Manager Ange Postecoglou

[Spaniel]

Who exactly is the mass injury crisis again? VdV and Romero? and Udogie. And Ben? Vicario, obviously...

As far as I can tell we still have all our attackers save Odobert and Richarlison- Richarlison who barely contributed to last seasons 5th place finish. We're not missing any amazing CMs as far as I can tell either.

Gray and Dragusin have done far better than we expected. More than fine actually. Same for Forster on the whole. I guess it's technically a "crisis" but it's not like the replacements are of such lower quality that it has been clearly losing us games, has it?

I mean, that's bad luck, but it's not Force Majeure type shit.

I guess I just don't agree that Ange is enduring a hopeless injury crisis right now. If anything through necessity we've discovered that Spence, Gray and Dragusin are all pretty darn good defenders.

If you say our defenders aren't good enough to help us attack successfully that's where I start to call BS and say that's not sound football if you're counting on your defenders to create goals and offensive play for you.

It's so bizarre how poor Ange can be in terms of points and how far people will go to rationalize why everything is just temporarily bad and set to get better any day now- in some pretend fantasy world where the return of VdV and Romero and Vicario will somehow lead to us scoring more than 1 goal a game again. I really do marvel at how far folks will allow themselves to be deluded.

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Hey...I didn't write this....just popped up and I thought I'd share for a laugh...

 

[Honest John]

I can't wait to read the reasoning behind the Ange-In comments if we were to get knocked out of the FA Cup by Tamworth.

At that stage, I mean it, Admin should be on a mass ban mission as there's no way anyone can claim to be a genuine Spurs fan and support that.

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Ha ha! Would definitely sort the wheat from the chaff once and for all, wouldn't it

 

[Nobody3]

The claim that Ange’s system “worked” beyond the initial ten-game honeymoon is an appealing but ultimately flimsy narrative imo. You’ve cherry-picked isolated wins here, like those against City or United, to support your argument while conveniently ignoring the broader trend of stagnation and predictability. One or two standout performances a season don’t validate a system—consistency does. You mention a supposed 16-game stretch of “great results and decent performances.” Care to list those games and provide evidence? Or is this just another anecdote to prop up a the managers failing philosophy?

Comparing Ange’s stubbornness to Pep’s is off-base, you don't win what he has without adapting to opponents. Ange, stubbornly clings to a rigid philosophy, even as it’s repeatedly exploited by opponents. This is widely recognised at this point, except by his most ardent defenders who think he is rewriting how the game is played. If anything, his inflexibility highlights why he’s miles away from being “elite.” The only time Ange shows any tactical deviation is when he’s backed into a corner and desperate for results—a far cry from calculated evolution.

Pointing to “circumstances” like injuries and rotation as excuses is yet another weak deflection as well. Sure, those factors can cause a temporary blip, but they don’t account for months of uninspired, one-dimensional football, I am not sure how people even find it entertaining now either, having one big blow out win against someone once every few months isn't what I consider entertaining. Even with a healthier squad earlier in the season, the warning signs were evident, and Ange has done little more than offer hollow soundbites in response to all this, like he always does.

You’re basically advocating for sticking with a manager who has yet to demonstrate even a shred of consistency in this league outside of his first ten games and that's not a "narrative" it's a fact that is backed up by the stats.

When was the last time we even won three league games in a row? The ONLY reason this man is still in a job at this point is because Levy fucked up the last two appointments so badly he has decided to stick for once out of desperation and because of the "Big Ange" "We have our Tottenham back" narrative that is still, for whatever reason, being touted around like it's gospel and giving him breathing room.

As for the notion of being visionaries, you don’t have to explicitly claim it—you’ve repeatedly insisted that this system has a “higher ceiling” than others. What exactly are you seeing that the rest of the football world isn’t? That’s the real question. Is your stance rooted in objective analysis or blind hope? Because if it’s the latter, it carries little weight, mate.

Listen, like I have said many times, I would love for this to all work out and be completely wrong here and Ange shove every single word down my throat but it seems highly doubtful that is going to be the case at this point, if not almost impossible.

