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Management ENIC

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ENIC In or ENIC Out

  • Total voters
    209
LeParisien said:
www.linkedin.com

I don't buy the idea that Daniel Levy's tenure at Tottenham Hotspur didn't deliver on-field success. | Omar Chaudhuri

I don't buy the idea that Daniel Levy's tenure at Tottenham Hotspur didn't deliver on-field success. In the 9 full Premier League seasons before becoming Executive Chairman, Tottenham's average position in the English pyramid was 10.6. That put the club in 8th place among all English clubs...
www.linkedin.com www.linkedin.com

I know a lot of people here don’t like data but this is a great post.

He also has a follow-up comment:

Put another way:Tottenham Hotspur's average league position in the 9 years before Levy: 10.6

West Ham United's average league position in the last 9 years: 11.1

If you told West Ham's owners and fans that over the next 24 years they'll be involved in two title races, enjoy 7 Champions League campaigns and have a stretch of 18 European campaigns in 20 years, reach the Champions League final (with an epic journey), win the League Cup and the Europa League, sell the most expensive player in history (who you bought for <10% of the price) and produce England's record goalscorer... ... I think they'd take it.
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let it go GIF
 
LeParisien said:
www.linkedin.com

I don't buy the idea that Daniel Levy's tenure at Tottenham Hotspur didn't deliver on-field success. | Omar Chaudhuri

I don't buy the idea that Daniel Levy's tenure at Tottenham Hotspur didn't deliver on-field success. In the 9 full Premier League seasons before becoming Executive Chairman, Tottenham's average position in the English pyramid was 10.6. That put the club in 8th place among all English clubs...
www.linkedin.com www.linkedin.com

I know a lot of people here don’t like data but this is a great post.

He also has a follow-up comment:

Put another way:Tottenham Hotspur's average league position in the 9 years before Levy: 10.6

West Ham United's average league position in the last 9 years: 11.1

If you told West Ham's owners and fans that over the next 24 years they'll be involved in two title races, enjoy 7 Champions League campaigns and have a stretch of 18 European campaigns in 20 years, reach the Champions League final (with an epic journey), win the League Cup and the Europa League, sell the most expensive player in history (who you bought for <10% of the price) and produce England's record goalscorer... ... I think they'd take it.
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I stopped reading when you mentioned West Ham
 
spids said:
That is an overly simplistic view. Under Joe Lewis, the plan for Spurs was undoubtedly to buy at the right time (just before the PL era kicked off and the massive TV money boost), invest in the infrastructure and turn a club worth £80Million into one worth Billions. Job done. But Joe Lewis is 88 years old. Anyone with a relative past 85 will know that there is a significant cognitive and physical decline. Joe is no longer the decision maker - his kids are (I say kids but I think they are 60+ themselves). Jordan's position that ENIC cannot say they want to win more when they haven't invested over the last 25 years is flawed as he is talking about Joe Lewis and Daniel Levy, and not Vivienne . ENIC are effectively in a new era with new chiefs at the helm, and the next 5 years are more relevant than the last 25 years.

I have listened to a lot of experts the last few days online / pods / radio etc. This is a complex topic. But ultimately, with no loyatly / bond to Levy (similar to what Joe Lewis had), what did Lewis' kids have to gain from keeping Levy around? He acts as if he owns the club when he is only a minority shareholder. Everything went through him, inc. takeover bids, naming rights, investment negotiations, player transfers etc. Despite owning 25% of the club Levy does not have the wealth to contribute to injecting funds himself. Levy not retaining a non-executive seat on the board is telling - he has noone to represent his interests (as the second largest shareholder).

The statement this morning was a message of intent from ENIC (Lewis kids). They are not selling in this current phase. I expect naming rights linked to minority share investment to boost the football operations in the short term, and then longer term a sale when the club is worth even more. Being competitive in the PL and CL, with no PSR restrictions, and winning one of them, would see the club value hit £5B IMO.
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The message of intent has been made so now they will have to back it up. They want to win more games so ultimately they have 4 ways to do this.
1) put in a successful structure into the club and fill it with right people so that we can improve results
2) secure additional funding like through naming rights etc that get put into the team,
3)invest their own money into the team or
4)a combination of above options

So now they have started the PR campaign they will be judged against whether they do achieve what they say they want to. If we don't improve on the pitch combined with no real shows of ambition to help the team then ENIC will have lost their shield and will become the next target for unhappy fans.

Let's see how next 12-18 months go
 
I’m not sure I quite understand Jordan’s position. How would Levy agreeing to sell his shares with a view to remaining in situ have been achievable? If he owns under 30% of ENIC, the share review will have still been triggered regardless? And then blocked.

