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Manager Ange Postecoglou

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FightingIllini said:
Ifs buts and maybes, I know, but would people feel differently right now if we'd beaten Lazio and Athletic Bilbao in their home stadium to lift the cup?

Genuinely curious.
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Probably? What's the point in this. We didn't.

Bilbao got an early red which fucked them over for the tie, and Bodo are fucking Bodo. Yeah they've pulled off some shocks against teams not prepared for them or not prepared for a plastic wintery pitch, but they're league one standard. They aren't equipped to deal with the pressure or the intensity of a semi-final. They have the budget of Wrexham. Lazio lost to them on penalties because they fucked the first leg immeasurably.

We managed to comfortably win the first leg (as we fucking should, the resource gap is embarrassing) and that set us up nicely for a second leg where they tried to force things and couldn't because they have zero athleticism or creative talent. And you want to big it up as a huge accomplishment!
 
BlackLips said:
Oh I have one. But my logic on why I feel that way and why I feel it’s the correct way is unlikely to change the way the other side feels.
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manmountainbutters said:
Well put.

The other factor that has been mentioned here is that this trophy with the 17 year monkey on the back being thrown off at last, has particularly high value. We aren't winning the PL or CL under Ange (just typing it even is LOL tbh). So are we going to get anything like the same buzz from an FA Cup or CC win with another dire league performance (and that btw, is likely the BEST case under Ange). I doubt it. His job is done. We squeaked home and got the monkey off our backs. Great. Let's move on and play good football and try and win a pot with style.
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I hope it all comes out well for Postecoglou. He cleared the roster, got some experience for the young guys, and reestablished an attacking mindset. There are better places for him to manage and better managers for Spurs.
 
Deuterz said:
Probably? What's the point in this. We didn't.
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Just wondering. Like there's a world in which we look at the full Europa League campaign as this imperious journey of conquering major challenges separate from the domestic season. I'm curious whether that would justify the "focus was diverted from the league" argument in people's minds.

I agree with you that what actually happened was different than that, even if we might quibble over *how* different.
 
Matt1882 said:
I don't agree with much of what they say, but either O'Hara or Bent were talking about the "one game to save your job" scenario on Talk Sport a few months ago. I can't even remember if it was Ange/Spurs they were talking about tbh.
But the point was it makes no sense. If you're at the point of thinking 1 more game is enough to sack the manager, it's probably time to sack the manager.
It's like being in a terrible relationship. You say to yourself one more argument/affair/assault and I'm out. If you're thinking that, you should already be gone tbh. Talk Sport didn't say that, that's my analogy.
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And I’d generally agree. If it’s a league match at Wolves in February that things hang on, pull the trigger. Now.

But this was more than a match. This was proof we could win a cup. Proof we could win and not bottle it. One of 9 managers in almost 150 years to do it. It’s got to be taken into account and got to be deemed more important than “one result”.
 
AberdeenYid said:
And I’d generally agree. If it’s a league match at Wolves in February that things hang on, pull the trigger. Now.

But this was more than a match. This was proof we could win a cup. Proof we could win and not bottle it. One of 9 managers in almost 150 years to do it. It’s got to be taken into account and got to be deemed more important than “one result”.
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It's also four results in that "do or die" sense. He'd have been gone the next morning if we'd lost to AZ, Frankfurt, Bodo, or United.
 
FightingIllini said:
Just wondering. Like there's a world in which we look at the full Europa League campaign as this imperious journey of conquering major challenges separate from the domestic season. I'm curious whether that would justify the "focus was diverted from the league" argument in people's minds.

I agree with you that what actually happened was different than that, even if we might quibble over *how* different.
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It would make more sense to have had to divert league attention if we were playing stronger teams, yes. We shouldn't need to throw away league games to beat AZ or Bodo, but we did.
 
AberdeenYid said:
And I’d generally agree. If it’s a league match at Wolves in February that things hang on, pull the trigger. Now.

But this was more than a match. This was proof we could win a cup. Proof we could win and not bottle it. One of 9 managers in almost 150 years to do it. It’s got to be taken into account and got to be deemed more important than “one result”.
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I don't think the games we won to win the Europa league were done so because Ange is special in any way shape or form.
People are having their opinion skewed by his wins at other clubs for one. Wins in Australia, Japan and Scotland with Celtic. None of those compare to the PL.
They're also heavily ignoring the lengths we went to in order to win the Europa league. Literally leaving the likes of Romero and VDV out of the starting 11 for weeks on end, even Vicario etc missed games too. No other manager has done that at Spurs. So no other manager has been in that position.
 
dmize1 said:
What's strange to me is that some people can't seem separate the enormous accomplishment of winning the EL and the decision of who is the best to manage us in 2025-26.

I am ecstatic that Ange brought us the trophy. No matter how it got done, it got done and I am forever grateful to him.

But, much like when a League 1 level striker helps get you promotion to the Championship, you still need to upgrade for the next season.

For 2025-26, we simply can't have the manager that couldn't handle both the PL and competing in a lower level European competition at the same time be the man at the helm for now doing the same thing but in a higher level competition. He may have been the best person for last season, but that in no way makes him the best person for the upcoming season. He's shown his limits and now we need to thank him and move forward, he's proven he can't do both. We're Tottenham, we should be competing everywhere.
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Nailed it.
 
FightingIllini said:
Ifs buts and maybes, I know, but would people feel differently right now if we'd beaten Lazio and Athletic Bilbao in their home stadium to lift the cup?

Genuinely curious.
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This is an interesting question.

