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Ex-Spurs Player Harry Kane
- Thread starter Moulman14
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I think he's done alright under Conte so far, Frank. Nothing great at all and badly needs a goal to get him going in the EPL, but is definitely on the right tracks.
Your last sentence wants to negate the previous one but I guess it hinges on you definition of "successful" and "work". And I'd also like to see Harry in a hard pressing team since you suggest it could be his cup of tea.
All under the presumption that Conte was here and DL was fulfilling his 1st summer appeasement spend. But casting doubt on what would have happened doesn't negate my hypothetical of being better by selling Harry "ye of the 1 league goal THIS season" Kane and replacing him with Vlahovic + some MFer. It just boils down to are you better off selling 1 good player to buy 2 good players. Answers always yes and anything else is detail or nonsense. But ours boils down to are you willing to sell a 28yo want-away player that has scored 1 league goal in (almost) half a season and looks like he should be contacting NHS for a zimmerframe for a mobile, hungry 21 yo hot shot + a MFer to address 2 problem areas.
No, we wouldn't becuase Kane would still be starting and he'd still have a 4% conversion rate thereby squandering the efforts of the new MFer and stunting Vlahovic's growth in the team. At some point one has to conclude that there is a point at which a player has to be described as hurting his team. Shit, Benz even said it about his own teammate and now look at that teammate flourish. Just takes someone to admit that which we see with our own eyes.
He’s done less under Conte than he did under Nuno
0 goals
0 assists
But yeah, keep telling yourself he will go on a run soon
When he does, I'll be calling you out, Frank. And you'll no doubt make up some absolute nonsense, as always.
Already answered this, directly to you.
But yeah, round and round we go, because you dont actually read what you’re arguing against
We have seen Kane work in a hard pressing team. I don't think it would be the ideal system for him right now but he is smart enough that he could work in that system.
Kane would certainly work in a system like that than a much less talented player who is "suited" for it like say Lucas Moura.
As I have said I am fine selling Kane to make the team better. I have yet to see much evidence of that happening or any realistic suggesting that that does happen.
Saying good MFer is all well and good but considering what we have seen from this how can you actually think that is something that will happen. What makes you think that Levy and Paratici have a clue of what a good MFer is let alone that they would bring one in.
And who is the mobile, hungry 21 year old you talk about?
The problem with these talks is they are always hypothetical fantasy land talks not anything close to reality that will happen with Spurs.
I am not sure why you would think Kane would still have a 4% conversion rate. No reason to think that at all. If Kane being here stunts Vlahovic's growth then he isn't close to worth the money he is rumoured to cost.
Well if a rapist and criminal like Benz said it I guess we all should listen.
So your belief is that Conte was sold on upwards of 150M net spend but will have the wool pulled out from under him? Surely, Conte would have had the same demands in the summer as in November, right? And maybe even bigger consdiering he turned us down and shit went sideways, right?
So here's Conte with his big leverage dick swinging and DL, now humbled from the Nuno experiment and being booed, sidled up to him and lied through his teeth like "I'm keeping Harry Kane because you love him so much AND me and Uncle Joe are gonna kick in 150M smackeroos to build the team". This is what you are suggesting? And DL would be doing this to the exact guy that's gonna run straight to press and absolutely obliterate anything and anyone that he feels wronged him in this situation. Again, this is what you are suggesting.
Kane has 1 assist, same as Bergwijn, Davies, Hojberg and Moura
The team has created 19 big chances and Kane has done 4 of them.
Moura has done 3 of them
But one of the top five managers in the world, moved Kane into midfield because he’s a creative behemoth…………despite highly rating his attacking prowess in front of goal.
Which has yielded one league goal in 5 months
The team has created 19 big chances and Kane has done 4 of them.
Moura has done 3 of them
But one of the top five managers in the world, moved Kane into midfield because he’s a creative behemoth…………despite highly rating his attacking prowess in front of goal.
Which has yielded one league goal in 5 months
I think Conte actually might've wanted to work with Kane when he joined thinking he was the same Kane he faced when he was at Chelsea.
Then when he saw Kane lose the ball 25 times to Mura getting bullied by milkmen and uber drivers, he immediately said:
"at this time, the quality is not so high at Tottenham"
Yeah, he was referring to Kane. He already knew that Winks and Dele etc were shit.
