Harry Kane

[Deuterz]

Let's not forget he didn't slap in a transfer request too, which is what most players who want out do as a final push for a transfer.

This is very rare these days isn't it? Who was the last player to do it?

If they had in a transfer request they lose their loyalty bonus, which can be to the tune of many millions. And it doesn't guarantee you a move at all, so you've risked losing a hell of a lot of money for no real tangible gain.

 

[Beech]

This is very rare these days isn't it? Who was the last player to do it?

If they had in a transfer request they lose their loyalty bonus, which can be to the tune of many millions. And it doesn't guarantee you a move at all, so you've risked losing a hell of a lot of money for no real tangible gain.

Not sure if it's rare or not. But in the past it seems to me like a lot of moved happened swiftly after a player handed in a transfer request. The likes of Suarez and Coutinho spring to mind.

 

[Airfixx]

I think it's pretty difficult for any player to make it clearer they want out.

I actually appreciated what Kane did, no bullshit, no treating the fans like morons. He wanted out, he said he wanted out.

The problem in all this is a chairman who shit himself at the thought of Kane leaving and bunkered himself down with his fingers crossed simply hoping everything would be ok.

No bullshit???????

You're nuts!

 

[Deuterz]

No bullshit???????

You're nuts!

'I returned when I was meant to, honest guys, it's just a misunderstanding!'

 

[Deuterz]

Not sure if it's rare or not. But in the past it seems to me like a lot of moved happened swiftly after a player handed in a transfer request. The likes of Suarez and Coutinho spring to mind.

It's pretty rare. I think it only happens if the player is extremely convinced that another club badly wants him, and maybe even are prepared to compensate him for the loss of his loyalty bonus.

I also assume Kane didn't want to do it because that would have totally burned his bridges at the club. He preferred to go the more sneaky route to try and get an exit, whilst still getting all the benefits. Which ended up ruining his standing at the club more than if he just handed in the request.

 

[VonnegutBusy]

I defend Harry a lot, and I'll continue to defend his Spurs record. Regardless of the player he is now and in the future, he's been a wonderful player, a world-class striker, for years. I've even seen signs from him in a Spurs shirt this season that make me believe a run of form is on the horizon.

However, he was truly dog shit last night and for the first time I genuinely saw a lack of effort. I'm not even talking about him running around. I'm talking about letting average defenders get the better of him. Not challenging in the air. Losing the ball with a bad first touch and not even looking angry at himself that he allowed it to happen. It was League One stuff from a player capable of being up there with the very best in Europe, at his best.

I said months ago we should sell him even if we get 30 or 40 million less than what we valued him at. For our sake and his. And nothing that's happened since has made me think what I said was wrong.

I've seen much of what you describe in the second paragraph for the last few years, despite him putting up good numbers.

Physically he looks shot and I do think he is a major factor in why we completely fell off as a pressing team at the end of Poch's reign.

I rarely see him win duels with decent (or average) defenders these days.

I thought we should have kept him because 75m was simply too low an offer and according to reports thats the highest bid that came in. Would we be better off now with Vlahovic in there instead? Who knows.

Kane's physical decline is a real worry but we all know how good his passing and finishing is so I'm still hopeful he has a good season once the team gets settled with the South American contingent and Nunoball kicks off.

 

[Airfixx]

Not sure if it's rare or not. But in the past it seems to me like a lot of moved happened swiftly after a player handed in a transfer request. The likes of Suarez and Coutinho spring to mind.

Liverpool reject Philippe Coutinho's transfer request after Barcelona bids

Liverpool have rejected Philippe Coutinhos transfer request after he told them of his desire to move to Barcelona, Sky sources understand.

www.skysports.com

Interestingly enough; in this instance all it served to do was (presumably) push the eventual trf fee UP...... Typically you'd expect it to weaken the selling club's hand, not strengthen it.


Suarez is a funny one though; as he took a difficult scenario out of the Dipper's hands...... He was public enemy #1 (again) having just bitten Chiellini in the WC; his 3rd proverbial strike having previously dropped dramas on their doorstep for biting and racism...... Although a somewhat underwhelming fee in hindsight, a swift 70m deal was a tidy resolution for a player who looked to be completely off the rails(*).

(*Typically he's been well behaved ever since, but again that's the roll of the dice.)

 

[Airfixx]

I've seen much of what you describe in the second paragraph for the last few years, despite him putting up good numbers.

Physically he looks shot and I do think he is a major factor in why we completely fell off as a pressing team at the end of Poch's reign.

I rarely see him win duels with decent (or average) defenders these days.

