistic about the state of our club in general. Seem to be on a downward spiral. ENIC & Levy, regardless of manager, have to step up and bring in some exciting talent.
Here’s a potential strategy, based on realistic prices:

RB:
OUT: Aurier (10M) & Doherty (6M)
IN: Emerson R. (22M) & Centonze (10M)

LB:
OUT: Davies (7M)
IN: Sessegnon

CB:
OUT: Sanchez (20M) & Dier (14M) & Foyth (10M) & CCV (3M)
IN: Botman (35M) & Andersen (25M)

CM:
OUT: Winks (15M) & Sissoko (4M)
IN: Skipp (recall)

AM:
OUT: Alli (25M) & Bergwijn (15M) & Lamela (5M)
IN: Buendia (35M) & Bale (renew)

CF:
OUT: Vinicius
IN: Gouiri (25M)

Net Spend: £28M
 
Could have sold Rose for £40m, didn’t.

Could have sold Dier for £50m, didn’t.

Could have sold Dele for £100m, didn’t.

Could have signed Ricardo or Castagne instead of Aurier and Doherty, didn’t.

Could have signed Diop instead of Sanchez, didn’t.

Could have signed Sabitzer for half of what it cost to get Sissoko, didn’t.

Could have sold ANY of the wasters mentioned above long after the scenarios highlighted didnt work out and just cut our losses to ensure the decay wasn’t too deep, DIDN’T!!!

How we go through so many managers but the people who remain consistent with this so called recruitment panel at the club still find themselves in a job I will never know. Dud after dud, I’m pretty sure our last good quality signing made was Toby or Sonny. Pretty pathetic really and we wonder why managers fail.
 
Could have sold Rose for £40m, didn’t.

Could have sold Dier for £50m, didn’t.

Could have sold Dele for £100m, didn’t.

Could have signed Ricardo or Castagne instead of Aurier and Doherty, didn’t.

Could have signed Diop instead of Sanchez, didn’t.

Could have signed Sabitzer for half of what it cost to get Sissoko, didn’t.

Could have sold ANY of the wasters mentioned above long after the scenarios highlighted didnt work out and just cut our losses to ensure the decay wasn’t too deep, DIDN’T!!!

How we go through so many managers but the people who remain consistent with this so called recruitment panel at the club still find themselves in a job I will never know. Dud after dud, I’m pretty sure our last good quality signing made was Toby or Sonny. Pretty pathetic really and we wonder why managers fail.
Everyone loved Dier, Dele and Rose at that point. We’d just sold Walker so to then sell these guys would’ve been deemed unacceptable. Add to that the transition we were in from also ran to top 4 regular, and the aim to move away from selling/feeder club (berbatov, carrick etc).
We’ve made some howlers but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Nobody was talking about sabitzer when we signed sissoko - it was Mane - and that was a failure.
sanchez came in and was excellent- and most of us thought he had loads of potential and was a great buy, out of the blue as if we’d scouted him.
The idea of Aurier was also considered decent at the time.
you can look back at transfer threads.
People were creaming themselves about Moura even though he was on his way down when we got him.
You’re right that our recruiting policy has been erratic, not very strategic and we’ve shat ourselves at certain key times about fee and particularly wages - mane.
 
Everyone loved Dier, Dele and Rose at that point. We’d just sold Walker so to then sell these guys would’ve been deemed unacceptable. Add to that the transition we were in from also ran to top 4 regular, and the aim to move away from selling/feeder club (berbatov, carrick etc).
We’ve made some howlers but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Nobody was talking about sabitzer when we signed sissoko - it was Mane - and that was a failure.
sanchez came in and was excellent- and most of us thought he had loads of potential and was a great buy, out of the blue as if we’d scouted him.
The idea of Aurier was also considered decent at the time.
you can look back at transfer threads.
People were creaming themselves about Moura even though he was on his way down when we got him.
You’re right that our recruiting policy has been erratic, not very strategic and we’ve shat ourselves at certain key times about fee and particularly wages - mane.

Surely it’s the clubs job to identify peak moments for selling players though. They watch these guys day in, day out and what’s as important as retaining important talent is to also notice when to sell at the highest point. If they are and were too concerned with fan backlash then they aren’t strong enough to protect the best interests of THFC.

