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Manager Ange Postecoglou

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Shadydan said:
Yes there is, both corners the keeper should be clearing everything, the reason why he couldn't do that was because he kept being man marked.

This was happening earlier in the season, we stuck a player on the marker but we stopped fucking doing it for some reason, absolutely infuriating especially against them, they've got the best record in the league for set pieces so it was obvious they were gonna do that.
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I don’t think Vic was pinned at any corner yesterday. My issue with him is he’s just standing worrying about who’s near him. He can be on the move and come and collect corners. He’s 6ft 4 and when he jumps and with those big long arms he’s about ten feet tall so he needs to help his team mates more🤣
 
Phomesy said:
Unsurprising given the half time score but this is a massive over-reaction. We beat Woolwich on pretty much all metrics except the most important one.

We are where we should be after Ange's first season. In fact probably overperormed. Next year is the key.
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We didn't have a shot on target until raya gifted it to romero in the 70 odd minute. We created fuck all of note and we scored from a foul in the box and a keeper error. They were better defensively than us and like it or not in an attacking sense because they identified we are poor on corners and scored twice, identified our full backs are never where they should be and played a ball over that area and then scored from it. While we let them sit in their shape and passed it side to side. What did we win on exactly possession only? Woolwich like many others (as it's easy to do) identified our weaknesses and took advantage of them to win the game. That's what good teams do. There was only one winner yesterday.
 
Shadydan said:
Yes there is, both corners the keeper should be clearing everything, the reason why he couldn't do that was because he kept being man marked.

This was happening earlier in the season, we stuck a player on the marker but we stopped fucking doing it for some reason, absolutely infuriating especially against them, they've got the best record in the league for set pieces so it was obvious they were gonna do that.
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Also we give away far too many needless corners which is another problem. 16 against Newcastle and 6 yesterday. If you are giving away 22 corners in 2 games then we have massive issues. The reason for that can be many things but one thing for certain is we don’t stop crosses well enough from both sides whether that’s from our full backs or wide players.
 
Yiddy said:
We didn't have a shot on target until raya gifted it to romero in the 70 odd minute. We created fuck all of note and we scored from a foul in the box and a keeper error. They were better defensively than us and like it or not in an attacking sense because they identified we are poor on corners and scored twice, identified our full backs are never where they should be and played a ball over that area and then scored from it. While we let them sit in their shape and passed it side to side. What did we win on exactly possession only? Woolwich like many others (as it's easy to do) identified our weaknesses and took advantage of them to win the game. That's what good teams do. There was only one winner yesterday.
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Their second goal want because Ben was out of position. He’s in the right position because he comes in narrow because of where Havertz has the ball. It’s his poor defending by letting Saka come inside on his good foot is baffling for a player of his experience. If he shows him on his right the chances are Saka won’t score.
 
Herclueless said:
No, I get what they are saying, I just think it's tremendously blinkered to ignore all of the portents of doom that are on display for all to see, just because "time"...

To have faith that time will see things come together you have to see some fragments that can click into place. Where are these signs presently? That we have lots of possession?

We've all seen this unfold before, we know how Tottenham Hotspur the team respond to adversity, do you see us rising like a resurgent phoenix? Or do you see us spiralling into a well of self-pity?.

Did Hoddle just need more time? Did Ramos? AVB? Mourinho? Nuno? Giving some of them more time could have genuinely ended in a relegation.
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Very much this. In all honesty if it were really good perfornance, followed by an average or poor performance you can take that as you just need to iron out the inconsistancies and can see improvement. But its been at least 4 months of average to poor. Villa being the only real exception in all that time.

Since New years day in 15 games we've beaten Burnley in the cup, Brentford, Brighton, Palace, Villa, Luton and Forest. All at home apart from Villa, all scratchy performances apart from Villa. Just cant see what we're doing in terms of signs of long term improvement. Again he wont and shouldnt be sacked but we really need to see a bit more in our last 5 games or i do fear where this is going next season.
 
Two of the goals against Newcastle happened again yesterday. Long ball over the top and we are caught hole open.
Newcastles fourth from a corner happens twice yesterday.
Ange can fuck himself. If the staff I manage in my job make huge errors one week and then go on to repeat them the next week that’s on me as a manger.
If his philosophy is we don’t adapt for the opposition and we impose our way on the game I get that and given time it will eventually work but why in the meantime can’t we tell our players to head a fu king ball properly when it’s incoming from a corner!!!
We need to find Robert Huth and Wes Morgan and get them in pronto!!!! They won a league by heading every ball, man , woman or child that came into the box!!!!!!
 
nicoclaesen said:
Their second goal want because Ben was out of position. He’s in the right position because he comes in narrow because of where Havertz has the ball. It’s his poor defending by letting Saka come inside on his good foot is baffling for a player of his experience. If he shows him on his right the chances are Saka won’t score.
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100% agree. Also one he comes on his left keeper could do better and anticipate he going bottom right corner. Amateur defending
 
simon j said:
Two of the goals against Newcastle happened again yesterday. Long ball over the top and we are caught hole open.
Newcastles fourth from a corner happens twice yesterday.
Ange can fuck himself. If the staff I manage in my job make huge errors one week and then go on to repeat them the next week that’s on me as a manger.
If his philosophy is we don’t adapt for the opposition and we impose our way on the game I get that and given time it will eventually work but why in the meantime can’t we tell our players to head a fu king ball properly when it’s incoming from a corner!!!
We need to find Robert Huth and Wes Morgan and get them in pronto!!!! They won a league by heading every ball, man , woman or child that came into the box!!!!!!
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Well, I'd actually suggest you improve your staff..

