-
The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...
Manager Antonio Conte
- Thread starter Fattynomates
- Start date
Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports
No but we know what happens next after he starts grumbling, those fingers will start to point at the board.
Seems to have a very short shelf life at clubs. Starts well then after a season or two it starts to go pear shaped. In hindsight what he did with us in his first season was pretty spectacular but after starting the second season as dark horses for the title it all went sour. Seems to be happening at Napoli now. Can’t see him being there next season if his comments are anything to go by.
I wonder why so many managers struggle to be normal human beings with a modicum self awareness.
I don't think that is such a big deal in Italy though, there are lots of players that have played for some combination of Inter, AC Milan and Juventus and it doesn't seem to be a problem.
Good manager. Has done better than most managers in his shoes would've in a variety of circumstances over the course of his career. Not your typical chequebook manager either, as he has a decent history of getting good-not-great teams to punch above their weight as well. See Italy in Euro 2016 with that dreadful frontline or us.
When push comes to shove he couldn't care less about anyone or anything other than himself on a non-surface level though, even though he would gladly pay lip service to things to push his own narrative. Remember how he presented himself as a spokesperson for fans during his (in)famous rant, and how some here fell for it thinking that he was actually standing up for them?
By the time you get a -by your relative standards, doesn't have to be a trophy winning one- good season out of him, the clock is already ticking. Leave him before he leaves you.
When push comes to shove he couldn't care less about anyone or anything other than himself on a non-surface level though, even though he would gladly pay lip service to things to push his own narrative. Remember how he presented himself as a spokesperson for fans during his (in)famous rant, and how some here fell for it thinking that he was actually standing up for them?
By the time you get a -by your relative standards, doesn't have to be a trophy winning one- good season out of him, the clock is already ticking. Leave him before he leaves you.
I think it's part of what makes some managers succeed. Most of the very best managers are some shade of maniac or arsehole.
I like Frank and I think he could improve us, make us CL regulars perhaps, but he strikes me as a bit too nice and normal to ever be a truly great manager.
Agree up to a point , but some of the shit ones are massive egotistical bellends as well. We just see less off the average ones
Wasn't it Bobo Vieri who played for all of them + Lazio? Pirlo did Inter then AC then Juve IIRC...heck maybe even crazy Edgar Davids did, now I think about it.
Think going from Roma to Lazio or other way round is the main one over there.
Pirlo did indeed belong to Inter early in his career but never really broke into their first team (only 22 games played according to wikipedia) and spent a lot of it on loan.
The bolded one is the true big deal over there. I can only think of Pedro that has done it in recent years. And he went straight from Roma to Lazio, no middle landing.
Yeah true. I think it's a bit like the top level of most professions - there's a much higher percentage of egotists, narcissists, sociopaths, etc as you've often got to be some degree of ruthless, charming and/or Machiavellian to get to the top. Even the 'shit' managers are still in the top 0.1% or whatever to have reached the Prem/Championship in the first place which requires a lot of ego and ambition.
The very best managers - your Peps, Fergusons, Klopps etc - also have some genius to go with the cuntery. But you can tell those 3, while charming, can be absolutely cut-throat when they need to be, though.
There are, of course, exceptions to the rule like Ancellotti, but I think it's the case more often than not. It's usually obsessive eccentric dickheads at the very top. Arteta being firmly at the dickhead end of the scale.
The managers are not as important as they used to be.
In my opinion.
The manager's main role is to create belief and credibility in what the team is attempting to achieve.
The best managers Spurs have had, in my lifetime, were generally liked by the players and the players were liked by the manager.
They need to be almost paternal role models to the players. Command their respect, lead and inspire them.
Personality is important.
Burkinshaw, Pleat, Venables, Jol, Redknapp and Poch all had the right ingredients.
Yeah of course - I'm not saying they're all evil psychos - it's not a black/white thing. To be a top manager you (usually) need incredible people skills and the ability to rouse, charm, etc. That's pretty much an essential skill for the job.
I just think the real winners at the top. Your Jose's, Conte's, Fergusons more often than not have a real nasty side that comes out every now and then when they need it to. That brutality that often comes with raw ambition. When you're winning the players feed of it and it spurs them on. And I think it's actually something Poch probably lacks. Fantastic manager and clearly a very nice guy but often seemed to struggle at the final hurdle in the big games, finals, etc. I can imagine us having similar issues under Frank.
I didn't rate Ange at all by the end, but I think it's partly the bastard in him that's won him so many trophies over the years. He clearly had a certain nastiness to him that came out when it had to.
That and the fact that most of his trophies came in 2nd rate leagues similar in quality to league two.
Yeah but regardless of what you think of Ange's overall level and how he did at Spurs that doesn't mean his prior achievements weren't impressive in themselves. He didn't have mega budgets in the Japanese or Aussie leagues and it was a pretty level playing field - you've gotta have something about you to inspire players and win trophies in multiple leagues. Celtic's obviously an outlier cos they're a monster in the SPL but he still won 5 trophies in 2 years which is more than plenty of Celtic managers.That and the fact that most of his trophies came in 2nd rate leagues similar in quality to league two.
He clearly wasn't at the required level to last very long in the PL but he's still won far more silverware than most managers at any level achieve in their career. You gotta have something about you to pull that off.
But anyway, let's not make this another thread about Ange.
He is very good at timing those I'm going to make my position untenable as quickly as possible and get financially rewarded for it missions of his, as he pulls the rug under everybody while the results are still more than good enough albeit on a downward trajectory. Allows him to keep his reputation intact in the eyes of third party observers as someone who is still getting results, but one whose ambition is not being matched by those complacent higher-ups and players that he has to deal with.
If he were to leave tomorrow he would be leaving behind a team sitting 4th and two points from the top. How often do managers get sacked for this? Virtually never.
Mourinho on the other hand, similar to Conte in terms of going on those missions of his own, often cuts his nose to spite his face: By tarnishing his reputation in the process while taking the whole club down with him. Looks quite amateurish in his manners in comparison doesn't he?
If he were to leave tomorrow he would be leaving behind a team sitting 4th and two points from the top. How often do managers get sacked for this? Virtually never.
Mourinho on the other hand, similar to Conte in terms of going on those missions of his own, often cuts his nose to spite his face: By tarnishing his reputation in the process while taking the whole club down with him. Looks quite amateurish in his manners in comparison doesn't he?
Last edited:
IMO the quality of a coach is still underrated by owners of clubs as an absolutely vital part of success or failure. TBH, not sure whether it is more or less important than it used to be. Clearly cash is more important than it used to be, so to that extent you could perhaps say the managerial component has diminished a bit (e.g. could an Aberdeen 83 happen today ... no, due to cash).
The Ange experiment at Forest - though a bit extreme - is a good example of how important managers are.