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Manager Thomas Frank

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Are you Frank Out or In?

  • Total voters
    623
Notabadsquad said:
Not really sure there are that many teams which attack Liverpool.

Expect Wirtz and Isak to score.

Much as I think the game of assessment is against Palace, a heavy loss (very possible) and significant fan displeasure, and Frank's gone.
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In recent weeks, the teams that have done best against Liverpool are the ones prepared to have a proper go at them.

Although Im not advocating any sort of kamikazee approach.

Rather, we need to be seen to be proactive in wanting to attack them, rather than passive and defensive.

I agree completely though - significant fan displeasure (and I do think it possible against Liverpool) and he is on a rapidly increasing curve to the sack.

We're at home, the home crowd are already on the fence, and we need to show initiative. If he sets us up (as I suspect he will) to be too respectful of Liverpool, I think things can go very badly for him very quickly

EDIT - What are the chances he starts a back 5 + Palinha? Unless that somehow was a savvy tactic for us to pick them off and end up comfortably dominant - I think it would get very ugly for him with a half time chorus that just ramps up the pressure on him...
 
postbox said:
In recent weeks, the teams that have done best against Liverpool are the ones prepared to have a proper go at them.

Although Im not advocating any sort of kamikazee approach.

Rather, we need to be seen to be proactive in wanting to attack them, rather than passive and defensive.

I agree completely though - significant fan displeasure (and I do think it possible against Liverpool) and he is on a rapidly increasing curve to the sack.

We're at home, the home crowd are already on the fence, and we need to show initiative. If he sets us up (as I suspect he will) to be too respectful of Liverpool, I think things can go very badly for him very quickly
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They have steadied their ship. Salah will have gone, so less of that uneasiness.

We haven't got the tools and we certainly don't have the confidence.

I don't think it ever matters too much how a team is set-up. All about the performances.

Sunday was a prime example. Nothing too wrong with the formation, but look at what was delivered.
 
Notabadsquad said:
They have steadied their ship. Salah will have gone, so less of that uneasiness.

We haven't got the tools and we certainly don't have the confidence.

I don't think it ever matters too much how a team is set-up. All about the performances.

Sunday was a prime example. Nothing too wrong with the formation, but look at what was delivered.
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Yes and no - the set up often shows the intent - and thats really the bit Im trying to get to

I dont think he can afford to show them too much respect, too much fear, have a small club "lets do everything to defend and thats it" approach...

If he went more aggressive, had some plans to try and get through them, and we had a good go - I think many a fan would take a loss for the step forward in tactics etc

If we just dont show up, again, I think the clock is ticking

And if we "do a Brentford [insert small club here]" and just try to shut up shop he is basically toast.
 
postbox said:
Yes and no - the setup often shows the intent - and thats really the bit Im trying to get to

I dont think he can afford to show them too much respect, too much fear, have a small club "lets do everything to defend and thats it" approach...

If he went more aggressive, had some plans to try and get through them, and we had a good go - I think many a fan would take a loss for the step forward in tactics etc

If we just dont show up, again, I think the clock is ticking

And if we "do a Brentford [insert small club here]" and just try to shut up shop he is basically toast.
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Intent counts for little if you don't and can't do the basics.

There is only 1 outcome in my mind.

1 win in 9 offers nothing.
 
Notabadsquad said:
Intent counts for little if you don't and can't do the basics.

There is only 1 outcome in my mind.

1 win in 9 offers nothing.
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Intent counts for a hell of a lot (espeically when theres nothing else on offer).

Showing fear, inferiority - its just showing he doesnt have the right stuff for the job.

Showing some aggression, some ambition - shows he might have what it takes to get us where we all want to be.

Frank has to prove himself, and for me how he approaches this game is becoming something of a litmus test.

The result is almost irrelevant - I think most expect a loss - its the "how" that really counts right now.

Can we see green shoots of something coming together? If we can - we can move forward, if we cant - the pressure mounts rapidly
 
Airfixx said:
MF balance/stability is such a prime factor....... Perhaps TF is struggling in that aspect due to not being used to the demands of rotation brought about by twice weekly football?


The minimum I expect from any manager/players is to be in the fight the vast majority of games.... Even if a very occasional stinker is somewhat inevitable from the majority of teams. The frequency of flat out non-performances (akin to the worst of last season) is a grave concern.
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Is the problem though that despite many options, none of our midfielders are actually elite enough regardless of rotation? That Forest midfield was streets ahead of anything we have for example.
 
Pathfinder said:
www.givemesport.com

David Ornstein Issues Thomas Frank Sack Update at Tottenham as Club Make Decision

Thomas Frank’s position at Tottenham Hotspur is not under any immediate threat.
www.givemesport.com www.givemesport.com

Ornstein, speaking on NBC Sports, revealed that while Tottenham are discussing Frank and his position in regular meetings, there is no suggestion the Dane is under any immediate threat:

“The word coming out of Tottenham Hotspur tonight is that they fully support Thomas Frank, and they are backing him.
“That the leadership at the club, of course, now it's in a more full-on way, the Lewis family, after Daniel Levy was sacked in September, you could say this was a first sort of true test of their control of the club.
“And everything we're hearing at the moment is that they are squarely behind Thomas Frank and that they want to see improvement in the team, and also, of course, results.
“Now it's been a particularly difficult period for them, and there is concern in the fan base clearly.
“There are regular meetings taking place, and we're told that within these meetings, of course, Thomas Frank and his position are discussed, but not in an abnormal way, and there's no suggestion coming to us that he is under any immediate threat.”
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New board, but still incapable of making the correct decision in a timely manner. This isn't getting any better. Therefore sack him and move on. This lot make Levy look competent.
 
