I don't think he gets much game time here if we're being honest, I'd say right now with everyone fit he's probably 4th/5th choice and next season we're going to probably have a 40-45 game season anyway so I don't see how he get minutes.
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Player Archie Gray
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I don't think he gets much game time here if we're being honest, I'd say right now with everyone fit he's probably 4th/5th choice and next season we're going to probably have a 40-45 game season anyway so I don't see how he get minutes.
That's not my point though, he's had minutes, and far from developing, he looks to have regressed.
If our go to solution for every young player is to farm them out elsewhere to be coached by someone else then it's high bloody time to sort out whatever is up at the club that means players can't develop here.
You can't say it's about getting them competitive minutes when we're looking at players here who have had competitive minutes are not developing.
Sarr and Bergval too, neither look one bit better at anything than they did when they first played for us.
It's not just the kids either, more experienced players join and even if they have a brief flurry of looking useful it's not long before they look like warmed up dogshit.
WTF goes on at the training ground?
As another metric, he wasn't that great at all last season either. People were saying it was because he was playing out of position, but it might just be that he's not ready for the number of games and being under pressure (as per the overall results since he's been here)
Bet the Social Media bint's still been at it non-stop too, the clubs just too scared to release the footage during the run of abject results and performances...
For a team whose new vision seems to be buying young talent early, we seem to be very shit at developing them, it can't just be a Frank thing though surely can it?
I actually agree with you, we don't develop players as well as other clubs, can't be a coincidence that the vast majority of our players have regressed or stagnated over the past few years.
That said it needs sorting, I don't know what the issue is - maybe it's the culture of this football club and lack of accountability. I think this season the players probably know that the manager is on his way out so they've downed tools for him.
Not a single player saw positive development over the two years under Ange, you'd say at first glance that Conte wasn't great at it either yet Sess and Skipp did get minutes under him, Mourinho again on reputation you'd discount him but tbf there wasn't much for him to work with at the time, he did give some meaningless minutes to youth off the bench in Europe on occasion, Poch despite his early days was overall dreadful at it...
The best person for giving youth a chance in recent times is Sherwood, but he wasn't around long enough to show whether he could actually develop and improve them after chucking them in.
Could be one major thing, could be a little bit of many things, I just don't know. Things that seem to happen naturally at other clubs just don't happen here for some reason.
The most baffling thing is that we can go out and get those things and people from other clubs and then they come here and all of a sudden it stops happening.
I thought, if nothing else, Thomas Frank was a pretty smart and capable coach, who would get us performing to par, maybe solid but unspectacular at worst. But he's come in and looks a total turnip, making stupid decisions left, right, and centre, saying inane things in the press...
It's unbelievable.
I think he is a good coach for the right club but these players aren't buying into him or his coaching style.
He’s not good enough to play every week , so we have 2 options drop him and he goes backwards , send him on loan to a team where he can play every week and if he does well and comes back full of confidence and ready to start for us then great and if not we have to sell . I know there are many fans that think he’s doing well and want him to start but personally I think he’s miles off , he was a much better centre back than midfielder .
We have seen enough of Gray to gauge his overall ability in various positions.
As other posters have said, he doesnt have an outstanding quality that most top quality players have, such as physicality or technical ability.
Is he really good enough to start for us? No, but I can see him as a decent squad player for the future.
As other posters have said, he doesnt have an outstanding quality that most top quality players have, such as physicality or technical ability.
Is he really good enough to start for us? No, but I can see him as a decent squad player for the future.
And then starts playing here and within a couple of months his confidence is crushed again.
This simply isn't sustainable, it's not an issue with just one player in isolation, it's everyone. Look through our squad and tell me one player that is better than they were when they joined?
That's simply not true.
Most I'll cede is that it's perhaps a matter of opinion.
I think that people get way too carried away with these two by what they want them to be, or think they could be. The actual meaningful output on the pitch just isn't there.
What about either of them is better than when they first played in the side?
Winks, Skipp, Mason, Carroll, Bentalob. Huddlestone - were all Championship players - which is where they gravitated to
They played far too many games for us.
None would have got anywhere near any top 4 teams squad.
And at the moment nor would Gray
If the club is genuinely ambitious they won't let this repeat itself.
Or maybe he never will be ready?
TBH, that is the most likely outcome. But we live in hope that he can develop. The excuse is not lack of minutes, because he is getting minutes (it would be the excuse otherwise). The excuse is the coach.
agreed.
Having a hopeless fool like Scott Munn signing youth would not happen at any of our serious rivals.
Sweet Daniel again!
Tom Huddlestone played 33 league games for Spurs, in the 2009 / 10 season which was THFC's first Champions League qualification through finishing in the top 4 of the Premier League.
Huddlestone had a great season and was a big reason why Spurs achieved their first Champions League qualification.
Huddlestone literally achieved the very thing you claim he was not good enough to do. He was a decent player for Spurs but struggled with injury.
Bentaleb was also a very decent player who fell out with Pochettino and was sold abroad.
Winks, Skipp Mason and Carroll probably were not good enough for Spurs or to play regulalrly in the Prem.
Of those 4 Skipp was probably the most unlucky and may still find a way back.
I never saw this but just basically said the exact thing about Djed Spence. Players arrive with talent and drive stall and go backwards. Something is NOT right.