Which is exactly what Ange needs to do with regards to our squad.
 
nicoclaesen said:
Yip agreed. Be careful what you wish for. No manager on the planet is coming in and doing any better over the course of the season than what Ange has done and what he inherited.
Yesterday is the most gutted I’ve been in years but I’m 100% willing to see where we go next season.
Its pointless anyone wanting a change because it will take someone else time to put their stamp on it.

Watch Liverpool next season and I guarantee you they won’t challenge for the title. Klopp gone,Salah likely gone,maybe a few others and a new manager in with different ideas.
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Come on, you can't really believe that?

I'm not saying that there are any cast iron certs that were realistic appointments, but no manager on the planet???

I'm not trying to needlessly pile in on Ange, but no manager on the planet (realistic or otherwise) could have done better than a 1 point haul from the 4 games against Wolves and West Ham? Than getting pumped at Newcastle and Fulham? Than limply ceding a 3 goal lead in one half at home to our bitterest rivals through our own naivity, recklessness, stubbornness, and arrogance?

No one on the planet???
 
simon j said:
Improve staff?
Romero and van Der ven are huge men!’
Head the fucking ball!!!
It’s not even non league basic 101 defending
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Do you think our starting eleven is the best it can be or do you think it can be improved?

Set pieces are a different thing altogether. And yes, I'd suggest us improving the staff to be able to improve that also.
 
Herclueless said:
Come on, you can't really believe that?

I'm not saying that there are any cast iron certs that were realistic appointments, but no manager on the planet???

I'm not trying to needlessly pile in on Ange, but no manager on the planet (realistic or otherwise) could have done better than a 1 point haul from the 4 games against Wolves and West Ham? Than getting pumped at Newcastle and Fulham? Than limply ceding a 3 goal lead in one half at home to our bitterest rivals through our own naivity, recklessness, stubbornness, and arrogance?

No one on the planet???
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We all criticised conte and Jose for being stubborn….
Why is Ange getting away with it?
Because he “attacks” … we don’t attack.
We get up to their box and do fuck all. No shots , no crosses, just tippy tippy , sideways longways backwash until the opponent resets and then we lose the ball.
Keeps picking maddison . X
Keeps son in middle. X
Then Johnson on the left.X
Don’t need to practice set piece defence.X

But hits bonza !! “ cough”
 
Herclueless said:
No, I get what they are saying, I just think it's tremendously blinkered to ignore all of the portents of doom that are on display for all to see, just because "time"...

To have faith that time will see things come together you have to see some fragments that can click into place. Where are these signs presently? That we have lots of possession?

We've all seen this unfold before, we know how Tottenham Hotspur the team respond to adversity, do you see us rising like a resurgent phoenix? Or do you see us spiralling into a well of self-pity?.

Did Hoddle just need more time? Did Ramos? AVB? Mourinho? Nuno? Giving some of them more time could have genuinely ended in a relegation.
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I think plenty of our managers needed more time.

Sacking a manager 9/10 isn’t the answer. This club and fanbase just have an addiction to quick fixes.

If you have a plan and an idea vice bigger than just “getting the right manager” then the manager actually becomes less important. We need players to play a certain way and our current manager wants to play that way and has had less than a season.

As for portents of doom. We are going through a rough patch. We need to change the playing and coaching staff in the summer. There is a lot to learn when you build a project. People just thought it could be easy because of the hot start.
 
Herclueless said:
Conte was a fraud for needing this though?

:contehmm:
I'm not saying you said as much yourself, I don't know, but that has been a pretty common consensus on here.
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I don't think anyone called Conte a fraud because of the personnel he had at his disposal.

He knew our business model going in. I don't think Conte was a fraud in general. Just that for him to succeed, he needs to be part of a business model that will spend big and are happy to spend big. He's always succeeded at clubs that spend the most money or are one of the most successful clubs in their respective league.

He came across as someone who was above us and didn't fancy being here long term. Which is a fine mindset to have when you're at a Chelsea or Inter Milan who are going to back you heavily for that short period of time before you burn your bridges but we don't work like that.

Entrusting Conte with a rebuild, which we essentially tried to do, only to supply him with the likes of Ivan Perisic was a recipe for disaster. And it turned into exactly that.

In fact, Conte is a good example of not judging a coach on their first season. Again, if we're having this same conversation this time next year with regards to Ange then yes things have gone wrong.
 
Shadydan said:
Yes there is, both corners the keeper should be clearing everything, the reason why he couldn't do that was because he kept being man marked.

This was happening earlier in the season, we stuck a player on the marker but we stopped fucking doing it for some reason, absolutely infuriating especially against them, they've got the best record in the league for set pieces so it was obvious they were gonna do that.
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I agree

Completely fucking unacceptable from a game planning and player execution perspective
 
Herclueless said:
Come on, you can't really believe that?

I'm not saying that there are any cast iron certs that were realistic appointments, but no manager on the planet???

I'm not trying to needlessly pile in on Ange, but no manager on the planet (realistic or otherwise) could have done better than a 1 point haul from the 4 games against Wolves and West Ham? Than getting pumped at Newcastle and Fulham? Than limply ceding a 3 goal lead in one half at home to our bitterest rivals through our own naivity, recklessness, stubbornness, and arrogance?

No one on the planet???
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Who could have come in to Tottenham last summer with how toxic it was,lose the best striker we’ve had and make us any better than 4th or 5th?. There are many managers that could have come in and got us exactly the same position but there is no chance anybody could have got us challenging the top three for 38 games.
 
Richard Arlison said:
I agree

Completely fucking unacceptable from a game planning and player execution perspective
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I'd love to see some stills of our defensive set up from set pieces earlier in the season as opposed to now to see the difference.

I am pretty sure the first goal we directly conceded from a corner this season was Everton away which was 23 games in...

We've conceded 8 since in the next 10 games.
 
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