Yes, unfortunately none of his other 15 back/square passes out of his massive 18 completed were assists.
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Player Dejan Kulusevski
- Thread starter The Fighting Cock
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Yes, unfortunately none of his other 15 back/square passes out of his massive 18 completed were assists.
Again pretty much agree. Although average positions can be misleading: good rotations can lead to two players having the same average position without getting in each other's way. But I'm not saying that was the case here.It would be more valuable if he could excel in any of those positions. As I said previously, he would have been better as the RF instead of Johnson in this game because Johnson has no use at all in a game where there is no space to run onto balls in behind. I have no idea why Ange left Johnson on, the sub should have been Johnson off, Bergval on in the R8 and Kulusevski to RF.
Just to emphasise my point (further than the evidence already posted) that it was like having no R8 and two RF's, just look at Johnson and Kulusevski's average position.
Kulusevski's position averages out almost identical, but slightly ahead of Johnson and you can literally see a huge hole in the pitch where our R8 midfielder should be.
This isn't the first time Kulusevski's been asked to play R8 - Chelsea away backend of last season and he was similarly atrocious and uninvolved. They must work at it in training. Either way, it's ultimately on Ange. Poor tactical choice. But people saying Kulusevski was "good" today are nuts, and no surprised he was the first yanked off.
Yes ultimately it's on Ange. He seems reluctant to change more than one or two things at a time. Hopefully we get there in the end.
How do you feel about Porro / Bergvall / Odobert as a potential right side combination?
I had another look at his stats.
Taking Progressive Passes + Progressive Carries + Successful Take-Ons + Shot-Creating Actions as a measure of creative output:
vs Everton:
- Odobert 15
- Kulusevski 15
- Maddison 13
- Porro 11
- Son 10
- Bissouma 9
- Van de Ven 8
- Udogie 7
- Romero 7
- Johnson 4
vs Leicester:
- Maddison 28 (!!!)
- Son 19
- Porro 14
- Sarr 10
- Romero 10
- Bentancur 9
- Udogie 9
- Solanke 8
- Van de Ven 8
- Johnson 5
I’d need to see Odobert on the right but on paper it’s appealing, particularly the Bergval at R8 part. I’m not impressed with either Sarr (lacks creativity and vision) or Kulusevski (goes missing) as R8’s. It’s vital to our balance as a side we find the solution to that R8 issue, otherwise everything goes through Maddison and we are predictable.
Obviously the lack of involvement of Johnson stands out a mile, where Odobert’s for a 19yo debutant is good. But part of that is Maddison being the L8 and everything going through him, and v Everton Kulusevski effectively playing on top of him.
Going forward, especially against the more passive teams, Kulusevski needs to play RF and Bergval as R8.
Where did those stats come from?
It would be more valuable if he could excel in any of those positions. As I said previously, he would have been better as the RF instead of Johnson in this game because Johnson has no use at all in a game where there is no space to run onto balls in behind. I have no idea why Ange left Johnson on, the sub should have been Johnson off, Bergval on in the R8 and Kulusevski to RF.
Just to emphasise my point (further than the evidence already posted) that it was like having no R8 and two RF's, just look at Johnson and Kulusevski's average position.
Kulusevski's position averages out almost identical, but slightly ahead of Johnson and you can literally see a huge hole in the pitch where our R8 midfielder should be.
This isn't the first time Kulusevski's been asked to play R8 - Chelsea away backend of last season and he was similarly atrocious and uninvolved. They must work at it in training. Either way, it's ultimately on Ange. Poor tactical choice. But people saying Kulusevski was "good" today are nuts, and no surprised he was the first yanked off.
Coming back to this average position map, it kind of confirms something that felt true to me watching the game.
Look at Porros average position. It’s much deeper than vs Leicester and Porro had a fantastic game defending transitions. They looked for that channel ball all game but it was VDVs pace on one side and Porro deeper on the other.
Porro was able to be a bit deeper because we had a creative source in Kulusevski on that side playing in those higher up areas. I do take your point about the chemistry between Johnson and Kulusevski but then again it was those 2 who combined to create the opener out of nothing and vs a deep block.
