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Management ENIC

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ENIC In or ENIC Out

  • Total voters
    209
Matt1882 said:
Different time though, wasn't it? No top 4. For most of the 90's only the top or top 2 teams got European Cup or CL football. At one point it was title winners, 2nd place and the FA cup winners only.

Strong league finishes for me are important if there's something at stake. But pretty much 3rd to 8th at one point was pointless for a while. And yeah, even top 8 was a stretch but it was only bragging rights as to whether we finished higher than WH or not back then.

I also recall us beating United, Liverpool and Woolwich more frequently in the 90's than for a long period after. I remember beating Liverpool away on the way to the FAC Semi IIRC.
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I appreciate the reasonable debate.

I do think there’s a massive difference between finishing 3rd and 8th even if it didn’t feel like that then. The league is important too & in the last I’d say 20 years we’ve been a ‘pretty good’ league team. *excepted as i say - every year is not the same.

I’ve been a fan since 94 and I don’t recall a lot of wins over those teams in the 90s tbh. Could be my memory - most of my memories are of getting beaten 😂

I know we beat united on the way to 99 LC. Was that Stephen carr beaut in the 90s?

Horrible memories of a home defeat to Liverpool when mcmanaman had a shot that walker went to collect it then bobbled on the ground as bounced over him .. awful stuff
 
FOK said:
I mean they literally have improved the team?

Tottenham away is that guy stelios right? Yeah I’m grand for him.

Other teams can improve too you know…. Like random eg Manchester City
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How have they actually improved the team?

Every game we play is in a competition. The PL. The FAC. The League Cup. A form of Europe,
And we win none of them. That's not improvement.
 
FOK said:
I appreciate the reasonable debate.

I do think there’s a massive difference between finishing 3rd and 8th even if it didn’t feel like that then. The league is important too & in the last I’d say 20 years we’ve been a ‘pretty good’ league team. *excepted as i say - every year is not the same.

I’ve been a fan since 94 and I don’t recall a lot of wins over those teams in the 90s tbh. Could be my memory - most of my memories are of getting beaten 😂

I know we beat united on the way to 99 LC. Was that Stephen carr beaut in the 90s?

Horrible memories of a home defeat to Liverpool when mcmanaman had a shot that walker went to collect it then bobbled on the ground as bounced over him .. awful stuff
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20 years ago was 2002 - we were well into the top 4 era then IIRC. I was talking about pre-ENIC 1990's when it wasn't a thing. You'd get nothing more for 3rd than 8th other than playground bragging. Also, back then, a lot of team valued an FAC almost as highly as a league title. Before the CL really became the be all and end all.
 
John Thomas said:
We're not one of the 99% of English clubs are we though. Not really

We're one of the Big 6. and before ENIC, one of the Big 5.
One of the most illustrious names in British football and one of the wealthiest, best supported clubs on the planet.

To compare us to the 99% of English clubs is both disingenuous AND false because many of those clubs DO regularly win silverware relative to their status in the game.

We used to. We just don't anymore
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More worrying is the apathy in our supporter base that accepts that as most clubs don’t win trophies nor should we expect to.

Losers attitude.
 
Matt1882 said:
20 years ago was 2002 - we were well into the top 4 era then IIRC. I was talking about pre-ENIC 1990's when it wasn't a thing. You'd get nothing more for 3rd than 8th other than playground bragging. Also, back then, a lot of team valued an FAC almost as highly as a league title. Before the CL really became the be all and end all.
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Years ago, if you went around bragging we finished third you would get laughed at

Didn’t we finish third in 87? All I recall is piss take from mates that we blew the two domestic cups.

Back when winning trophies mattered as it was a sport and not the top 4 finish to earn more money. We used to laugh at Wegner for that
 
B-0-Sspurs said:
More worrying is the apathy in our supporter base that accepts that as most clubs don’t win trophies nor should we expect to.

Losers attitude.
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nailedit-theoffice.gif
 
B-0-Sspurs said:
Years ago, if you went around bragging we finished third you would get laughed at

Didn’t we finish third in 87? All I recall is piss take from mates that we blew the two domestic cups.

Back when winning trophies mattered as it was a sport and not the top 4 finish to earn more money. We used to laugh at Wegner for that
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Yeah it was 3rd in 87. I remember 82/3 when we were mostly shit due to injuries but went on a great run late on to get 4th and a UEFA cup spot but there was a pretty flat feeling, certainly no celebrations. The season was deemed a failure really.
 