I thought we should have kept him because 75m was simply too low an offer and according to reports thats the highest bid that came in. Would we be better off now with Vlahovic in there instead? Who knows.

Kane's physical decline is a real worry but we all know how good his passing and finishing is so I'm still hopeful he has a good season once the team gets settled with the South American contingent and Nunoball kicks off.

As for the deterioration of his duelling/hold-up game... Yes, there were changes already creeping in, but I think the Lallana incident got into his head.

 

[todd1882]

This is where I stand. The 'city are offering 100m+' and 'levy isn't negotiating' rumours in the media came within the last week or so.

Who do we go for then?

Not a valid excuse as all as we have needed another striker for years...YEARS. If we had another striker then perhaps Kane would never have had to be rushed back. Had we another real alternative then perhaps Kane would not have started the CL final (though I think Llorente would have been fine if we used the right tactics). If we had another striker we could have setup differently in all the other big games, etc etc etc.

There is no excuse for Levy on this because we have always needed another player. But he steadfastly will not have 2 quality players for a position the skinflint c***!.

And beyond that having another capable striker puts us in a much stronger negotiating position. And if we had any desire to properly fill the holes of this squad we would have gotten one earlier in the window. There was never any desire to do anything in this area. We were always going to be left with 1 striker, AGAIN! And that would have been the case whether Kane left or stayed...and i said this during the window in case there are any agent hindsights out there.

...and breathe.

 

[Shotgunofmichalebrow]

I kept trying to argue that we were better with two mobile srikers getting 15 each than Kane hot getting 40 Kane cold looks to heading to his worse numbers ever and looks mentally shot which was the thing that made him special in the first place his mentality. The moment he took the Nevile interview was moment I said that he was going to be a negative and should be sold . People just kept saying "Its Harry Kane " can't be replaced. Well he has looked a poor replacement for Ivan Toney 90% of this season. It sad but we must source a replacement immediately.

 

[todd1882]

Banging in goals later won’t mean he isn’t shit now though

Yeah, Sammy, but these points don't mean as much as points later in the season. What's wrong with you? How do you now know that?

 

[Deuterz]

Not a valid excuse as all as we have needed another striker for years...YEARS. If we had another striker then perhaps Kane would never have had to be rushed back. Had we another real alternative then perhaps Kane would not have started the CL final (though I think Llorente would have been fine if we used the right tactics). If we had another striker we could have setup differently in all the other big games, etc etc etc.

There is no excuse for Levy on this because we have always needed another player. But he steadfastly will not have 2 quality players for a position the skinflint c***!.

And beyond that having another capable striker puts us in a much stronger negotiating position. And if we had any desire to properly fill the holes of this squad we would have gotten one earlier in the window. There was never any desire to do anything in this area. We were always going to be left with 1 striker, AGAIN! And that would have been the case whether Kane left or stayed...and i said this during the window in case there are any agent hindsights out there.

...and breathe.

Oh if we're judging Levy on a longer term period, then absolutely he's made mistakes. I was purely assessing him from the standpoint of what he could do at the start of this window, rather than looking back at the errors he's made in the past. Obviously we should have more than one CF at the club, that's been an issue for a while. I'm not exonerating Levy of his failures in the transfer market, just stating the position he was in when the window opened .. which yes, you can argue was a position he put himself in.

I do think we were trying to get a CF earlier in the window. There were reports all season of negotiations for Vlahovic, but Fiorentina were holding out for a huge fee, and didn't really want to sell. Atletico were also interested in him and walked away over the price. We also tried for Martinez and made progress but Chelsea buying Lukaku pretty much ended our hopes. Should we have been looking at other options? Sure, but it is a difficult position to fill right now. We've been using stop gaps for years though, and that's been a problem. I do wonder if Pochettino barely utilising Llorente made Daniel feel like it wasn't worth investing any kind of real money in to a 'back up' CF.

The clubs obviously been shit in the market in the past. I think 90% of our fanbase would admit that. We pissed about for years with just Kane at CF and then everyone ran about panicked when he got injured. The fact we've ended up with less striker depth than we had last season is also extremely poor. But in terms of what Levy could do when the window opened, I can see why he struggled. You're obviously free to say he made things difficult for himself with past decisions .. and that's fair.

 

[todd1882]

People hate Levy enough that all the blame has quickly turned to him. I'm not exactly a fan, but I for one am not about to forget the way they went about it. Even the best of negotiators would've struggled with the way they tried to go about their business.

Ok, but he somehow managed to get the worst of all the possible permutations of situations. That's bad. Everyone lost in the no deal situation. Put another way, there was no winner...except the peanut gallery that wanted to get a moment of banter out of beating the oil c***s!. And those people should never be humored.