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Great Post!

 

[Honest John]

The thing is some people are Ange Fans, not Spurs fans so a 5-0 loss only fucks up Spurs as his band of merry men will just follow him to his next club, I think we need to accept he has till the end of the season and just hope he can win us a Trophy while he is here, be quite ironic if he does being as 2 supposed world class managers failed to win anything here, while we are still in the cups i'm going to keep believing in the big man!

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Partly agree. Although I think you give Jose a disservice considering he got us to a cup final but wasn't given the chance to see it through. His record against Pep, and in cup finals generally, suggests he'd have stood more chance than Levy’s pet cat Ryan Mason of winning the damn thing.

 

[Kaz Hirai]

1:34
Amazing that a 50M player has such poor technique that he's not even close of getting that on target.

And no, it wasn't a cross.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4mQk1lepTg&t=6s

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has no top striker missed a clear chance before in such a poor way? if i could be arsed i could bring up a dozen as easy or easier missed chances from the likes of Kane, Ronaldo, Haaland etc. doesn't mean they have poor technique. BJ has many flaws to his game but his shooting technique is not one of them

 

[Honest John]

Hoping that we get battered and actively wanting us to lose is just being a twat and you're not a fan no matter what you think of the manager - fuck anyone who agrees with this and if you agree with it you can fuck off as well.

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Out of interest, did you want us to lose against City to prevent goons winning the title?

Can't be arsed to check, but the vast majority on here did.

Although the reasons may be different, the underlying reason would be the same. Wanting a defeat for what some percieve as the greater good.

For what it's worth, I hope we smash the dippers. But if you, or anyone agrees with your post above was hoping we lost to City then I'm sorry, that's downright blatant, stinking hypocrisy of the highest order.

 

[Coys1955]

View: https://x.com/alex_crook/status/1876288856267657635

One less option for us then.

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And one more option for us as well...

 

[Richard Arlison]

The claim that Ange’s system “worked” beyond the initial ten-game honeymoon is an appealing but ultimately flimsy narrative imo.

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OK LOL

You’ve cherry-picked isolated wins here, like those against City or United,

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Wasn't just those game I picked was it mate? I picked a collection of different systems it worked against, situations and lineups like Europa League but you ignored that. Why did you ignore that?

to support your argument while conveniently ignoring the broader trend of stagnation and predictability. One or two standout performances a season don’t validate a system—consistency does.

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I agree consistency does and more importantly, winning things does. Note I am NOT saying his system is validated and never have. It's only the Ange OUT crew that I see claiming a final verdict at this point. My mind is open still. I am open to watching a bit longer to see if it can work consistently and win things.

You mention a supposed 16-game stretch of “great results and decent performances.” Care to list those games and provide evidence? Or is this just another anecdote to prop up a the managers failing philosophy?

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dudu is your man here. He's probably posted the list of games about 20 times though.

Comparing Ange’s stubbornness to Pep’s is off-base, you don't win what he has without adapting to opponents. Ange, stubbornly clings to a rigid philosophy, even as it’s repeatedly exploited by opponents.

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You mean like this season when Pep's system was getting exploited repeatedly? Funny because he didn't give up on his philosophy then either. Like I said that doesn't make Ange the same as Pep (nobody is) but it does confirm what I'm saying that stubborn belief in their philosophy is something all elite sports people share. Even if it makes them arrogant at times.

This is widely recognised at this point, except by his most ardent defenders who think he is rewriting how the game is played. If anything, his inflexibility highlights why he’s miles away from being “elite.”

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Widely recognized by who?

The only time Ange shows any tactical deviation is when he’s backed into a corner and desperate for results—a far cry from calculated evolution.

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Really? or were those the only times you noticed tactical deviations?

Pointing to “circumstances” like injuries and rotation as excuses is yet another weak deflection as well. Sure, those factors can cause a temporary blip, but they don’t account for months of uninspired, one-dimensional football,

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A refusal to budge from an attacking philosophy isn't one dimensional. I haven't see us as being one-dimensional and the number of different goal scorers we have and the variety of different types of goals we have scored provides actual evidence that we haven't been one-dimensional. Our results and the calamity of our player availability has been boring and one-dimensional I give you that.