Then when he saw Kane lose the ball 25 times to Mura getting bullied by milkmen and uber drivers, he immediately said:
"at this time, the quality is not so high at Tottenham"
Yeah, he was referring to Kane. He already knew that Winks and Dele etc were shit.
My contention is more that Levy thinks he will be able to convince Conte that spending the money, not sure on what the actual number is I think Conte is more about specific players than a specific value, that he does on the type of players that Levy wants not that Conte does.
For example, when Conte says he wants (as an example not these specific guys) De Vrij, Brozovic and Romagnoli for 50m Levy will counter and say lets get 21 year old CB from France, 20 year old MF from Spain and Lloyd Kelly from Bournemouth for the same amount.
I think the issue won't be so much about money but Levy unwilling to bring in players that have no sell on value for him that Conte wants. Levy will spend a certain amount of money as long as he thinks he is a. getting a bargain on the player or b. the player has sell on value and ideally both. The real question is whether he will back Conte when Conte doesn't give a shit about either.
So if Levy told Conte that he can have 75m to spend in January does that mean he if free to buy players that will come at a premium price with no future sell on or will Conte have to conform to Levy's qualifications on how the money is spent.
That is how I see Conte being told he will be backed with spending but it not actually working out.
Again I think you are focusing too much on Conte demanding money and Levy denying the money. Conte doesn't demand money like Jose and Levy will spend money if he thinks he is getting deal or can make more on the player later.
But yes I think Levy has a big enough ego to think that he can convert Conte to do business his way. As mentioned I think he will make a big amount available but it will have restrictions on how it can be spent.
And if Conte walks Levy will go with his tried and true "Spurs way" BS saying that Conte wasn't willing to work within the Spurs way. Remember this is the same jackass that put out a video saying we needed to return to the Spurs way of playing before hiring Nuno to be our manager. I don't think he is above flat out lying to the fans. He also was reportedly shocked that the fans didn't want the ESL. I think he has shown us enough times he is out of touch.
The main point is that there is zero evidence or common sense argument that Conte wants Kane out.
Have you got evidence he wants Moura or Davies out?
They have the same amount of goals and assists as Kane, but can run fast.
Years ago, don't count now. Greaves use to knock them in for us back in the day. That mean he can do it today?
Now it's "could". Could is a far cry from "successful". Just doing a job is not success.
No time for whataboutery. We're talking about Harry Kane so let's constrain it to that.
Typically I don't, in general, but I have put a little time into this.
And actually, believe it or not, I don't really care if they screwed up with whomever they brought in. IDC! I'd just be happy for the proper decision to be made and don't like that people think 1 affects the other. There are 2 things needed to be done: 1) sell Harry and 2) rebuild squad/spend the money. The second thing doesn't affect the first one. And if Vlahovic was the replacement then from my little knowledge of the player it seems like that might have been 1 good player. Hopefully we had someone decent in mind for MF. Was talking about Vlahovic. You might have though I was talking about Benz considering the disparity in his mobility compared with Kanes. But Benz is actually quite a bit old than Harry. Did you know that? Surprised me.
Literally the article was posted about our interest in Vlahovic along with numerous links to MFers.
I'm getting new updated data in that indeed we could expect said conversion rate to drop to 3%. You should quit while you're 'ahead'.
We're talking football and understanding when a player is hurting a team. Pretty sure nothing in Benz's personal life affects his ability to see that. Benz would know that Harry is playing against us sometimes and probably blackmail him to give more effort than a OAP with a bad hip.
In the summer he said as a coach “I would always play Kane up top as he’s devastating there”
In the Autumn he has Kane playing deep.
Some still feel this is because Kane has been devastating in the box and Conte can see that, but he still feels we need Kane to be the creative force, despite creating as much a Ben Davies
Years ago counts because it shows that he can do it. since we haven't seen him fail at it I am not sure why we should discount it.
What? He could be successful. He would be successful. Seems like an odd semantics thing to latch on to.
There is not whataboutery it is pointing out that having talented players is more important than having crap that supposedly fits.
If you expect to have 11 players that all perfectly fit a system I would question what you are watching. I can't think of a team that has that even at City, Chelsea, PSG.
Typically I don't, in general, but I have put a little time into this.
Selling Kane certainly doesn't need to be done, especially not to bring in worse players.