He’s obviously been forced out, but could it not be much more simple?

He didn’t want to sell and, beyond that, was no longer of any use.

Unless I’m missing something…
 
Cranston said:
I’m not sure I quite understand Jordan’s position. How would Levy agreeing to sell his shares with a view to remaining in situ have been achievable? If he owns under 30% of ENIC, the share review will have still been triggered regardless? And then blocked.

He’s obviously been forced out, but could it not be much more simple?

He didn’t want to sell and, beyond that, was no longer of any use.

Unless I’m missing something…
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my feeling is the Lewis trust either wants to sell up or wants to get minority investors involved to bring in cash for more property and boost player recruitment and Levy was opposed to both as he felt that would mean share dilution which is risky if you don’t get growth on the other side to balance. There has long been talk of Levy being very hard to deal with when it comes to take over or minority investment and perhaps he was seen as the blocker.
 
spids said:
That is an overly simplistic view. Under Joe Lewis, the plan for Spurs was undoubtedly to buy at the right time (just before the PL era kicked off and the massive TV money boost), invest in the infrastructure and turn a club worth £80Million into one worth Billions. Job done. But Joe Lewis is 88 years old. Anyone with a relative past 85 will know that there is a significant cognitive and physical decline. Joe is no longer the decision maker - his kids are (I say kids but I think they are 60+ themselves). Jordan's position that ENIC cannot say they want to win more when they haven't invested over the last 25 years is flawed as he is talking about Joe Lewis and Daniel Levy, and not Vivienne . ENIC are effectively in a new era with new chiefs at the helm, and the next 5 years are more relevant than the last 25 years.

I have listened to a lot of experts the last few days online / pods / radio etc. This is a complex topic. But ultimately, with no loyatly / bond to Levy (similar to what Joe Lewis had), what did Lewis' kids have to gain from keeping Levy around? He acts as if he owns the club when he is only a minority shareholder. Everything went through him, inc. takeover bids, naming rights, investment negotiations, player transfers etc. Despite owning 25% of the club Levy does not have the wealth to contribute to injecting funds himself. Levy not retaining a non-executive seat on the board is telling - he has noone to represent his interests (as the second largest shareholder).

The statement this morning was a message of intent from ENIC (Lewis kids). They are not selling in this current phase. I expect naming rights linked to minority share investment to boost the football operations in the short term, and then longer term a sale when the club is worth even more. Being competitive in the PL and CL, with no PSR restrictions, and winning one of them, would see the club value hit £5B IMO.
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Levy did all of those things (run Spurs) with the instruction and the agreement of the owners, ENIC. That is how it works, that is how it always works. Be that Joe Lewis and or his 60yr old kids (we honestly don't know the dynamic here - because ENIC are even more shtum than Levy). Levy wasn't a maverick, he ran Spurs against a strategy agreed upon by the OWNERS and they are ENIC.
 
Guido 🇺🇦 said:
Levy did all of those things (run Spurs) with the instruction and the agreement of the owners, ENIC. That is how it works, that is how it always works. Be that Joe Lewis and or his 60yr old kids (we honestly don't know the dynamic here - because ENIC are even more shtum than Levy). Levy wasn't a maverick, he ran Spurs against a strategy agreed upon by the OWNERS and they are ENIC.
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That’s true but things change. The trust has seen the power potentially move away from the dad to the children, there has been audits of the club structure. Just because it’s been run a certain way for a while doesn’t mean that will always be the case. They simply could have decided that the situation the club is in requires a different approach going forward and not an approach suited to Levy. They wouldn’t have removed him without a big reason.
 
Tomo said:
my feeling is the Lewis trust either wants to sell up or wants to get minority investors involved to bring in cash for more property and boost player recruitment and Levy was opposed to both as he felt that would mean share dilution which is risky if you don’t get growth on the other side to balance. There has long been talk of Levy being very hard to deal with when it comes to take over or minority investment and perhaps he was seen as the blocker.
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Agreed, but he can still, presumably, block?

As second largest share holder in ENIC, he must retain some say in the sale of controlled assets?
 
Cranston said:
I’m not sure I quite understand Jordan’s position. How would Levy agreeing to sell his shares with a view to remaining in situ have been achievable? If he owns under 30% of ENIC, the share review will have still been triggered regardless? And then blocked.

He’s obviously been forced out, but could it not be much more simple?

He didn’t want to sell and, beyond that, was no longer of any use.

