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Management ENIC

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ENIC In or ENIC Out

  • Total voters
    209
Archie said:
Out of curiosity how much has levy paid himself since 2017?
And where do I look to get this info?
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Archie said:
Out of curiosity how much has levy paid himself since 2017?
And where do I look to get this info?
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The link I provided in my previous post shows the figures /charts from Swiss Ramble, a fairly reliable source.
It shows Levy earning just under £3m for last year.

If you're genuinely interested I'm sure you can look up the Swiss Ramble figures for previous years.
 
stevee said:
For the sake of repetition as well :
Our net spend for the last 5 years is higher than the Dippers.
Our net spend has increased greatly since moving into the new stadium.

You seem to imply (apologies if I'm wrong) that Enic are not spending all the revenues on the football club.
In turn, this implies that either THFC have a shed load of cash on hand, or that Enic have taken money out of the club.
Neither of which is true.

Oh and Levy hasn't paid himself £6m a year since 2016-17.

www.football.london

Daniel Levy just behind Man United's Ed Woodward as highest paid director

Figures have been released showing where Daniel Levy ranks amongst the highest paid Premier League diretors
www.football.london www.football.london
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I only got the Levy salary info from his wiki page, happy to stand corrected.

I think what my post attempts to illustrate (albeit in a crude way as I'm not that clever) is that ENIC bought the club fairly cheap, relative to what it's worth today. And that they haven't really had to put their own money into the club (low net spend, on average, I am guessing is paid for by revenue the club generates). And if they sold the club tomorrow, they'd have earnt a lot of money out of it.

So I do think that Levy/ENIC are better than Sugar, who imo was a terrible owner. But I also don't believe that Levy is some wonderful custodian of the club, he is making good money and if/when they sell the club, they stand to make a shitload of profit. In their 20 years, we have gone from a lower mid-table club to a Europa League club (with the Poch era a bit of an aberration as a legit Champions League club) and we have won 1 trophy, which is a minor domestic cup. But I do think match-going fans pay the ticket prices of a club that's a contender for titles. And I do think, as fans, we'd be better off under the ownership of the next oligarch of the month.
 
meaningless-friendly said:
I only got the Levy salary info from his wiki page, happy to stand corrected.

I think what my post attempts to illustrate (albeit in a crude way as I'm not that clever) is that ENIC bought the club fairly cheap, relative to what it's worth today. And that they haven't really had to put their own money into the club (low net spend, on average, I am guessing is paid for by revenue the club generates). And if they sold the club tomorrow, they'd have earnt a lot of money out of it.

So I do think that Levy/ENIC are better than Sugar, who imo was a terrible owner. But I also don't believe that Levy is some wonderful custodian of the club, he is making good money and if/when they sell the club, they stand to make a shitload of profit. In their 20 years, we have gone from a lower mid-table club to a Europa League club (with the Poch era a bit of an aberration as a legit Champions League club) and we have won 1 trophy, which is a minor domestic cup. But I do think match-going fans pay the ticket prices of a club that's a contender for titles. And I do think, as fans, we'd be better off under the ownership of the next oligarch of the month.
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Can't argue with the vast majority of that, tbf.

There is absolutely no doubt that top 4 is the ultimate aim of Enic/Levy.
As you say when they do sell they will make an absolute fortune, but I'm not sure we would be better off under new owners in the long term.
Maybe Enic have taken us as far they can, I won't argue otherwise but there is a chance that when/if we get new owners they will take monies out of the club, something that Enic haven't done.

Is that a reason to want Enic to stay in charge ? No, but it is a concern.
 
stevee said:
Can't argue with the vast majority of that, tbf.

There is absolutely no doubt that top 4 is the ultimate aim of Enic/Levy.
As you say when they do sell they will make an absolute fortune, but I'm not sure we would be better off under new owners in the long term.
Maybe Enic have taken us as far they can, I won't argue otherwise but there is a chance that when/if we get new owners they will take monies out of the club, something that Enic haven't done.

Is that a reason to want Enic to stay in charge ? No, but it is a concern.
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It's definitely true, things can always get worse! Which is a worry come the time they do want to cash in, but who knows when that will be? I think there might be another crack at getting a European Super League before they sell, but that's just a wild guess on my part.

Taking us as far as they can is definitely something I feel is true. I think I read earlier that Levy is the longest serving chairman in the Premier League currently. And I have to be honest, it does feel like he is slipping. I have not always been a Levy/ENIC out sort and we have made progess from the Sugar years, that is undeniable. But I found myself, at the end of last season and all this pre-season, wishing that they would fuck off.