I am not sure how people even find it entertaining now either, having one big blow out win against someone once every few months isn't what I consider entertaining.

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I guess entertainment is subjective but I think a straw poll of Spurs fans would find >90% think his football is more entertaining than Conte, Jose or Nuno for example. Tbh I think the Premier League product in general is on a massive downward spiral atm and most people are associating final result and a bit of controversy with entertainment.

Saying all that, I want to see us win. Entertainment is part of the picture but not all of it.

Even with a healthier squad earlier in the season, the warning signs were evident, and Ange has done little more than offer hollow soundbites in response to all this, like he always does.

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I don't hear soundbites, I hear a man consistently saying what he believes. People cling to them in anyway they want but will always judge their opinion of what he says based on results. If we were winning people would love what he says. We aren't so they hate every word.

You’re basically advocating for sticking with a manager who has yet to demonstrate even a shred of consistency in this league outside of his first ten games and that's not a "narrative" it's a fact that is backed up by the stats.

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Again the 10 games... we don't agree so at this point what is the value to this conversation of you just repeating it as the major basis of your opinion?

When was the last time we even won three league games in a row? The ONLY reason this man is still in a job at this point is because Levy fucked up the last two appointments so badly he has decided to stick for once out of desperation and because of the "Big Ange" "We have our Tottenham back" narrative that is still, for whatever reason, being touted around like it's gospel and giving him breathing room.

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The fact that so many different managers have been binned off at the first sign of trouble is also the reason this fanbase has been conditioned to believe that changing managers is the solution. Who knows what Poch might have done if he wasn't sacked and given the license to lead the rebuild he wanted? Who knows if Jose would have won the LC if he wasn't sacked? MAybe Nuno would have turned us around have us in second like Forest... Did sacking any of them help us in any long-term way? No it didn't. The odd short term, quick hit fix of adrenaline maybe but long-term we always wound up exactly where we were.

As for the notion of being visionaries, you don’t have to explicitly claim it—you’ve repeatedly insisted that this system has a “higher ceiling” than others. What exactly are you seeing that the rest of the football world isn’t? That’s the real question. Is your stance rooted in objective analysis or blind hope? Because if it’s the latter, it carries little weight, mate.

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You love to bang on about those first 10 games but that was our best start to a Premier League season ever.If that's not a higher ceiling what is?

 

[Shadydan]

Out of interest, did you want us to lose against City to prevent goons winning the title?

Can't be arsed to check, but the vast majority on here did.

Although the reasons may be different, the underlying reason would be the same. Wanting a defeat for what some percieve as the greater good.

For what it's worth, I hope we smash the dippers. But if you, or anyone agrees with your post above was hoping we lost to City then I'm sorry, that's downright blatant, stinking hypocrisy of the highest order.

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Go and check, you might as well...you're on a roll today seeing as you're constantly verifying your beliefs, obviously.

You might even go 3 for 3 today

 

[Emala]

OK LOL


Wasn't just those game I picked was it mate? I picked a collection of different systems it worked against, situations and lineups like Europa League but you ignored that. Why did you ignore that?



I agree consistency does and more importantly, winning things does. Note I am NOT saying his system is validated and never have. It's only the Ange OUt crew that I see claiming a final verdict at this point. My mind is open still. I am to watching a bit longer to see if it can work consistently and win things.



dudu is your man here. He's probably posted the list of games about 20 times though.



You mean like this season when Pep's system was getting exploited repeatedly? Funny because he didn't give up on his philosophy then either. Like I said that doesn't make Ange the same as Pep (nobody is) but it does confirm what I'm saying that stubborn belief in their philosophy is something all elite sports people share. Even if it makes them arrogant at times.



Widely recognized by who?



Really? or were those the only times you noticed tactical deviations?



A refusal to budge from an attacking philosophy isn't one dimensional. I haven't see us as being one-dimensional and the number of different goal scorers we have and the variety of different types of goals we have scored provides actual evidence that we haven't been one-dimensional. Our results and the calamity of our player availability has been boring and one-dimensional I give you that.



