Because of either two things. We won’t pay the £30 million they want or we aren’t even in for him and it’s just the usual made up shit we read on a weekly basis.
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Transfers Summer Transfer Thread 2023! - Closed (Maybe)
- Thread starter Fattynomates
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Spurs primary should be winning things if we are honestly about being a football club.Sorry but this is extremely naive and overly simplistic. In 'real life', trophies are actually pretty much irrelevant for the vast majority of clubs, so it might be more wise to say that the primary sports-related* goal for any club is to exceed it's expectations of footballing success over the medium to long term (or at least something like that).
Why do I say 'exceed expectations' rather than 'win trophies'? Well, surely the sports-related target of the management should be to do better than expected, or maybe better than resources would suggest is possible. Hence if Man City win the PL this season and Luton finish 2nd, surely we'd all agree that Luton deserve more congratulations than Man City, they would have had more relative 'success' when you factor in the context. Well that's the way I see it anyway - you're welcome to disagree and say that you'd think City more deserving of praise in that scenario if you wish, that's your prerogative - but I suspect most would say Luton had been more successful there.
Why do I say 'medium to long term'? Well, any team with a bit of good form and/or good luck can have a good season or a good cup run - a bit like with investing, there will always be short-term ups and downs - but it doesn't really make sense to judge the management's overall tenure on a single season.
What's my point here? Well, Levy will be trying to balance financial success with footballing success. He may not always do it well, but that is surely what he will be trying to do. Hence, going back to the origin of this conversation, he will naturally want to get good value for money when buying players, as would any business buying any asset. Yes you might sometimes pay over the market price, but only if you were confident that the asset would have some attribute that you could exploit better than others, thereby still making it good value for you. If it was only about 'winning trophies' - i.e. if money was irrelevant - then yes he should spend £500m on the best player - but money isn't irrelevant, it is both relevant and finite, so Levy will do whatever he thinks right in terms of investing in the football side at a level he believes will also ultimately benefit the business side. Does he always get that right? Of course not, no one does - but that is what he will always be trying to do, and should be trying to do.
So for me, even we do buy a player for £150m, we should only be doing so if we consider that to be 'good value' for us.
Side-note:
* I say 'sports-related' as, whether you or other football romantics like it or not, football clubs are businesses, and for many of them, the owners if they are honest are more interested in growing the value of their asset than footballing success. Now of course the latter may assist the former, but that's not the point - the point is that owners might well consider asset value as more important than footballing success, and it would be wise for fans to remember that. This of course is the owners' right - contrary to what many fans seem to think, the owners by definition own the clb as an asset, hence within reason and law, they can run it however they wish, focus on whatever they want etc. That is their right earned by achieving sufficient wealth to purchase the asset. If you have or save up enough money, you can do the same.
We all suspect that Levy/ENIC don’t have winning things as their primary target. In fact, their actions pretty much evidence that winning isn’t their primary target.
The risk of that is Orban might agree to a deal elsewhere in the meantime.
If we're having a rebuild Levy needs to cut his loses and accept lower bids for the players that we want to leave the club.
What's new?!
Where can I donate ?
I'm concerned that our CF for this season is going to be Richarlison, He's been a flop so far, apart from the game when he scored two goals in the Champions League.
I don't count the hartick he scored against Lion City Sailors or whatever they are called.
Well, as explained in my post, that is extremely naive / fanciful so I'm afraid we will have to agree to disagree on that point. Which is fine.
Seems totally against what Ange is trying to build here waiting for a player who doesn't really want to come. From his interviews, he's all about players desperate to prove themselves and make a name for themselves with us.
I'm sanguine about the situ....
Reckon Gil & Solomon could fill in at CB if needed
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Seems so obvious that it’s going to happen as well.
It’s these margins where the debate comes from about Levy’s ownership:
You can point to his spending this summer and say “look he backs his managers”.
But you always reach a point where what’s required of him as an owner/CEO if you are serious about a rebuild to win, is just beyond what he’s prepared to do.
Well, as explained in my post, that is extremely naive / fanciful so I'm afraid we will have to agree to disagree on that point. Which is fine.
So Real Madrid, Romans chavs, Ferguson UTD didn’t bake trophies into their business strategy?
Winning trophies isn’t a necessity for those clubs?
Our main rivals from up the road are leaving us in their wake due to this dithering.
As I said, I've already covered it in my long post. I am NOT saying we shouldn't be trying to win trophies, of course not - but if you read my post properly, and think about the implications, you will hopefully realise that for the clubs at the very top end, 'relative success' does indeed necessarily include winning trophies. We are the level below that. You may not like it, but that's the reality.
They have a net spend of +250m vs ENIC over the last 5 years. Even though we have the same revenue…
Levy probably doesn’t even see us as rivals. He’s still thinking Villa, Everton, West Ham are his rivals
Fantastic post.Sorry but this is extremely naive and overly simplistic. In 'real life', trophies are actually pretty much irrelevant for the vast majority of clubs, so it might be more wise to say that the primary sports-related* goal for any club is to exceed it's expectations of footballing success over the medium to long term (or at least something like that).
Why do I say 'exceed expectations' rather than 'win trophies'? Well, surely the sports-related target of the management should be to do better than expected, or maybe better than resources would suggest is possible. Hence if Man City win the PL this season and Luton finish 2nd, surely we'd all agree that Luton deserve more congratulations than Man City, they would have had more relative 'success' when you factor in the context. Well that's the way I see it anyway - you're welcome to disagree and say that you'd think City more deserving of praise in that scenario if you wish, that's your prerogative - but I suspect most would say Luton had been more successful there.
Why do I say 'medium to long term'? Well, any team with a bit of good form and/or good luck can have a good season or a good cup run - a bit like with investing, there will always be short-term ups and downs - but it doesn't really make sense to judge the management's overall tenure on a single season.
What's my point here? Well, Levy will be trying to balance financial success with footballing success. He may not always do it well, but that is surely what he will be trying to do. Hence, going back to the origin of this conversation, he will naturally want to get good value for money when buying players, as would any business buying any asset. Yes you might sometimes pay over the market price, but only if you were confident that the asset would have some attribute that you could exploit better than others, thereby still making it good value for you. If it was only about 'winning trophies' - i.e. if money was irrelevant - then yes he should spend £500m on the best player - but money isn't irrelevant, it is both relevant and finite, so Levy will do whatever he thinks right in terms of investing in the football side at a level he believes will also ultimately benefit the business side. Does he always get that right? Of course not, no one does - but that is what he will always be trying to do, and should be trying to do.
So for me, even we do buy a player for £150m, we should only be doing so if we consider that to be 'good value' for us.
Side-note:
* I say 'sports-related' as, whether you or other football romantics like it or not, football clubs are businesses, and for many of them, the owners if they are honest are more interested in growing the value of their asset than footballing success. Now of course the latter may assist the former, but that's not the point - the point is that owners might well consider asset value as more important than footballing success, and it would be wise for fans to remember that. This of course is the owners' right - contrary to what many fans seem to think, the owners by definition own the club as an asset, hence within reason and law, they can run it however they wish, focus on whatever they want etc. That is their right earned by achieving sufficient wealth to purchase the asset. If you have or save up enough money, you can do the same.
The response you received was a little embarrassing but does highlight the levels of thought and realism going on.
Over 20 league goals last year. More than richarlison has ever achieved.
Proven talent, in his prime, contract not expiring, club doesn't need to sell, definitely not happening. Levy doesn't do those deals.
Did you not read and think about what he wrote?
How can people have a meaningful conversation if you don’t think about what the other person is saying.