Maybe chairmen/owners are a bit like managers, they have a cycle and in the end, the game passes them by and the club needs somebody new to progress. But then who is the question? Some yank who is like Levy on steroids? A rich Russian/Arab? Knowing our luck, we'd get the one who Putin managed to nick/assassinate. Ideally, Uncle Joe would sell a few paintings and somehow get that money into our transfer budgets (hire Man City's accountants), move Levy aside to look after off-field stuff only and just have one crack at a league title in his/our lifetime.
 
meaningless-friendly said:
It's definitely true, things can always get worse! Which is a worry come the time they do want to cash in, but who knows when that will be? I think there might be another crack at getting a European Super League before they sell, but that's just a wild guess on my part.

Taking us as far as they can is definitely something I feel is true. I think I read earlier that Levy is the longest serving chairman in the Premier League currently. And I have to be honest, it does feel like he is slipping. I have not always been a Levy/ENIC out sort and we have made progess from the Sugar years, that is undeniable. But I found myself, at the end of last season and all this pre-season, wishing that they would fuck off.

Maybe chairmen/owners are a bit like managers, they have a cycle and in the end, the game passes them by and the club needs somebody new to progress. But then who is the question? Some yank who is like Levy on steroids? A rich Russian/Arab? Knowing our luck, we'd get the one who Putin managed to nick/assassinate. Ideally, Uncle Joe would sell a few paintings and somehow get that money into our transfer budgets (hire Man City's accountants), move Levy aside to look after off-field stuff only and just have one crack at a league title in his/our lifetime.
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I know it's fashionable to slag Levy off but as Tomo Tomo (I think ?) says, maybe it's more Joe than Levy.
Levy can only spend in line with what the true owner (Lewis) wants to invest. That being said there is a lot of merit in what you say re cycles in regards to owners/ceo.
 
stevee said:
I know it's fashionable to slag Levy off but as Tomo Tomo (I think ?) says, maybe it's more Joe than Levy.
Levy can only spend in line with what the true owner (Lewis) wants to invest. That being said there is a lot of merit in what you say re cycles in regards to owners/ceo.
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He is very bald and punchable, that doesn't help his cause haha. I really thought Levy was pretty good for the longest time, in the past I'd defend most of what he did. Even when we didn't buy anybody for 18 months, at that point I was still on Levy's side (and looking back, that was such a mistake made by the club, and Levy has to take the lion's share of the blame for that in my opinion).

Hiring Jose, I could see the logic and was happy with the shit football, but us being top of the league after beating the goons in December (was it December? I can't fucking remember). But then he sacked Jose before a big final. And then we were piss poor in that final - but ok, maybe we'd have been piss poor anyway. Added to that, the Super League debacle. I was even ambivalent about that, at the time. Better in than out?

But then the manager search, pretending we had a shot at Conte. The PR video, having a dig at Poch basically. And how long and amateurish the search was. And I think this really pissed me off that I started looking back at other things, like the 18 months with no signings - Poch did want nicer furniture didn't he. Looking at the Super League in a different light, where we'd get £300m a season guaranteed, no relegation and no real need to compete. Just tread water, make the money, add value to the sale price of the club. And I think maybe it was like someone drew back the curtain and all I could think was "You pair of absolute cunts, fuck off!" Maybe that's where quite a few fans are at now, I can only speak for myself really.
 
meaningless-friendly said:
So I do think that Levy/ENIC are better than Sugar, who imo was a terrible owner.
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One thing I'll say for Sugar is that he was honest. What you saw was what you got. You never had to second-guess how he felt about a situation; it was all over the media. If he'd wanted us to join a Euro Super League or not wanted us to join, there would have been a 4 page interview with The Sun over it. We would not have been able to escape his opinion on the matter.

I think Levy has done a better job overall but the "smile as you kill" political undertones throughout his tenure have created a lot of suspicion and animosity which is where conspiracy theories thrive. With Sugar, that sort of thing never got a foothold because we knew he was the real deal.
 
stevee said:
I know it's fashionable to slag Levy off but as Tomo Tomo (I think ?) says, maybe it's more Joe than Levy.
Levy can only spend in line with what the true owner (Lewis) wants to invest. That being said there is a lot of merit in what you say re cycles in regards to owners/ceo.
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I think Lewis is obviously a problem as well since he could easily change the whole direction of the club if he wanted, but I haven't seen much to indicate that Lewis does much other than let Levy run the club how he wants.
 
meaningless-friendly said:
So, I dunno if this information has been posted before, but I'm a boring cunt so repetition is to be expected. And because I'm boring, I went here: Tottenham Hotspur - Transfers 20/21

And from there, I could see the net spend every season since ENIC took over in 2001 and I went all the way to the 20-21 season. 20 years of ENIC and the net spend is...£407.6 million. So the average is just over £20m a season over the period. Interestingly, for the last 10 years, the total net spend has been £148.35 million. Not even £15m a season, on average, over the past 10 years.