It might sound counter-intuitive but however we do it, Kulusevski, Bergvall or improvements from Sarr, it’s vital we have creativity in the R8, even if just to make us better for defensive transitions.
Stats from fbref just adding four numbers together, Tottenham Hotspur vs. Everton Match Report – Saturday August 24, 2024 | FBref.com
Yes Johnson stands out for the wrong reasons. Last season he averaged 11, so a 5 and a 4 says he's out of form and/or confidence.
It’s so pathetic reading your comments about Kulusevski. It’s basically like reading zomb talk about PEH.It would be more valuable if he could excel in any of those positions. As I said previously, he would have been better as the RF instead of Johnson in this game because Johnson has no use at all in a game where there is no space to run onto balls in behind. I have no idea why Ange left Johnson on, the sub should have been Johnson off, Bergval on in the R8 and Kulusevski to RF.
Just to emphasise my point (further than the evidence already posted) that it was like having no R8 and two RF's, just look at Johnson and Kulusevski's average position.
Kulusevski's position averages out almost identical, but slightly ahead of Johnson and you can literally see a huge hole in the pitch where our R8 midfielder should be.
This isn't the first time Kulusevski's been asked to play R8 - Chelsea away backend of last season and he was similarly atrocious and uninvolved. They must work at it in training. Either way, it's ultimately on Ange. Poor tactical choice. But people saying Kulusevski was "good" today are nuts, and no surprised he was the first yanked off.
You hate the guy and won’t ever give a fair analysis. Why don’t you just stop embarrassing yourself?
Good to see Ange hinting at more flexibility in Plan A too:
For the most part, the players, particularly those who were here last year, have a good understanding. But that’s constantly evolving in terms of the way we want to play in terms of the players we have and how we want to play as a team. Nothing is fixed in stone that this is exactly how we will go about our football. The basic principles are there and that’s what’s pleasing about last week - we want to dominate games, minimise the opposition’s chances and we did that. I think a lot of it is embedded in there but it is a constantly evolving process.
This is fair. Everton with 10 men looked just as bad vs Brighton.
But there was much more “analysis “ after we drew with Leicester. These threads are mostly just people enjoying their football. No doubt the analysis will be back the next time we drop points.
View: https://x.com/hugopr1v/status/1827455330735026521?s=46&t=fbqxNuG9CT4qTaiJx8mBjg
Kulusevski was balling yesterday. As poor as Everton were, he’s in form right now.
Good point. He has always had ability to work in tight spaces with the ball at his feet. Under Conte he did that out wide on the right. Now, he's getting some chances to do that from central areas. Not saying that he is a world beater, but for a team that sometimes stalls out in the final 3rd, there will be times when Kulu is useful.
best hes been since his initial spell. nice stuff for the bissouma goal, good feet and nicely weighted for the tee up.
I don’t agree with your cause/effect summation. Porro’s deeper positioning is imo, the result of Everton being able to attack our right side much easier because there’s a huge defensive space where Sarr normally is and Kulusevski isn’t - because he was constantly treading on Johnson’s toes and not doing what a R8 midfielder should be doing - leaving Porro more exposed than usual.
We're playing him more centrally finally and he's benefiting.
Does this look like he was playing centrally
He was supposed to be playing as a R8. He didn’t though.
He's still getting used to the role, but he is playing more centrally than before for sure. His best moments happened when he was running around in the box with Brennan holding the width.Does this look like he was playing centrally
He was supposed to be playing as a R8. He didn’t though.
Because they played down that side 9% more?I don’t agree with your cause/effect summation. Porro’s deeper positioning is imo, the result of Everton being able to attack our right side much easier because there’s a huge defensive space where Sarr normally is and Kulusevski isn’t - because he was constantly treading on Johnson’s toes and not doing what a R8 midfielder should be doing - leaving Porro more exposed than usual.
9%?
Yes. 9% is a lot in this context. It certainly doesn’t support your notion that Porro being deeper was 1) deliberate 2) good 3) somehow a tactical benefit of Kulusevski not being where he should be in midfield.