Unless I’m missing something…
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I listened it to it live and was very confused. In my world, I can't just sell or divest my shares without first offering them to shareholders on favourable terms and/or at a fair proportion. That will be in every share agreement (if there is one) and articles of association. I believe it may be a statutory obligation (s561 Companies Act 2006) unless it is excluded in the articles (s 567 CA 2006). I don't think any agreement would allow Levy to offer his shares in ENIC without permission either. Further, the Lewis Trust will have veto powers included in the shareholders agreement or articles.

Very odd oversight by Jordan with his experience.

Edit: I wouldn't be surprised if Levy does sell his shares to a third party now. That would suit ENIC if they had the right buyer.
 
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Guido 🇺🇦 said:
Levy did all of those things (run Spurs) with the instruction and the agreement of the owners, ENIC. That is how it works, that is how it always works. Be that Joe Lewis and or his 60yr old kids (we honestly don't know the dynamic here - because ENIC are even more shtum than Levy). Levy wasn't a maverick, he ran Spurs against a strategy agreed upon by the OWNERS and they are ENIC.
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The Same ENIC who have owned us for 25 years, and watched us for 17 years without winning a major trophy before declaring they want to win stuff?
Don't get me wrong , levy was far from a saint, but these fuckers have had 25 years to show more ambition in the transfer market, the fact Levy last 25 years and got pay rise after pay rise says to me they were very happy with his direction of the club......
 
Guido 🇺🇦 said:
Levy did all of those things (run Spurs) with the instruction and the agreement of the owners, ENIC. That is how it works, that is how it always works. Be that Joe Lewis and or his 60yr old kids (we honestly don't know the dynamic here - because ENIC are even more shtum than Levy). Levy wasn't a maverick, he ran Spurs against a strategy agreed upon by the OWNERS and they are ENIC.
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A strategy agreed with Joe Lewis and that is whom his ally at Taverstock was and the man was supposodly all controlling. It has been long known that Vivian Lewis did not like Levy and that was why he was so happy she came to the opening game of the season. Even though Levy knew his time was coming to an end, I think he thought that there was a world where he could prove that he should remain. Obviously like everyone else I do not have a clue what happens next.
 
Raiders said:
What? We are owned by a investment fund in the Bahamas, the main beneficiary was Joe Lewis who could not give a shit. It doesn't get any more soulless than that.
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I understand that and will concede my comments are pretty meaningless against the context you have outlined.

I think better that I simply say I will derive very little if any pleasure if we ever got to a point where we just buy player after player, just because we can. I could think of nothing with less value.

If the emotion that flowed after winning the Europa was ever replaced with the shrug of shoulders and relative silence, that would be terrible, in my opinion.
 
Fattynomates said:
Bookmarking this for when the winter transfer window opens and we haven't signed Mbappe within the first 12 hours! :levyeyes:
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Seeing as no one else has, I rang the number. Explained I was a spurs fan and politely asked what the fuck was going on?

All I got was ‘ who is this, where did you get this number and if you ring again we will call the police’

Wankers are definitely hiding something if that’s their attitude
 
Tomo said:
my feeling is the Lewis trust either wants to sell up or wants to get minority investors involved to bring in cash for more property and boost player recruitment and Levy was opposed to both as he felt that would mean share dilution which is risky if you don’t get growth on the other side to balance. There has long been talk of Levy being very hard to deal with when it comes to take over or minority investment and perhaps he was seen as the blocker.
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I think they want to smoke out Qatar. That’s the white whale of a sale.
 
enfield1985 said:
A strategy agreed with Joe Lewis and that is whom his ally at Taverstock was and the man was supposodly all controlling. It has been long known that Vivian Lewis did not like Levy and that was why he was so happy she came to the opening game of the season. Even though Levy knew his time was coming to an end, I think he thought that there was a world where he could prove that he should remain. Obviously like everyone else I do not have a clue what happens next.
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Is Joe Lewis dead?

The Vivian Lewis stuff is Twitter rumour, unless there is a quote out there that says otherwise.

We are living under the same regime as we've always done, one of total media black out. Even in the aftermath of Levy leaving all we've got today is "sources close to the owners".
 
Fattynomates said:
The Same ENIC who have owned us for 25 years, and watched us for 17 years without winning a major trophy before declaring they want to win stuff?
Don't get me wrong , levy was far from a saint, but these fuckers have had 25 years to show more ambition in the transfer market, the fact Levy last 25 years and got pay rise after pay rise says to me they were very happy with his direction of the club......
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He did a BRILLIANT job for them. Turned £80m into +£3b-£4b (I'm not going to attempt to validate that valuation). Not only that they didn't have to dip into their pockets. There is an argument that he was underpaid, he would have certainly earned more money if he was working in the City for a major investment bank (although his prize is his holding within ENIC which would see him earn £700-£1b).
 
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