I guess entertainment is subjective but I think a straw poll of Spurs fans would find >90% think his football is more entertaining than Conte, Jose or Nuno for example. Tbh I think the Premier League product in general is on a massive downward spiral atm and most people are associating final result and a bit of controversy with entertainment.

Saying all that, I want to see us win. Entertainment is part of the picture but not all of it.



I don't hear soundbites, I hear a man consistently saying what he believes. People cling to them in anyway they want but will always judge their opinion of what he says based on results. If we were winning people would love what he says. We aren't so they hate every word.


Again the 10 games... we don't agree so at this point what is the value to this conversation of you just repeating it as the major basis of your opinion?



The fact that so many different managers have been binned off at the first sign of trouble is also the reason this fanbase has been conditioned to believe that changing managers is the solution. Who knows what Poch might have done if he wasn't sacked and given the license to lead the rebuild he wanted? Who knows if Jose would have won the LC if he wasn't sacked? MAybe Nuno would have turned us around have us in second like Forest... Did sacking any of them help us in any long-term way? No it didn't. The odd short term, quick hit fix of adrenaline maybe but long-term we always wound up exactly where we were.


You love to bang on about those first 10 games but that was our best start to a Premier League season ever.If that's not a higher ceiling what is?

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I'm not going to read all that.

 

[Shadydan]

OK LOL


Wasn't just those game I picked was it mate? I picked a collection of different systems it worked against, situations and lineups like Europa League but you ignored that. Why did you ignore that?



I agree consistency does and more importantly, winning things does. Note I am NOT saying his system is validated and never have. It's only the Ange OUT crew that I see claiming a final verdict at this point. My mind is open still. I am open to watching a bit longer to see if it can work consistently and win things.



dudu is your man here. He's probably posted the list of games about 20 times though.



You mean like this season when Pep's system was getting exploited repeatedly? Funny because he didn't give up on his philosophy then either. Like I said that doesn't make Ange the same as Pep (nobody is) but it does confirm what I'm saying that stubborn belief in their philosophy is something all elite sports people share. Even if it makes them arrogant at times.



Widely recognized by who?



Really? or were those the only times you noticed tactical deviations?



A refusal to budge from an attacking philosophy isn't one dimensional. I haven't see us as being one-dimensional and the number of different goal scorers we have and the variety of different types of goals we have scored provides actual evidence that we haven't been one-dimensional. Our results and the calamity of our player availability has been boring and one-dimensional I give you that.



I guess entertainment is subjective but I think a straw poll of Spurs fans would find >90% think his football is more entertaining than Conte, Jose or Nuno for example. Tbh I think the Premier League product in general is on a massive downward spiral atm and most people are associating final result and a bit of controversy with entertainment.

Saying all that, I want to see us win. Entertainment is part of the picture but not all of it.



I don't hear soundbites, I hear a man consistently saying what he believes. People cling to them in anyway they want but will always judge their opinion of what he says based on results. If we were winning people would love what he says. We aren't so they hate every word.


Again the 10 games... we don't agree so at this point what is the value to this conversation of you just repeating it as the major basis of your opinion?



The fact that so many different managers have been binned off at the first sign of trouble is also the reason this fanbase has been conditioned to believe that changing managers is the solution. Who knows what Poch might have done if he wasn't sacked and given the license to lead the rebuild he wanted? Who knows if Jose would have won the LC if he wasn't sacked? MAybe Nuno would have turned us around have us in second like Forest... Did sacking any of them help us in any long-term way? No it didn't. The odd short term, quick hit fix of adrenaline maybe but long-term we always wound up exactly where we were.


You love to bang on about those first 10 games but that was our best start to a Premier League season ever.If that's not a higher ceiling what is?

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Nice, you're cooking succulent Beef here but everyone in here are those weird vegans extremists who tell the whole they are vegan and like to be "different"

 

[Richard Arlison]

I'm not going to read all that.

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That's nice but I wasn't replying to you or expecting you to.