Retaining Dele, Dier and Rose has in hindsight cost the club near on £200m. It’s decisions like that that put us where we are and Leicester where they are now. They ripped out the heart of their league winning spine but got top whack for it which allowed for genuine reinvestment whilst we now rely on loans, swap deals and players with 12 months left of their contracts.

As for Sabitzer, if he was on Leipzig’s radar back when they signed him then he should have been on ours also. We are fans, not managers or scouts and inevitably I don’t mind a couple of mishaps to occur, that’s football, that’s life but to get things so wrong so much for half a decade now simply isn’t acceptable and should be a sackable offence. I think Levy has done some great things for the club, but he’s starting to live off of success stories in all but what happens on the pitch which, unfortunately for him is the most important thing in football.

We have half a dozen good players now, back when we challenged Leicester for the league we had 11. It’s as clear as crystal to me why we find ourselves where we are now. Aurier and Sanchez both in their FOURTH seasons at the club, Lamela on his SEVENTH Spurs manager now. We are awful with how to know when appropriate moves need to be made. Poch wanted to shift Sissoko after one year, the question needs to be why he wasn’t shifted. The answer sadly for me is the bloke at the top just hated the idea of taking a financial hit which ironically will cost him more with how far our star falls due to trying to wedge players of their ilk into positions once filled by the likes of Dembele, Eriksen, Walker and Vertonghen etc. We play the transfer game horrifically these days which leads me to believing Levy can take a team from 3rd tier to 2nd, but hasn’t got the minerals or nous to understand what size required for the extra step.

If you retain shit, you become shit and your good players will want out. He dropped the ball thinking about his bottom line MASSIVELY in this regard.
 
Everyone loved Dier, Dele and Rose at that point. We’d just sold Walker so to then sell these guys would’ve been deemed unacceptable. Add to that the transition we were in from also ran to top 4 regular, and the aim to move away from selling/feeder club (berbatov, carrick etc).
We’ve made some howlers but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Nobody was talking about sabitzer when we signed sissoko - it was Mane - and that was a failure.
sanchez came in and was excellent- and most of us thought he had loads of potential and was a great buy, out of the blue as if we’d scouted him.
The idea of Aurier was also considered decent at the time.
you can look back at transfer threads.
People were creaming themselves about Moura even though he was on his way down when we got him.
You’re right that our recruiting policy has been erratic, not very strategic and we’ve shat ourselves at certain key times about fee and particularly wages - mane.
Yup. Hindsight is always 20/20. But if we had sold Rose, Dier or Eriksen when they were peaking people would have been after Levy's head for a "lack of ambition" or something like that.

Our recruitment needs a massive overhaul. I am sure that Hitchen is a decent scout but I doubt that he has the qualifications for actually being technical director/head of recruitment.

If we get Potter I hope that Macaulay follows and gets the role as chief scout. That way Hitchen can focus on other duties within his role.
 
selling your best players at their height is easy its replacing them that is the problem
look at our record on signing replacements
when the transfer committee do see a player they like Levy gets agreement then tries to bully the price down ( aka Grealish)
 
you can't always find cheap good players or wait for a player to devolpe
sometimes we need to buy the finished article
we need a creative midfielder a guy who can see the pass before its there (aka Eriksen ) who it is i don't know but that is the player we need asap
 
you can't always find cheap good players or wait for a player to devolpe
sometimes we need to buy the finished article
we need a creative midfielder a guy who can see the pass before its there (aka Eriksen ) who it is i don't know but that is the player we need asap
You can always find cheap players with growth potential. And it can be combined with buying finished articles. But we have recently taken it too far.

We've just become spoiled by a few years of relative success and now seem to think that we don't need to develop players. If a player doesn't hit the ground running they are garbage and we need to get rid immediately it seems.
 
The 16 player core team to rebuild round :

GK - Lloris, Hart, Whiteman
Defenders : Alderwereld (one year left), Rodon, Tanganga, Reguilon, Sessegnon
Midfield : Ndombele, Lo Celso, Hojbjerg, Skipp
Forwards : Kane, Son, Moura, Bergwijn
Kane and Son are most definitely saying their goodbyes in the summer ... It is going to be a totally new team that needs to be built with a budget of about 150mil I would think.

A tall ask even on football manager to pull it off
 
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