Before the final, I was Ange Out regardless of if we won or not so I am not the target audience for it. But I think maybe the Ange In crowd could have added some substance to their case for retaining them if we'd won the final in an impressive fashion. Against a decent opponent, in a hostile atmosphere.

As it played out, we were (mostly) poor but ManU were poorer. And we won it by doing exactly the opposite of Ange's confessional play style, which hurts the case for retaining him rather than helping.

I credit him for realizing we were never going to be scoring and deciding to be negative and grind out a result, but his "we only play one way" philosophy is what he'll go back to if he returns, it's never worked for us and it is repudiated by the very trophy itself if you ask me.
 
Matt1882 said:
Poch had 2 cup finals.
The league cup final in 2015 came too soon. And not only was it too soon into the project, it was also too soon after the game before. The League cup final was Sunday March 1st. We played away at Fiorentina on the Thursday beforehand. Chelsea, meanwhile, hadn't played since their home game against Burnley 8 days prior.
We were visibly dead on our feet early in the 2nd half. I remember Walker looking like he had less pace than Neil Ruddock. Now.
They were also champions that season.

The champions league final was over as a contest inside 30 seconds. As soon as Liverpool got that lead, they were more than happy to protect what they had.
It was unfortunately for us in both final, it wasn't through lack of talent by Poch to get us over the line.

In both cases, we were playing top, top quality teams when the odds were against us. Not the shittest Man United side in living memory.
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ifs and buts, the cold hard fact is Poch won fack all and Ange did. Poch had plenty of chances with an incredibly strong team and chocked every time adding to the spursy legend

2017 - finished second in the league playing great football with the probably the best talent in the league and ultimately it was wasted

Lloris
Toby Alderweirld
Vertonghen
Dier
rose
walker

wanyama
dembele
erisken
Ali
Kane

Subs: Son, Jansen, Trippier, Davies, Wimmer, Sissoko

knocked out of Europa league by Gent...bloody gent
knocked out at home in League cup by West Ham
knocked out of FA cup by Chelsea

and the story is pretty much the same for the domestic cups in his time here, who can forget being knocked out by colchester united.

great manager for us poch, especially at building a competitive team league wise we could be proud of, the likes we'd not seen.
but he was a specialist in failure when it came to cups , shouldve done much better
 
Matt1882 said:
I don't think the games we won to win the Europa league were done so because Ange is special in any way shape or form.
People are having their opinion skewed by his wins at other clubs for one. Wins in Australia, Japan and Scotland with Celtic. None of those compare to the PL.
They're also heavily ignoring the lengths we went to in order to win the Europa league. Literally leaving the likes of Romero and VDV out of the starting 11 for weeks on end, even Vicario etc missed games too. No other manager has done that at Spurs. So no other manager has been in that position.
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Fair point. I’m not convinced that he binned off the league on his own. Otherwise, Levy would have surely sacked him late last year.

On the other hand, I’m not convinced of this binning off being a plan. So many times that the team that took the pitch should still have been good enough to win, but didn’t do the basics.

On the Europa run, maybe this wasn’t due to Ange, but if that’s the case, I’d suggest the league defeats can’t lay 100% at his feet either.

And yes, it’s easy to win at Celtic. But I don’t think that’s why he got the job. It wasn’t his results up here, it was the way the team played. Again, easier when you have a squad so much better than the oppo.
 
Higgo said:
Oddschecker update:

Drifting - Frank

Shortening - Ange, Silva and...........Carrick.



(Carrick is still 33/1).
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FightingIllini said:
Eh, after a huge early bounce two years ago it hasn't really kicked on for Carrick.

Whereas Scott Parker seems to have turned his career around in the Former Spurs Midfielder Managerial Derby.
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I think Carrick has shortened because, for some reason, Joe Cole has opined that he would be good.
metro.co.uk

Man Utd legend backed to replace Ange Postecoglou at Tottenham

Ange Postecoglou is expected to discover this week his Tottenham fate and is at 'extreme risk' of being sacked by Spurs.
metro.co.uk metro.co.uk
No doubt gambling addict simpleton fans have sensed a potential easy buck and put money on it.

AberdeenYid said:
Fair point. I’m not convinced that he binned off the league on his own. Otherwise, Levy would have surely sacked him late last year.

On the other hand, I’m not convinced of this binning off being a plan. So many times that the team that took the pitch should still have been good enough to win, but didn’t do the basics.

On the Europa run, maybe this wasn’t due to Ange, but if that’s the case, I’d suggest the league defeats can’t lay 100% at his feet either.

And yes, it’s easy to win at Celtic. But I don’t think that’s why he got the job. It wasn’t his results up here, it was the way the team played. Again, easier when you have a squad so much better than the oppo.
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I think 17 years was reason enough for Levy to hang in there and not sack him while we had a chance.
I think the fallout from sacking Mourinho before a final was reason enough for Levy to shy away from doing it again.
I think the embarrassment of taking months to replace Mourinho and Conte was a big factor with Levy not wanting to repeat that.
It was a perfect Storm for Ange. He was never losing his job, no matter how dismal we were in the league that pays more money for a top half finish than we got for winning the Europa League.
 
This whole he threw the league since January for Europa is revisionist history.

He only started rotating (i.e not playing his best players available) once the quarter came around. In April.

While he didn't have a full squad in January, because of injuries he played a role in, he absolutely played his best team in the league as available.
 
If he gets sacked get vibe he will make a massive big deal over it and write a book or appear hard done by on aussie tv. Won us a trophy and thanks but cant go into new season where i fear relegation under him. I just think he simplfies it too much. Premier league is elite. You cant cut corners.
 
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