Next time though, if you aren't going to read something, save us both the time and don't reply it either.

Think you can manage that champ?

 

[Bazali]

View: https://x.com/alex_crook/status/1876288856267657635

One less option for us then.

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Was never an option for me!

 

[Dudski]

Genuine convinced at this stage, nothing will turn them against him.
If we narrowly escape relegation, they'd still stand by him.

They can blame Levy until they go blue in the face.
But we have been pretty much consistently in the top 6 for 15+ years now.
So to finish in the lower bottom half is on the manager and the manager alone.

And that last paragraph is for fully signed up hater of all things Levy and ENIC.
But the only thing to blame them for here is hiring and now not firing a fraud. One who is damaging the assets and not getting them where they should be.

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It's the Spursholm Syndrome.

 

[spursfan76]

has no top striker missed a clear chance before in such a poor way? if i could be arsed i could bring up a dozen as easy or easier missed chances from the likes of Kane, Ronaldo, Haaland etc. doesn't mean they have poor technique. BJ has many flaws to his game but his shooting technique is not one of them

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That's one of the worst misses I've seen. Just terrible timing and coordination. On top of that he doesn't have a left foot. Never seen him use it ever once.
Son has scored screamers with both feet. It would make more sense to play Son on the right as he can both beat a man and cut in and curl with his left foot.
While Son is still here, why bench him in favour of BJ. If your aim is winning, why not start with the strongest team?

For BJ's shot, he can only shoot with the inside of his foot. It's greatly limiting his ability as a finisher. Yesterday showed that. The finish was pathetic. We're not talking about a junior player. We're talking about a so called 50 M wonder kid. I've seen three year olds striking cleaner than BJ.

It's not his fault, but the blame is on Ange for 1) not spotting this and 2) to keep playing him despite him limiting our game. It's really infuriating when we can have such good attack as we had against Southampton and Man City. The two recent games when BJ didn't start.

 

[Deleted member 17133]

OK LOL


Wasn't just those game I picked was it mate? I picked a collection of different systems it worked against, situations and lineups like Europa League but you ignored that. Why did you ignore that?



I agree consistency does and more importantly, winning things does. Note I am NOT saying his system is validated and never have. It's only the Ange OUT crew that I see claiming a final verdict at this point. My mind is open still. I am open to watching a bit longer to see if it can work consistently and win things.



dudu is your man here. He's probably posted the list of games about 20 times though.



You mean like this season when Pep's system was getting exploited repeatedly? Funny because he didn't give up on his philosophy then either. Like I said that doesn't make Ange the same as Pep (nobody is) but it does confirm what I'm saying that stubborn belief in their philosophy is something all elite sports people share. Even if it makes them arrogant at times.



Widely recognized by who?



Really? or were those the only times you noticed tactical deviations?



A refusal to budge from an attacking philosophy isn't one dimensional. I haven't see us as being one-dimensional and the number of different goal scorers we have and the variety of different types of goals we have scored provides actual evidence that we haven't been one-dimensional. Our results and the calamity of our player availability has been boring and one-dimensional I give you that.



I guess entertainment is subjective but I think a straw poll of Spurs fans would find >90% think his football is more entertaining than Conte, Jose or Nuno for example. Tbh I think the Premier League product in general is on a massive downward spiral atm and most people are associating final result and a bit of controversy with entertainment.

Saying all that, I want to see us win. Entertainment is part of the picture but not all of it.



I don't hear soundbites, I hear a man consistently saying what he believes. People cling to them in anyway they want but will always judge their opinion of what he says based on results. If we were winning people would love what he says. We aren't so they hate every word.


Again the 10 games... we don't agree so at this point what is the value to this conversation of you just repeating it as the major basis of your opinion?



The fact that so many different managers have been binned off at the first sign of trouble is also the reason this fanbase has been conditioned to believe that changing managers is the solution. Who knows what Poch might have done if he wasn't sacked and given the license to lead the rebuild he wanted? Who knows if Jose would have won the LC if he wasn't sacked? MAybe Nuno would have turned us around have us in second like Forest... Did sacking any of them help us in any long-term way? No it didn't. The odd short term, quick hit fix of adrenaline maybe but long-term we always wound up exactly where we were.


