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Management Ange Postecoglou

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VonnegutBusy said:
He can see his wingers are not able to do what he's asking but he's making no adjustments at all. It's crazy.

He only took Werner off because he was forced to due to injury and Kulu saved the day.

BJ just made a pointed reference to "we play a certain way" when the interviewer asked why the performance was so shit. He didn't sound convinced.
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Yeah I'm convinced the players have lost faith. Every single player looks so handicapped by the system. I do wonder if it was the Chelsea game, where the players felt we could have got something from it, and instead of changing it, Ange told them all to keep a high line and we got thrashed. Since then it's been a steady decline.

I think they are still trying, but at the top level if you drop off by a few percent, it's massive.

Sarr, Bentancur, Maddison, they are look out of sorts in midfield. Udogie does not enjoy that inverted role. It looks so forced, like in stead of us looking fluid, it's like the players are robots and playing the exact way they have been coached instead of playing off the cuff. When the last 10 mins came and the tactics went out the window, the players started to play more freely and deviated from the system and we scored twice.

I am so confident a better manager would get this group pf players playing far better.
 
TravellerOfBoth said:
The manager can't change his over arching principles. We don't want a manager that abandons his principles when things are going wrong...

However, Inverted wing backs are not a principle, they're a detail. Focusing nearly all of our play exclusively through the middle is not a principle, but a detail. Players clearly being instructed not to shoot is not a principle.

We're dogmatic to the finer details, not just the principles/philosophy.. Contrast that with a Guardiola, who is constantly evolving and adapting the finer details of his teams.
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It's not the principles, it's his system. It isn't working in the slightest, been found out by other teams, players aren't performing. Bye Ange.
 
Aphex said:
Yeah I'm convinced the players have lost faith. Every single player looks so handicapped by the system. I do wonder if it was the Chelsea game, where the players felt we could have got something from it, and instead of changing it, Ange told them all to keep a high line and we got thrashed. Since then it's been a steady decline.

I think they are still trying, but at the top level if you drop off by a few percent, it's massive.

Sarr, Bentancur, Maddison, they are look out of sorts in midfield. Udogie does not enjoy that inverted role. It looks so forced, like in stead of us looking fluid, it's like the players are robots and playing the exact way they have been coached instead of playing off the cuff. When the last 10 mins came and the tactics went out the window, the players started to play more freely and deviated from the system and we scored twice.

I am so confident a better manager would get this group pf players playing far better.
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Yeah it's a really robotic and boring way of playing.

I actually liked when Spence took that terrible shot from 35 yards. It was refreshing to just see someone try something different.
 
Aphex said:
Yeah I'm convinced the players have lost faith. Every single player looks so handicapped by the system. I do wonder if it was the Chelsea game, where the players felt we could have got something from it, and instead of changing it, Ange told them all to keep a high line and we got thrashed. Since then it's been a steady decline.

I think they are still trying, but at the top level if you drop off by a few percent, it's massive.

Sarr, Bentancur, Maddison, they are look out of sorts in midfield. Udogie does not enjoy that inverted role. It looks so forced, like in stead of us looking fluid, it's like the players are robots and playing the exact way they have been coached instead of playing off the cuff. When the last 10 mins came and the tactics went out the window, the players started to play more freely and deviated from the system and we scored twice.

I am so confident a better manager would get this group pf players playing far better.
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Fucking Chelsea game still!

Tv Land Reaction GIF by #Impastor
 
Aphex said:
Yeah I'm convinced the players have lost faith. Every single player looks so handicapped by the system. I do wonder if it was the Chelsea game, where the players felt we could have got something from it, and instead of changing it, Ange told them all to keep a high line and we got thrashed. Since then it's been a steady decline.

I think they are still trying, but at the top level if you drop off by a few percent, it's massive.

Sarr, Bentancur, Maddison, they are look out of sorts in midfield. Udogie does not enjoy that inverted role. It looks so forced, like in stead of us looking fluid, it's like the players are robots and playing the exact way they have been coached instead of playing off the cuff. When the last 10 mins came and the tactics went out the window, the players started to play more freely and deviated from the system and we scored twice.

I am so confident a better manager would get this group pf players playing far better.
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I have no problem with the chelsea game. What let us down once again was finishing. We should have equalised but missed good chances
 
The system tonight saw us outplayed by a top half Championship sides second string. What more does he need to realise that he has to have a plan B as well as varying plan A.

I’m going Saturday, and I will get behind the side but I am dreading it - Brentford will park the bus and spend all game knocking it over our high line and Mbuemo will have a field day. Vary it Ange for fucks sake - Coventry were in every time their keeper knocked it long
 
Richard Splash said:
The system tonight saw us outplayed by a top half Championship sides second string. What more does he need to realise that he has to have a plan B as well as varying plan A.

I’m going Saturday, and I will get behind the side but I am dreading it - Brentford will park the bus and spend all game knocking it over our high line and Mbuemo will have a field day. Vary it Ange for fucks sake - Coventry were in every time their keeper knocked it long
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He's not going to change anything.
 
Aphex said:
Yeah I'm convinced the players have lost faith. Every single player looks so handicapped by the system. I do wonder if it was the Chelsea game, where the players felt we could have got something from it, and instead of changing it, Ange told them all to keep a high line and we got thrashed. Since then it's been a steady decline.