JohnLondon said:
These stats were shown on the Tottenham Away podcast & tell you all you need to know. And to think that there are people still out there who think that Levy & ENIC have improved us as a team

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Well they have!!

Previous 25years shows as 9th.
Now it’s 6th. That’s clear improvement. In black and white.

Especially taking into account the 51-75 period included two league titles and that’s also 6th!!!

I would question whether the season we finished 3rd on the second division in 1978 they counted that as a 3rd place or 25th.
As that’s not a 3rd place in the same way poch was in 2016 in my view.
 
BernardMatthews said:
Well they have!!

Previous 25years shows as 9th.
Now it’s 6th. That’s clear improvement. In black and white.

Especially taking into account the 51-75 period included two league titles and that’s also 6th!!!

I would question whether the season we finished 3rd on the second division in 1978 they counted that as a 3rd place or 25th.
As that’s not a 3rd place in the same way poch was in 2016 in my view.
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If you base it on what fans of most teams base it on & care about & that’s actually winning trophies, they haven’t
 
BernardMatthews said:
Well they have!!

Previous 25years shows as 9th.
Now it’s 6th. That’s clear improvement. In black and white.

Especially taking into account the 51-75 period included two league titles and that’s also 6th!!!

I would question whether the season we finished 3rd on the second division in 1978 they counted that as a 3rd place or 25th.
As that’s not a 3rd place in the same way poch was in 2016 in my view.
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They have included 2nd division and non league top 4 finishes in their top 4 sums.

Fucking ridiculous.
 
James78 said:
And it was the period when we weren’t very good under Conte that I didn’t enjoy,
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I think given the circumstances of last season, the fact we were 4th when he was sacked was a miracle.
It was this time last year, 28 games in, that he melted and went. We were 4th then. Had the ref not given a dodgy penalty, we'd have moved into 3rd that day, he wouldn't have melted, maybe we would have stayed there.

And he did that with players like Dier, Davies, Sanchez, PEH starting every game. I do believe if he wasn't ex chelsea, the opinion on him would be softer.
 
Mampi said:
They have included 2nd division and non league top 4 finishes in their top 4 sums.

Fucking ridiculous.
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Every thing you say is fucking ridiculous, as is the childish disagreeing with people's posts when their posts are factually correct.
The graphic was a bit daft, but you can still prove, unequivocally, we are a worse team in the ENIC era than any other post war era. It's undeniable.

So jog on.
 
Matt1882 said:
I think given the circumstances of last season, the fact we were 4th when he was sacked was a miracle.
It was this time last year, 28 games in, that he melted and went. We were 4th then. Had the ref not given a dodgy penalty, we'd have moved into 3rd that day, he wouldn't have melted, maybe we would have stayed there.

And he did that with players like Dier, Davies, Sanchez, PEH starting every game. I do believe if he wasn't ex chelsea, the opinion on him would be softer.
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I think it was the fact he made no secret of the fact he didnt really want to be here and the football being utter dogshit pretty much all of last season (it was decent the year before) counted against him. FA cup exits to Boro and Sheff Utd didnt help.

But you're right, he got us 4th against the odds and left us in 4th. I'd put his spell a mile above Mourinho's. Nothing remotely good or memorable came out of his 16 months here.
 
Matt1882 said:
Every thing you say is fucking ridiculous, as is the childish disagreeing with people's posts when their posts are factually correct.
The graphic was a bit daft, but you can still prove, unequivocally, we are a worse team in the ENIC era than any other post war era. It's undeniable.

So jog on.
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It's not 'undeniable' at all - as has been pointed out to you literally hundreds of times, it depends how you define 'worse team', 'success' etc, and for some people it's about more than trophies (which, let's face it, hardly any clubs win, yet they all still have fans); for some people it's about league position (being the most consistent long-term measure of success), and even then, that being considered in relation to CONTEXT, i.e. what has been happening at the time with other clubs, how the horizon has changed etc. You may not agree, and of course that is your right, but the above is a perfectly legitimate measure in the eyes of some (indeed many it seems) fans, therefore claiming your opinion to be the one and only legitimte opinion, 'undeniable', is simply arrogant. Other people can have legitimate opinions that differ from yours.

PS You accuse someone else of being childish, then end your post with "So jog on" - seriously? :(
 
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