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Because if Kane gets injured or stays goalless we will struggle.
He scored 30 goals last season. If he can even half that, we will benefit greatly.


And that CB is doing a stellar job at CB. Your disregard for steady partnerships and stability at the back is FMesque...yeah just throw Wimmer in, nothing will change. Sigh


Rate him highly. Backed him waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back when he was just Tims son and getting games to spite Holtby and AVB.

But Dier is a far superior DM. As proven by our ineffectiveness there last year
I think the system we played against Qarabag was reasonably effective without Kane, not sure our attacking system would have been more effective with some of the names that were thrown up like Austin. Obviously Berahino would have been ideal, but could not get the deal over the line.

I'm not advocating that we move Toby to DM, just saying it is an option if worst comes to worst. How can you say you rate Bentaleb when you say we didn't even have a double pivot last season and say that he isn't backup to Dier at the very least? Yes Dier has looked better than Bentaleb so far this season. I'm sure we would prefer to play Vertonghen over Fazio as well, but these players are squad players and are cover.
 
How can you say you rate Bentaleb when you say we didn't even have a double pivot last season and say that he isn't backup to Dier at the very least?

I think Bentaleb is a different type of player. He's not a defensive player who will protect the back four the way that Dier does. I'd like to see Bentaleb have a couple of games alongside Dier to see what he can do when he is set free, much the same way Mason has looked better than last season, now that he's allowed to get forward.
 
Bentaleb and Alli are apparently the fittest players at the club according to Eric Dier. I would like to see either Bentaleb or Alli moved forward a bit so we can play Dier, Bentaleb and Alli together. Start running teams into the ground.
 
I think Bentaleb is a different type of player. He's not a defensive player who will protect the back four the way that Dier does. I'd like to see Bentaleb have a couple of games alongside Dier to see what he can do when he is set free, much the same way Mason has looked better than last season, now that he's allowed to get forward.
Yeah I think he'd be better used in the Mason role if Dier is fit. But he's fine backup if Dier is injured or needs to be rested in the DM role, that was the role he played last season. Bentaleb alongside Dier does allow both Alli and Mason to get further forward, which could be interesting. Not sure if Mason and Alli could both fit into the attacking 3.
 
I think the system we played against Qarabag was reasonably effective without Kane, not sure our attacking system would have been more effective with some of the names that were thrown up like Austin. Obviously Berahino would have been ideal, but could not get the deal over the line.

I'm not advocating that we move Toby to DM, just saying it is an option if worst comes to worst. How can you say you rate Bentaleb when you say we didn't even have a double pivot last season and say that he isn't backup to Dier at the very least? Yes Dier has looked better than Bentaleb so far this season. I'm sure we would prefer to play Vertonghen over Fazio as well, but these players are squad players and are cover.

It is pretty clear that we are not interested in Austin, so it is a bit academic, but for me the issue is in games where we have a lot of the ball in and around the opponents box and the score is 0-0. We have been in those positions many times in the last couple of seasons.
In a game like that, would he force one in? Because 1-0 changes the whole pattern of the game for teams that try to sit deep and play us on the break ... which is about two-thirds of the teams in the league.
 
Yeah I think he'd be better used in the Mason role if Dier is fit. But he's fine backup if Dier is injured or needs to be rested in the DM role, that was the role he played last season. Bentaleb alongside Dier does allow both Alli and Mason to get further forward, which could be interesting. Not sure if Mason and Alli could both fit into the attacking 3.

I don't quite agree. I felt a lot of the time last season that Mason would sit back and do the dirty work or both Mason and Bentaleb would sit back, which would then stifle our own midfield. But if Bentaleb puts the work in in training and learns from how Dier is playing the role, I'd be more than happy to see him play that role and prove me wrong.

It's not that I would flat out refuse to play him alongside Mason or Alli, I just think all three of them would do better alongside Dier or an alternative defensive midfielder.
 
It is pretty clear that we are not interested in Austin, so it is a bit academic, but for me the issue is in games where we have a lot of the ball in and around the opponents box and the score is 0-0. We have been in those positions many times in the last couple of seasons.
In a game like that, would he force one in? Because 1-0 changes the whole pattern of the game for teams that try to sit deep and play us on the break ... which is about two-thirds of the teams in the league.
I think a lot of that is just our shit finishing. Far often last season it was Kane, Chadli and Eriksen or nothing. Hopefully Son addresses some of this, along with more contribution from Lamela, Alli and Mason getting more as well. Part of the reason I don't rate Dembele as much as some. Yes he holds the ball well, very well but has almost no forward impetus. I do see his value in big games though.
 
I don't quite agree. I felt a lot of the time last season that Mason would sit back and do the dirty work or both Mason and Bentaleb would sit back, which would then stifle our own midfield. But if Bentaleb puts the work in in training and learns from how Dier is playing the role, I'd be more than happy to see him play that role and prove me wrong.

It's not that I would flat out refuse to play him alongside Mason or Alli, I just think all three of them would do better alongside Dier or an alternative defensive midfielder.
Yeah I wouldn't replace Dier with Bentaleb at this point at all. Not with how Dier has been going.
But in cup games and europa games Bentaleb is good enough for that role. Just is a matter of ensuring that our attacking 3 do enough on the defensive side as well, making sure we break up as many attacks as possible further up the pitch. And pulling their DM's around the pitch like Eriksen did to Matic in the 5-3. This nullifies a lot of the defensive strengths that some teams have over. Dier has taken to the role like a duck to water though, and he's looking like a real destroyer there.
 