Vlahovic is still a pretty big pipe dream. But bringing him in and continuing with the shit players around us does nothing to improve our team.
Mobile? That is not how I would describe Vlahovic.
Look at the number of players we have "been interested in" versus what we actually get.
The conversion rate means nothing so get whatever useless data you want.
I don't think Benzema understands shit about football or non-football things so his opinion means nothing.
Good point and NOT a "lie through his teeth" situation but of similar bad faith and far less brazen. OK, I'm seeing some merit here. I couldn't believe the situation I set up but this situation is plausible. And I bet it could work IF Conte truly is looking at a project AND he is given time. The issue I have here is his 18 month contract which means either DL will have to give some considerations here OR Conte was never on board with this.
right. So you see this coming to a head in January? Or Conte getting fucked in January and pouting until later in the season before being 'josed'?
I see this. I also can see Levy having a conversation with someone and both walking away thinking 2 completely and diametrically opposed things AFTER concluding they agree on something. Too many gentleman's agreements to think otherwise.
I'm holding fire on that determination. We'll have better insight depending on how it plays out.
1 league goal
I think it will depend on how much of a project Conte see this as and how much Levy is willing to budge.
I think it certainly could come to a head in January. Some of the players we have been linked to, although how much to believe they are true or just lazy journalists linking old players is hard to tell. like a Brozovic or De Vrij are players Levy will have no interest in buying.
But maybe Levy could pacify Conte by agreeing to guys like Kessie on a pre-contract or Romagnoli, who Levy could like because he is cheap. I think in the past Conte would be pissed he didn't get the guys he wants but if he is thinking long term maybe that works.
To me it is a pairing that makes little sense. Conte wants different things from Levy so one of them is going to have to change and considering his past and position with the Club it is unlikely to be Levy.
My fear is that we get Conte willing to treat this as a project which means we get Conte without a lot of what makes him successful. That seems to be the most likely way for this to work out for us.
My concern is that Levy says I will back you to Conte and without detailing exactly what that means both think they agree to something with completely different meanings.
For example, I think that Levy feels he backed both Jose and Poch.
If Levy says you can have 30m to buy a CB, but that CB can't be 30 year old De Vrij is that still backing him? He gave him the money he wanted so I could see again Levy feeling by giving him the 30m he wanted that he has backed him.
It is possible that Conte doesn't want Kane but there is so far zero reason to think that and a bunch of reasons to think otherwise.
I think that replacing Kane with many other players would result in the same total. It isn't like we have a team of guys outscoring him on this team. If that were the case I would be much more worried.
Again, years ago, so could Greaves. Years ago a lot of people could do a lot of things but he hasn't pressed in years even when the rest were pressing. And he looks like an old man running now. He's not pressing for anyone, anywhere for 90 minutes.
Nonsense reasoning. We haven't seen me jump the grand canyon but I'm fairly certain we should discount the possibility. What most players can do at 28 is different than what they can do at 21. For most it is not as drastic as the athletic falloff we've seen with Kane. Hell, Benz still runs like a teenager at almost 34. Did you know he was older than Kane? Came as news to me considering how majestically he gets around the pitch compared to our Harry.
Could is some possiblity whereas would is a more-likely-than-not possibility. It was walkback language to soften the assertion on your part...it slightly and almost imperceptibly moves the goalposts and changes the argument. just making note of it.
It is the definition of whataboutery. Moura is not germane to the conversation about Kane's merits.
Really? I was told that he was more targetman but I've seen some clips that suggest he is, in fact, NOT a big lump. And considering that he IS germane to the Kane convo I will say that he is a shitton more mobile than our English Oak. And would probably be more likely to carry out tactical demands being a young player, moving up a league, and playing for Conte...or just not being a want-away player like our English Oak.
sure it does. It means that 96% of the time that our efforts end at Harry Kane's feet this season they are wasted. Oops, I almost forgot. Make the 97% of the time. In case you didn't know that is not very good.
I got a bet. I'm betting that Neal Maupay has a better conversion rate than Harry. And if he does you have to go out and treat yourself to some apple pie in my honor. If Kane's is higher then I promise to make my next purchase of syrup of the imported variety. Deal?
I could say I don't think Van Gogh understood shit about the composition of paint but would that matter when considering his artistic renderings? So yeah, what I saying is...I'm comparing Benz to Van Gogh biatch!!!! Suck it, Iggy!