I'm reasonably willing to accept the general thrust of what your claim, but I'd be less inclined to be sceptical, if you could back it up with some solid data.
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Manager Thomas Frank
- Thread starter The Fighting Cock
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While I don't expect us to win the League under Thomas Frank, it doesn't seem unreasonable to expect him to do better over his first two seasons, than Ange Postecoglou.
Especially given that so many on here maintain that Ange was a truly awful manager, and that Frank is many levels better.
Hmmm, I don't know off-hand of a website that gives easy access to such data (does anyone else please?), but can't you do it logically? Who do you think were predicted to finish in the top 6 at the beginning of the last 10 seasons? Surely you can reasonably imagine what those predictions would have been? Then compare with who actually finished top 6 in those seasons, and see how close it is (I won't post it here (yet) as that might sway your "prediction of the bookies past predictions"
).Agreed, but the problem with that is what 'better than Ange' means, with pro-Ange people only mentioning 5th place then a trophy in his 2nd season, and anti-Ange only mentioning 17th place... Think most sensible people would agree that TF finishing 17th next season would be a total disaster, and 5th would be a somewhat surprising (perhaps only slight) success. Think most neutrals / objective fans would say that 6th or 7th would be a reasonable (if unambitious) expectation, whilst of course hoping for a higher finish.
Same here until I saw clips of him talking to players on the training pitch
MUPPETT.
5th under Jol and challenging for 4th in PL was a bolt from the blue. Check out previous league positions.
One of those we were in danger of relegation until the 6-2 at Selhurst. Were you even alive then?
Previous highest was I think 3rd under Venables which was pre PL. 15 years or so.
Compare to Ange - we’ve been in or around top 4 ever since 2016. Like about 10 years.
You couldn’t get less like for like could you?
Jol also had the likes of Stalteri. Oh and perennial fan favourite Jenas.
Pointless setting arbitary targets. Frank is taking on a side that finished 17th and has the added pressure of CL games which is pretty unique. All i want to see is a team forming, individuals improving, more solid defence and coherent coached football. If those things improve over the season then great and see where it takes us.
We finished 9th the season before Martin Jol took us to 5th.
We ended up in 8th prior to Ange's first season and then sold one of our greatest ever players. Doesn't seem that much different to me.
Wait, but I thought Ange was our only manager to ever flirt with relegation? So apparently we've had terrible seasons in the league before. Who knew?
Ange had the likes of Højbjerg, and perennial fan favourite Johnson.
Didn’t he buy Johnson?
Do the average league placings
1995-2005
2014-2024
Haha!!!
Then tell me how much value Jol added and how much Ange reduced!!
More inconsistent BS.... Why would YOU hold TF to a different standard than his predecessor?
Rhetorical question. No need to answer. You've already long laid your stall out by now....
Are you basing your expectations on reality or what people say on TFC?
How is that inconsistent? We presumably sacked Postecoglou because his record wasn't deemed good enough.
Surely we should expect a new manager to deliver better results than the previous one?
At the very least they shouldn't perform worse!
Looking round, the bookies seem to have us as finishing seventh next season, which seems fairly reasonable. I'd be pretty happy with that as a first season, especially if we get a decent run in one of the cups too.Hmmm, I don't know off-hand of a website that gives easy access to such data (does anyone else please?), but can't you do it logically? Who do you think were predicted to finish in the top 6 at the beginning of the last 10 seasons? Surely you can reasonably imagine what those predictions would have been? Then compare with who actually finished top 6 in those seasons, and see how close it is (I won't post it here (yet) as that might sway your "prediction of the bookies past predictions"
Mind you most of them have got Man Utd finishing sixth, so I'm not sure they are all that reliable an indicator to be honest.
I thought Frank was also taking on a team that had just won the EUFA Cup, sorry does that not count?
He isn't. TF only needs to match his predecessors first season.
Not really if we're talking about league positions next season.
Imagine my surprise that those making demands are the same lot that have excused every miserable league defeat for the last 16 months. 28 losses in 49 league games. Suffice it to say if Frank has a record like that at any point he should be sacked as well.