I think they are still trying, but at the top level if you drop off by a few percent, it's massive.

Sarr, Bentancur, Maddison, they are look out of sorts in midfield. Udogie does not enjoy that inverted role. It looks so forced, like in stead of us looking fluid, it's like the players are robots and playing the exact way they have been coached instead of playing off the cuff. When the last 10 mins came and the tactics went out the window, the players started to play more freely and deviated from the system and we scored twice.

I am so confident a better manager would get this group pf players playing far better.
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There's no need to wonder for long. When this fraud has been sacked we'll read all about that game from unnamed sources in the Athletic.
 
I still laugh when Ange was acting all coy about managing Liverpool in that interview 😂😂

Bellend. Sack him in the morning. Nearly got knocked out by a second string championship side. He’s an utter fraud.
 
Richard Splash said:
The system tonight saw us outplayed by a top half Championship sides second string. What more does he need to realise that he has to have a plan B as well as varying plan A.

I’m going Saturday, and I will get behind the side but I am dreading it - Brentford will park the bus and spend all game knocking it over our high line and Mbuemo will have a field day. Vary it Ange for fucks sake - Coventry were in every time their keeper knocked it long
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hes had an absolute touch that wissa is out, them two on the break would be lethal against this system.
 
I love Ange but results and performances need to improve. Otherwise, there's really no choice but to replace him with that other Celtic manager, Brendan Rodgers.

The case being that in his second season at Liverpool he was a Gerrard slip away from winning the league. In his second season at Celtic he won a treble. In his second (full) season at Leicester he won the FA Cup. Now in his second season back at Celtic, he's on course to win another treble and potentially the Champions League.

So you see? He almost always wins something in his second season. Two year plan!

:nunothumb:
 
Delulu said:
Not sure if true but just heard a stat that we have accumulated 6 more points than Everton in the last 32 games and just 2 more than West Ham ....
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It's true, but it's a cherry-picked cut-off date.

I'd rather look at full rounds, because they include playing everybody once so are at least somewhat meaningful:
  • First half of 2023/24 we got 36 points from 19 games, 5th best in the league. That included 8 injury-hit games after the Chelsea disaster
  • Second half of 2023/24 we got 30 points from 19 games, 7th best. Those 19 games included 3 at the tail end of our injury / AFC / AFCON player availability crisis.

Look at the second half first: most pundits expected to finish around 7th last season (there was even a thread created about that expectation, "The Race for 7th"). So achieving 7th best in the second half of the season was pretty much in line with expectations for a new manager during a rebuild. Certainly not the unmitigated disaster, "found out", "out of his depth", "Ange out" crisis that some seem to enjoy painting it as.

The first half of the season, measured against the same expectations, was outstanding. Maybe there was some "new manager bounce" at the start, but there was equally a solid effort during the injury-hit period that followed, getting 3 wins and an away draw against City in the 8 games after the Chelsea disaster.

But that overperformance in the first half of the season seems to have ironically helped feed the narrative that Ange doesn't know what he is doing, because our second round results weren't up to the same standard.

I know the comparison is over-done but for reference, Woolwich in their first 5 half-seasons of the rebuild under Arteta were 5th, 11th, 5th, 4th and 5th, plus one FA Cup. Ange so far is 5th and 7th. He's doing ok.
 
SeeSpotRun said:
It's true, but it's a cherry-picked cut-off date.

I'd rather look at full rounds, because they include playing everybody once so are at least somewhat meaningful:
  • First half of 2023/24 we got 36 points from 19 games, 5th best in the league. That included 8 injury-hit games after the Chelsea disaster
  • Second half of 2023/24 we got 30 points from 19 games, 7th best. Those 19 games included 3 at the tail end of our injury / AFC / AFCON player availability crisis.

Look at the second half first: most pundits expected to finish around 7th last season (there was even a thread created about that expectation, "The Race for 7th"). So achieving 7th best in the second half of the season was pretty much in line with expectations for a new manager during a rebuild. Certainly not the unmitigated disaster, "found out", "out of his depth", "Ange out" crisis that some seem to enjoy painting it as.

The first half of the season, measured against the same expectations, was outstanding. Maybe there was some "new manager bounce" at the start, but there was equally a solid effort during the injury-hit period that followed, getting 3 wins and an away draw against City in the 8 games after the Chelsea disaster.

But that overperformance in the first half of the season seems to have ironically helped feed the narrative that Ange doesn't know what he is doing, because our second round results weren't up to the same standard.

I know the comparison is over-done but for reference, Woolwich in their first 5 half-seasons of the rebuild under Arteta were 5th, 11th, 5th, 4th and 5th, plus one FA Cup. Ange so far is 5th and 7th. He's doing ok.
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Arteta was implementing a system, and seemed to have plans A, B, C, etc.

I'm concerned we're not seeing a plan B.
 
Pzabbythethird said:
Arteta was implementing a system, and seemed to have plans A, B, C, etc.

I'm concerned we're not seeing a plan B.
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There should be some kind of switch to a different setup when we pin the bus parkers deep in their own half- fullbacks going wide and waiting to hit dangerous crosses from deep, runners into the box, layoffs to shooters at the top of the box- but we don’t really see any of that. It’s a shame because there are some really cool options and we don’t seem to do anything.
 
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