I haven't looked at other clubs - over the same period - yet. When I can be arsed, I will.

On the face of it, that seems quite a low net spend on average over the 20 years, and really low over the past 10 years. Take into account that our wages/turnvover ratio is always amongst the best in the league.
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What is the obsession with NET SPEND?

Harry Kane was academy
Dele Alli cost 5m
Eriksen cost 12m
Son was 20m

Would we be a better club if we spent 50-60m each for them?
 
Sir Archibald Crooks said:
People rightly focus on 2018 but the shite dealings and lack of investment in 16 and 17 started the rot. We haven't got close to recovering from those 3 windows.
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Yeah, the Summer of no transfers was bad, but much more of a problem has been the absolute dross we have wasted money on in the other transfer windows when we have spent.

I've said it before and I'll probably say it again, but many of the signings (N'jie, N'koudou, Janssen, Bergwijn, Aurier, DOHerty, Hart, Foyth, Sissoko, Gedson, Vinicius etc...) we would have been no worse off whatsoever if we had just used academy players as squad fillers.

Regardless of your opinions on the varying quality of the players mentioned, it's difficult to argue that they contributed anything meaningful whilst at Spurs. In fact, we'd be much better off potentially as we'd have saved a ton and probably made a lot more in fees from selling off Academy players with a bit of PL exposure.
 
harry7 said:
What is the obsession with NET SPEND?

Harry Kane was academy
Dele Alli cost 5m
Eriksen cost 12m
Son was 20m

Would we be a better club if we spent 50-60m each for them?
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I think it's pretty clear why the top clubs win consistently. They spend money.

Their reputation for spending money further means that the very best players are attracted to playing there. It's why someone like Aguero or Sterling would consider playing for Manchester City, despite the apparent lack of trophies in modern history prior.

On the other hand, this leaves the Spurs to mop up transfers of players that aren't being courted by the very top. And in that respect, it might. Be a fair assumption that they'll often not be the 'born winners' that some of the young hungry players are that join the top teams to fight for a place in a trophy winning team.
 
Kane you believe it said:
I think it's pretty clear why the top clubs win consistently. They spend money.

Their reputation for spending money further means that the very best players are attracted to playing there. It's why someone like Aguero or Sterling would consider playing for Manchester City, despite the apparent lack of trophies in modern history prior.

On the other hand, this leaves the Spurs to mop up transfers of players that aren't being courted by the very top. And in that respect, it might. Be a fair assumption that they'll often not be the 'born winners' that some of the young hungry players are that join the top teams to fight for a place in a trophy winning team.
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They considered playing for man city because they are a state owned club and can throw any money at players. Thats why these players went there.
Its why players went to chelsea before they won anything.
To compete we need a smart scouting network and shrewd investment in players like a liverpool or leicester. Weve had neither
 
Archie said:
Thank you.
Yes I am interested I will have a look
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Just checked where to find Levy's salary Archie, as there are many different sources.

You can look at the official accounts, where it is listed.

www.tottenhamhotspur.com

Annual Reports | Tottenham Hotspur

Find out about and download previous Annual Reports for Tottenham Hotspur dating back until 2006 and Interim Reports between 2006 and 2010.
www.tottenhamhotspur.com www.tottenhamhotspur.com

It's under the section "Staff numbers and costs"

2017 Levy paid £6m
2018 Levy paid £3m
 
harry7 said:
What is the obsession with NET SPEND?

Harry Kane was academy
Dele Alli cost 5m
Eriksen cost 12m
Son was 20m

Would we be a better club if we spent 50-60m each for them?
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Because success and net spend are highly correlated in modern football. If you can pay big fees, big wages, big kick backs to agents you can get the best players, best managers and create an environment where even more good players want to come. If Net Spend wasn’t a thing Chelsea and City would be mid table or Championship where they used to be.
 
I can't honestly believe that people defend Levy and ENIC so religiously. It goes further than that, they aren't just defending their mistakes, they are worshiping them for it. Surely these are trolls? Why can say "We have done a good job when we have finished lower back to back since the 16/17 season.

Basically during this time, we have lost ground to all the other clubs, and these people want to clap and say its an accomplishment. Its a crime and a disgrace! They are laughing at us out there....
 
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