. But if Bentaleb puts the work in in training and learns from how Dier is playing the role, I'd be more than happy to see him play that role and prove me wrong.

I just think all three of them would do better alongside Dier or an alternative defensive midfielder.

He's only been doing it a few weeks, maybe Dier has to keep learning first before others learn from him.

We don't have one!
 
I think the system we played against Qarabag was reasonably effective without Kane, not sure our attacking system would have been more effective with some of the names that were thrown up like Austin. Obviously Berahino would have been ideal, but could not get the deal over the line.

I'm not advocating that we move Toby to DM, just saying it is an option if worst comes to worst. How can you say you rate Bentaleb when you say we didn't even have a double pivot last season and say that he isn't backup to Dier at the very least? Yes Dier has looked better than Bentaleb so far this season. I'm sure we would prefer to play Vertonghen over Fazio as well, but these players are squad players and are cover.

Qarabag tore us apart on the counter with some very fast, incisive moves several times but lacked a finish.

Look at Son's goals, unmarked from a corner at 5yds out and the Alli cut back (suspicions of offside in the build up). They were defensively pretty poor.

Really not a great benchmark of a game. Not sure we'll play anybody at their level all season and still they looked like they could give us some problems.

As for if 'worst comes to the worst', that happens as soon as Dier and/or Kane don't play. It's pathetic to be having to draft in emergency/makeshift options as literally a second choice. Could be in any crucial game at any time all season - regardless of the past 3 wins it remains a huge negligence.
 
Qarabag tore us apart on the counter with some very fast, incisive moves several times but lacked a finish.

Look at Son's goals, unmarked from a corner at 5yds out and the Alli cut back (suspicions of offside in the build up). They were defensively pretty poor.

Really not a great benchmark of a game. Not sure we'll play anybody at their level all season and still they looked like they could give us some problems.

As for if 'worst comes to the worst', that happens as soon as Dier and/or Kane don't play. It's pathetic to be having to draft in emergency/makeshift options as literally a second choice. Could be in any crucial game at any time all season - regardless of the past 3 wins it remains a huge negligence.
Was more talking about our attacking front 4 in the qarabag game. Even if they were defensively pretty poor, we still did well to take our chances. Disagree that they looked like they could give us some problems, we were thoroughly in control of that game. Yes it's not the best benchmark, but it's the only one without Kane so far that I can use. We'll see how we go without him soon enough. Yes he's a valuable focal point, but it's not as if he's been smashing them in in the Prem.
I didn't see anyone complaining about an emergency and makeshift option when Mason and Bentaleb were our double pivot last season? Now all of a sudden it's panic stations if he's injured or needs a rest, just because he's playing well. What player could we have bought that would have been down the pecking order to Dier? Bentaleb is absolutely fine as back up to Dier.
 
They are OK, but Southampton last year and Swansea this year are better. I don't understand why people are wanking over them, it is the Chelsea win I guess. Otherwise their points are from wins v Norwich and Villa.

Fair enough. Personally, for me it's because I kind of like the football and the fans, I guess.
 
Qarabag tore us apart on the counter with some very fast, incisive moves several times but lacked a finish.

Look at Son's goals, unmarked from a corner at 5yds out and the Alli cut back (suspicions of offside in the build up). They were defensively pretty poor.

Really not a great benchmark of a game. Not sure we'll play anybody at their level all season and still they looked like they could give us some problems.

As for if 'worst comes to the worst', that happens as soon as Dier and/or Kane don't play. It's pathetic to be having to draft in emergency/makeshift options as literally a second choice. Could be in any crucial game at any time all season - regardless of the past 3 wins it remains a huge negligence.

Qarabag did cause us a few problems defensively but I'm not sure the players mindset was right for such a 'low-level' occasion, and I think we do struggle against tricky european teams - we've seen it before in this competition.
 
Was more talking about our attacking front 4 in the qarabag game. Even if they were defensively pretty poor, we still did well to take our chances. Disagree that they looked like they could give us some problems, we were thoroughly in control of that game. Yes it's not the best benchmark, but it's the only one without Kane so far that I can use. We'll see how we go without him soon enough. Yes he's a valuable focal point, but it's not as if he's been smashing them in in the Prem.
I didn't see anyone complaining about an emergency and makeshift option when Mason and Bentaleb were our double pivot last season? Now all of a sudden it's panic stations if he's injured or needs a rest, just because he's playing well. What player could we have bought that would have been down the pecking order to Dier? Bentaleb is absolutely fine as back up to Dier.

Watching is not the same as seeing obviously, Qarabag created against us and could've had 2-3. As supposedly much inferior opposition and being the away side, they did as much as they could, Palace similarly on Sunday. Ok it's not realistic to expect opposition to have no chances but they created as much as they gifted us.

As for Mason and Bentaleb last season, what are you on about? We were dead on our feet from end of Feb/March, even with Mason only coming in from October-ish. There was plenty of noise about rotation and cover and debates about the 'deadwood' such as Paulinho, Capoue and Stambouli. It was widely agreed we needed a new CDM, we got Dier for this but ditched all the other, remotely similar cover.

Anyway, fuck all this, we're all on the same side, especially the next 24hours!
 
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