BrightonSpurs said:
Is the problem though that despite many options, none of our midfielders are actually elite enough regardless of rotation? That Forest midfield was streets ahead of anything we have for example.
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The base level shouldn't be dependent on comprising elite players.......

We don't have the worst MF options in the league...... Or worse than Bodo Glint.
 
scarletjim said:
Hold on though, let's be sensible - it's ludicrously unlikely that we are going down - we have about 70% more points than the team in 18th (I know some dumb people will say "but that's only 9 points" - yes because only 16 games have been played - but having 70% more points than the team in 18th by this stage of the season would be an incredibly unusual position from which to get relegated (especially given that Wolves are as good as gone already)). BUT that aside, I agree we're in a terrible place. I just don't think that has very much to do with the January window - it's incredibly rare to bring in multiple key players in that window, and even if we did, the consensus on here seems to be that both the players and also the manager are failing, so if Frank (as it seems from watching games) has no real plan, then a couple of new players isn't going to change that.

Also, when you talk about "all three" having something to prove, only the owners have significant influence over the window, so a 'good window' can't be driven by Frank (not in any real sense) or the players, they have to get on with their own jobs. Will ENIC care that much about fan patience? If the main fan problem is the manager, and the board agrees / is unsure about Frank, then it would be strange for the board to then spend large amounts on new players for him. I might be wrong, just my view.

What I will grant you is that it could be a more important winter window than some, despite the usual knicker-wetting posters saying that every single one is the 'most important in this century' etc or other such hyperbolic nonsense. It was only meant to be a tongue-in-cheek comment tbh, and I do appreciate your sentiment. :)

PS RE: "The end of Levy" - can you believe there some idiots on here who genuinely seem to believe that his leaving was effectively their doing - as if after ignoring their moaning for 20 years, the club suddenly decided to listen to them, rather than quite rightly having made that decision 100% irrespective of them. 😂
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So to summarise this: we are unlikely to get relegated because we are 9 points clear of 18th after 16 games. Okay, I'm glad your standards haven't slipped too far. Jesus Christ Man - you sound like Frank trying to defend the utter shit show we see every match by pointing at the league table from last season. You have been gaslit so much you now believe our ceiling to be on a par with Fulham, Brighton, Bournemouth and Palace.
 
Notabadsquad said:
I said of Frank a while back and I think quite important.

He has no voice in the dressing room or amongst the players. I don't mean his own, but no one he brought with him from Brentford. No compatriot. No one it seems who thought 'great' Frank's coming in.

Potter had the same at West Ham, and arguably Postecoglou at Forest, although slightly different given the circumstances of his appointment.

Look at Amorim. Average at best for his time at United, but he is clever and lucky that he has the captain, who he always plays and who of course is his compatriot. Makes a massive difference and buys a degree of loyalty, and a voice of support.

Frank can't turn this round in my opinion. I hope he proves me wrong but the players aren't going to run through walls for someone they don't care too much about.
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Frank also has a captain. But the problem is that he doesn't influence and activate his teammates, but rather gets involved in private situations where he loses his head, and you fear he will be sent off. Honestly. Porro and Romero should be able to control and influence their team, but both seem to only think about themselves. Davis should be captain. Proud and hardworking, and can easily go in and play a left back with responsibility, running and passing
 
_mehstg said:
So to summarise this: we are unlikely to get relegated because we are 9 points clear of 18th after 16 games. Okay, I'm glad your standards haven't slipped too far. Jesus Christ Man - you sound like Frank trying to defend the utter shit show we see every match by pointing at the league table from last season. You have been gaslit so much you now believe our ceiling to be on a par with Fulham, Brighton, Bournemouth and Palace.
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WTF are you on about, I'm not defending anything, our performances have been terrible, half our players look like they don't give a shit, and Frank doesn't seem to have any idea what he's doing or what his 'plan' is for how we play! Of course we are miles below our ceiling - what on earth in my post makes you think that I think otherwise? Where did I say that I'm comfortable with our position or our play, and that it's in keeping with 'my standards'? What an odd complete misunderstanding of what I was saying. :/
 
scarletjim said:
WTF are you on about, I'm not defending anything, our performances have been terrible, half our players look like they don't give a shit, and Frank doesn't seem to have any idea what he's doing or what his 'plan' is for how we play! Of course we are miles below our ceiling - what on earth in my post makes you think that I think otherwise? Where did I say that I'm comfortable with our position or our play, and that it's in keeping with 'my standards'? What an odd complete misunderstanding of what I was saying. :/
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Because the first part of your post was focusing on data that suggests we won't get relegated like it's some sort of blessing. However, if I have misunderstood the purpose of your post I apologise. I get riled with posters pointing to 17th like that was some sort or norm.
 
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