You never let your money get mad and you make the deal that is there to be made. Anything else is not the sign of a master negotiator for which he has been heralded.

 

[Deuterz]

I kept trying to argue that we were better with two mobile srikers getting 15 each than Kane hot getting 40 Kane cold looks to heading to his worse numbers ever and looks mentally shot which was the thing that made him special in the first place his mentality. The moment he took the Nevile interview was moment I said that he was going to be a negative and should be sold . People just kept saying "Its Harry Kane " can't be replaced. Well he has looked a poor replacement for Ivan Toney 90% of this season. It sad but we must source a replacement immediately.

I think we talked about this in a transfer window thread but just gonna reiterate we should absolutely be in for him if we do sell Kane at the end of the season.

Kane out and him, a wide player (Ismaila Sarr would be fantastic) and a creative midfielder of some type (someone who adds goals, like a Pedro Goncalves) and that would be perfect. Obviously that's all fantasy world football manager stuff, but those are the positions I'd wanna see us improve on. We need goal threats from different parts of the pitch, right now it's so easy to shut us down.

 

[todd1882]

But you and anyone agreeing with you are still completely wrong, so maybe stop blowing your trumpet until you can hold a note.

Admirable to hold your "keep Kane at all costs" stance in the face of the intervening evidence, Jerry. I have a feeling this season is gonna bring you to your knees begging to join the bandwagon. when you do I'll give you a discount off the latecomer price because I like you.

 

[Deuterz]

Lets not re-open this can of worms again......

Bale & Modric both gave it the proverbial 'one more season' and delivered in spades in their final year.

There's probably LOADS of other examples at other clubs too.

Yeah the 'he wants to go so he's going to play badly now' is a terrible excuse. I'll add Suarez to your examples - he was absolutely furious at Liverpool for not selling him, then went and put in what can be argued is the best individual season ever seen in the premier league.

Players who want moves don't suddenly become bad at football. They get their heads down and get the move later on.

 

[todd1882]

I was purely assessing him from the standpoint of what he could do at the start of this window,

...and that's exactly what I'm talking about. Whether Harry was staying or leaving we needed another striker. My point was that your hypothetical about City waiting to the last week should have been moot. We were only 'in a sitauation' because we didn't secure another striker irrespective of Kane's situation. And now we are stuck with 1 lumbering striker...AGAIN.

the only aspect that has to do with historic Levy behavior is the pattern. On this matter Levy is not innocent but derelict.

 

[Deuterz]

Ok, but he somehow managed to get the worst of all the possible permutations of situations. That's bad. Everyone lost in the no deal situation. Put another way, there was no winner...except the peanut gallery that wanted to get a moment of banter out of beating the oil c***s!. And those people should never be humored.

You never let your money get mad and you make the deal that is there to be made. Anything else is not the sign of a master negotiator for which he has been heralded.

It wasn't ideal by any stretch. I just also think City are to blame for the way they went about it, and Kane himself was an absolute moron and I'm pretty sure ended up making Levy more keen on keeping him at the club. This is why you don't hire your moron brother as your agent, Harry. He has photos of you everywhere in his office .. it's weird mate.

And personally I've always said Levy gets a lot of credit for being hard to deal with, when that is a very double edged sword. It's pissed a lot of people negotiating with us off. It's all well and good when you're looking at deals like Bale, but he's cost us on other sales and purchases.

 

[Dr Rocktopus]

Admirable to hold your "keep Kane at all costs" stance in the face of the intervening evidence, Jerry. I have a feeling this season is gonna bring you to your knees begging to join the bandwagon. when you do I'll give you a discount off the latecomer price because I like you.

It could happen, and I'm not entirely against the idea of moving him on so that we can rebuild, but he's one of the greatest strikers we have ever had and if we can get another one or two seasons out of him we should take advantage of that.

 

[Deuterz]

...and that's exactly what I'm talking about. Whether Harry was staying or leaving we needed another striker. My point was that your hypothetical about City waiting to the last week should have been moot. We were only 'in a sitauation' because we didn't secure another striker irrespective of Kane's situation. And now we are stuck with 1 lumbering striker...AGAIN.

the only aspect that has to do with historic Levy behavior is the pattern. On this matter Levy is not innocent but derelict.

That's a problem. We did clearly try for some of the aforementioned options, but it should have been a priority over other deals.

The club gambled on Kane being enough for another season, and so far it isn't paying off. I'll be fair to Levy and say clearly attempts were made to secure a couple of options, and perhaps we weren't interested in settling for a 3rd or 4th choice for a big fee.

But the longer term problem of zero CF depth has been mismanagement, there's no doubting it.