"Yid" chanting...

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Yid chants, offensive?

  • Yes

    Votes: 27 7.8%
  • No

    Votes: 317 92.2%

  • Total voters
    344

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I8AVB

Suspended
DEFINITION

In Yiddish, the word "Yid" Yiddish: ייד is neutral or even complimentary, and in Ashkenazi Yiddish-speaking circles it is frequently used to mean simply "fellow," "chap," "buddy," "mate," etc., with no expressed emphasis on Jewishness (although this may be implied by the intra-Jewish context). Plural is יידן [jidn].
In Yiddish, a polite way to address a fellow Jew whose name one does not know is Reb Yid, meaning "Sir." The Yiddish words yidish or yiddisher (from Middle High German jüdisch) is an adjective derived from the noun Yid, and thus means "Jewish".
 
The essence of my argument is , by removing the word we remove our association with the Jewish connection (which we are removed anyway). Then Chelsea and WH or whoever would have no reason to sing about Hitler and hissing. If they were to resort to that kind of abuse, then their actions would be seen as a clear racist taunt, they would have no reason to do it. Why do we need to hang on to a word that incorrectly identifies us as a club and supporters in 2013. You are correct, words do come in and out of fashion and meanings change. but its not the meaning its the association in this case.
The essence of you argument is wrong.
I have been going Spurs since 1972, and when I was old enough, around 12 1976 when I started going every game, I understood when heard all the anti semitic chants from Arse, West Ham and Chelsea and Millwall fans. Did we call ourselves YIDS then? NO, we didn't.
Whilst the monkey chants and banana throwing stopped, the anti semitic chants towards us never did. Nobody did anything about it, that is until we started using the word YID. Not even Baddiel. He was doing his Avi Cohen and Jason Lee stuff when he could have.
So, how will us not using the word it stop them? A racist, Nazi is a racist Nazi.
Are you going to have the brothers stop using Nigger as a term of endearment? It's all about context. Rightly so the brothers have reclaimed the word. However, it's still offensive if used in a derogatory way, and the racists will always say it in that manner. That's the essence of all this...context.
They need to start arresting the fans they escort to our ground who vitriollically chant 'hook nose', 'one man went to gas' and hiss, etc., etc., ad nausea on their way to WHL, and then eject them when they start it up inside.
Why did they do nothing to those West Ham fans last season who 'hooked nosed', 'hissed' and sung about Hitler?
Until you nick/eject their fans for doing it, it will not stop.

What really makes me laugh is that Arse, West Ham and Chelsea also have Jewish owners. Chelsea owe their recent success to a Jew, and if it wasn't for the money of that Ashkenazi Jew they'd not even be here today.
 
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The essence of you argument is wrong.
I have been going Spurs since 1972, and when I was old enough, around 12 1976 when I started going every game, I understood when heard all the anti semitic chants from Arse, West Ham and Chelsea and Millwall fans. Did we call ourselves YIDS then? NO, we didn't.
Whilst the monkey chants and banana throwing stopped, the anti semitic chants towards us never did. Nobody did anything about it, that is until we started using the word YID. Not even Baddiel. He was doing his Avi Cohen and Jason Lee stuff when he could have.
So, how will us not using the word it stop them? A racist, Nazi is a racist Nazi.
Are you going to have the brothers stop using Nigger as a term of endearment? It's all about context. Rightly so the brothers have reclaimed the word. However, it's still offensive if used in a derogatory way, and the racists will always say it in that manner. That's the essence of all this...context.
They need to start arresting the fans they escort to our ground who vitriollically chant 'hook nose', 'one man went to gas' and hiss, etc., etc., ad nausea on their way to WHL, and then eject them when they start it up inside.
Why did they do nothing to those West Ham fans last season who 'hooked nosed', 'hissed' and sung about Hitler?
Until you nick/eject their fans for doing it, it will not stop.

What really makes me laugh is that Arse, West Ham and Chelsea also have Jewish owners. Chelsea owe their recent success to a Jew, and if it wasn't for the money of that Ashkenazi Jew they'd not even be here today.
Total respect and I agree - ged rid of the Nob-heads.
 
However, it's still offensive if used in a derogatory way, and the racists will always say it in that manner. That's the essence of all this...context.
They need to start arresting the fans they escort to our ground who vitriollically chant 'hook nose', 'one man went to gas' and hiss, etc., etc., ad nausea on their way to WHL, and then eject them when they start it up inside.
Why did they do nothing to those West Ham fans last season who 'hooked nosed', 'hissed' and sung about Hitler?
Until you nick/eject their fans for doing it, it will not stop.