You love to bang on about those first 10 games but that was our best start to a Premier League season ever.If that's not a higher ceiling what is?

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Greatly written post.

You write everything without any emotion, but in an almost perfect way to present the important content points of discussion.

Great work, I think it is one of the best posts I have read here.

Thank you very much, and by the way, I completely agree with your assessment.

 

[Dudski]

Wasn’t the personality for me.

It’s the football I’ve seen when we are at our best and the conviction to stick to his guns under pressure.

Winners don’t budge. People give Ange shit for being stubborn about what he believes in but that is a trait that every single elite sports person has. Maybe it doesn’t work at a club like Spurs and we should just accept the underdog mentality of being flexible to finish top 4.

I’ve just seen that road for us before and it’s not really worth giving time to. I can live with the anger of seeing this season out just to know for sure that it won’t work over longer periods because I’ve seen it really work for shorter periods.

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I would agree with giving Postecoglou a pass for this season because it's only year two and all the injuries. But there should come a time when he produces results. I think that won't happen because Ange Ball ignores footballs version of gravity, the fundamentals that produce good, well rounded football. He's a smart guy who can play to the crowd and talk a good game. But he's not in Scotland anymore and it shows.

 

[manmountainbutters]

I expect we will be out the Carabao soon.

We should make the top 8 in the Europa, but if we lose away from home we may well not. Huge balls-up this tbh. We haven't looked good in that tournament all season though.

Tamworth is a key game for Ange. Don't think Levy could take that humiliation. But assuming he gets past that and we're still in the Europa (i.e. either top 8 or into 16 play-off) then the league is where Ange could "slip up" Everton away is looking massive tbh. If we lose our next couple of league games it's really starting to look like freefall.

So I could see possibly the sack at:

- out the Carabao
- Still in FA Cup
- Into Europa play-off round
- Freefall in league

That might be optimistic. It might take us to go out of one of the other cups, along with a few league atrocities to get the old barnacle off the rock. I can't believe we have to be out of all three cups and bottom 4 or 5 in the league for him to go? What do people think is the endgame here? How will it end?

 

[Kaz Hirai]

That's one of the worst misses I've seen. Just terrible timing and coordination. On top of that he doesn't have a left foot. Never seen him use it ever once.
Son has scored screamers with both feet. It would make more sense to play Son on the right as he can both beat a man and cut in and curl with his left foot.
While Son is still here, why bench him in favour of BJ. If your aim is winning, why not start with the strongest team?

For BJ's shot, he can only shoot with the inside of his foot. It's greatly limiting his ability as a finisher. Yesterday showed that. The finish was pathetic. We're not talking about a junior player. We're talking about a so called 50 M wonder kid. I've seen three year olds striking cleaner than BJ.

It's not his fault, but the blame is on Ange for 1) not spotting this and 2) to keep playing him despite him limiting our game. It's really infuriating when we can have such good attack as we had against Southampton and Man City. The two recent games when BJ didn't start.

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is it really? you cant watch much football as i've seen players way better than Johnson miss much easier chances

 

[Don Pedro]

I expect we will be out the Carabao soon.

We should make the top 8 in the Europa, but if we lose away from home we may well not. Huge balls-up this tbh. We haven't looked good in that tournament all season though.

Tamworth is a key game for Ange. Don't think Levy could take that humiliation. But assuming he gets past that and we're still in the Europa (i.e. either top 8 or into 16 play-off) then the league is where Ange could "slip up" Everton away is looking massive tbh. If we lose our next couple of league games it's really starting to look like freefall.

So I could see possibly the sack at:

- out the Carabao
- Still in FA Cup
- Into Europa play-off round
- Freefall in league

That might be optimistic. It might take us to go out of one of the other cups, along with a few league atrocities to get the old barnacle off the rock. I can't believe we have to be out of all three cups and bottom 4 or 5 in the league for him to go? What do people think is the endgame here?

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Get to May and reassess. Thats the end game.