What really makes me laugh is that Arse, West Ham and Chelsea also have Jewish owners. Chelsea owe their recent success to a Jew, and if it wasn't for the money of that Ashkenazi Jew they'd not even be here today.
Ahhh, yeah, but no but... Hook-nose & Hissing don't containt he word YID, therefore don't offend Baddeil, therefore it don't count!
Context is fuck all in this day and age of instant opinion... if you hear it, you;re offended by it, regardless of taking the wider context into consideration... after all, if the jumped up pricks on the internet say Spurs fans and not Chelsea/West Ham are the racists for shouting YID, then obviously we're racist!!

the whole one-sidedness of the subject stinks to high heaven!
 

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As a side note, although it is no longer deemed as an arrestable offence. Has anyone ever been convicted of using the word "Yid" as an insult at a football match ?
Seems to be a massive waste of time and money by the authorities, whipped up by a massive waste of time, and unfunny Chav.
No doubt he will have a lot to say about this desision.
 
The essence of you argument is wrong.
I have been going Spurs since 1972, and when I was old enough, around 12 1976 when I started going every game, I understood when heard all the anti semitic chants from Arse, West Ham and Chelsea and Millwall fans. Did we call ourselves YIDS then? NO, we didn't.
Whilst the monkey chants and banana throwing stopped, the anti semitic chants towards us never did. Nobody did anything about it, that is until we started using the word YID. Not even Baddiel. He was doing his Avi Cohen and Jason Lee stuff when he could have.
So, how will us not using the word it stop them? A racist, Nazi is a racist Nazi.
Are you going to have the brothers stop using Nigger as a term of endearment? It's all about context. Rightly so the brothers have reclaimed the word. However, it's still offensive if used in a derogatory way, and the racists will always say it in that manner. That's the essence of all this...context.
They need to start arresting the fans they escort to our ground who vitriollically chant 'hook nose', 'one man went to gas' and hiss, etc., etc., ad nausea on their way to WHL, and then eject them when they start it up inside.
Why did they do nothing to those West Ham fans last season who 'hooked nosed', 'hissed' and sung about Hitler?
Until you nick/eject their fans for doing it, it will not stop.

What really makes me laugh is that Arse, West Ham and Chelsea also have Jewish owners. Chelsea owe their recent success to a Jew, and if it wasn't for the money of that Ashkenazi Jew they'd not even be here today.
I am told by a reliable source, that the cctv cameras in the new ground will be able to identify every single face in a crowd of 61000.
They will have no excuse then.
 

Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
I find this an extremely disappointing statement. It just goes to show how out of touch the Met now is with the Jewish community. We are being sidelined left, right and centre because of the diminished community. No, most Spurs fans don't use it to be offensive, but some will. How can they say there will be no prosecutions? How can they assure Jewish fans that nobody who walks through the gates of WHL isn't an anti-semite?

Yes, a great deal of Spurs fans don't use it with the intent to be offensive. Yes, some Jewish fans don't view it as offensive (usually the younger ones) but the lady in the video Spurs_Bob Spurs_Bob says exactly what I knew growing up. Fuck Baddiel, he takes it too far, but she is spot on.

I long ago accepted that Spurs fans will use the Y word and generally don't intend offense. But at a time when you've got Chelsea fans selling anti-Semitic t-shirts I think it's wrong, and ignorant, for the police to much such a statement when there are still Jews who find the Y word offensive. It's just another example of the slow, creeping dismissal of anti-semitism that is increasing on a daily basis.
 
I find this an extremely disappointing statement. It just goes to show how out of touch the Met now is with the Jewish community. We are being sidelined left, right and centre because of the diminished community. No, most Spurs fans don't use it to be offensive, but some will. How can they say there will be no prosecutions? How can they assure Jewish fans that nobody who walks through the gates of WHL isn't an anti-semite?

Yes, a great deal of Spurs fans don't use it with the intent to be offensive. Yes, some Jewish fans don't view it as offensive (usually the younger ones) but the lady in the video Spurs_Bob Spurs_Bob says exactly what I knew growing up. Fuck Baddiel, he takes it too far, but she is spot on.

I long ago accepted that Spurs fans will use the Y word and generally don't intend offense. But at a time when you've got Chelsea fans selling anti-Semitic t-shirts I think it's wrong, and ignorant, for the police to much such a statement when there are still Jews who find the Y word offensive. It's just another example of the slow, creeping dismissal of anti-semitism that is increasing on a daily basis.
Yes, I knew you'd be disappointed - l posted it only as a matter of interest. Perhaps it would help the Met's ever decreasing resources if they no longer have to worry about it at the Lane? And can concentrate on the people who are using it to abuse, and offend.
 

Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
Yes, I knew you'd be disappointed - l posted it only as a matter of interest. Perhaps it would help the Met's ever decreasing resources if they no longer have to worry about it at the Lane? And can concentrate on the people who are using it to abuse, and offend.
Mate, there are going to be police at the Lane come what may. That's why I find it frustrating.

It is a dying insult, without question. But the issue I have is that because a distinct percentage of Jews who attend WHL are not generation-ally divorced from the slur, it's assumed that no Jew in the ground has an issue with it, and therefore the police can decide that it isn't universally offensive. That just doesn't seem right to me, especially at a time when we have seen a significant increase in anti-Semitic attacks in the UK.
 
Mate, there are going to be police at the Lane come what may. That's why I find it frustrating.

It is a dying insult, without question. But the issue I have is that because a distinct percentage of Jews who attend WHL are not generation-ally divorced from the slur, it's assumed that no Jew in the ground has an issue with it, and therefore the police can decide that it isn't universally offensive. That just doesn't seem right to me, especially at a time when we have seen a significant increase in anti-Semitic attacks in the UK.
l don't think the Met has assumed that at all, and as you say it would be wrong of them to do so. I think they've simply acknowledged the difficulty of making charges stick at our ground.
 

Smoked Salmon

Finest human being of all time
l don't think the Met has assumed that at all, and as you say it would be wrong of them to do so. I think they've simply acknowledged the difficulty of making charges stick at our ground.
Of course they've assumed it. They're making it very difficult to prosecute someone in WHL if they're making a blanket statement that the use of the slur is universally ok while in the stadium. Can we really say that there are never going to be anti-Semitics in WHL that wouldn't aggressively taunt a Jewish fan with the slur?
 
I find this an extremely disappointing statement. It just goes to show how out of touch the Met now is with the Jewish community. We are being sidelined left, right and centre because of the diminished community. No, most Spurs fans don't use it to be offensive, but some will. How can they say there will be no prosecutions? How can they assure Jewish fans that nobody who walks through the gates of WHL isn't an anti-semite?

Yes, a great deal of Spurs fans don't use it with the intent to be offensive. Yes, some Jewish fans don't view it as offensive (usually the younger ones) but the lady in the video Spurs_Bob Spurs_Bob says exactly what I knew growing up. Fuck Baddiel, he takes it too far, but she is spot on.

I long ago accepted that Spurs fans will use the Y word and generally don't intend offense. But at a time when you've got Chelsea fans selling anti-Semitic t-shirts I think it's wrong, and ignorant, for the police to much such a statement when there are still Jews who find the Y word offensive. It's just another example of the slow, creeping dismissal of anti-semitism that is increasing on a daily basis.
I think you are overdoing the political corectness here. (Or I have possibly misunderstood what you`re trying to say.)

I might not be a laywer, but for me statement by the metropolitan police just shows that they have some common sense. Arresting Spurs fans for using `yid`when it`s obvious that it`s used in a proud/positive way, embracing our jewish heritage is just bollocks. It doesn`t say anyone supporter group can use it. I might be stupid, but for me, the fact that we and Ajax use it is a big :dembelefingers: to fans of other clubs that show anti-semitic behaviour.

BTW, the article in the post above yours is a great read.
 

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For what it's worth, I am the son of Irish immigrants and grew up with what we now call Racism.
I was forever being called an IRA terrorist, a thick Paddy etc. I could have got the gloves on every hour on the hour if I chose to, but that would mean leading a life of conflict.
I soon came to realise that I was being insulted by a very narrow section of society. It eventually became a source of amusement, as I believe that offence can never be given, only taken. Sticks and stones and all that. To be offended lent a legitimacy to the neanderthals.
I drew further enjoyment from having a point of reference, i.e. these creatures showed me how much I had evolved.
We will never be rid of them but we can lead them on into the figurative cages reserved for them.
I have old school Chelsea friends who refer to me as a Yid, but are embarrassed by the knuckle draggers at Stamford Bridge.
We all need a group to belong to. The 'YIds' is as good as any.
 
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