Probably true, not the scenario we all envisaged when the stadium was finally built.
This could take us 10 years to recover a spot amongst the elite again, an absolute shambles and waste of time from all involved.
-
The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...
Management ENIC
- Thread starter The Fighting Cock
- Start date
Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports
This could take us 10 years to recover a spot amongst the elite again, an absolute shambles and waste of time from all involved.
I loved Blackadder Goes Forth with Incompetence at the heart of every decision leading to a very tragic and sad ending. We are being run by the footballing equivalent of General Melchett. The only difference being our troops refuse to fight when the whistle is blown .
General Melchett ordering cowards to go over the top and being told to jog on is how I see us today .
General Melchett ordering cowards to go over the top and being told to jog on is how I see us today .
I would have thought that Vinai was an Enic/Charrington appointment given that it seems pretty clear that the latter was seemingly brought in to start the process of ousting Levy.
The whole Paratichi situation clouds things re Lange - was Lange a DoF or brought in to work under Paratichi? The whole tandem DoF was weird, Paratichi leaving not long after Levy could suggest that the plan changed along with Levy being sacked.
The thing that Incant get over from the Forest game is our fans did an Everton, we went full support, full crazy backing and the players second half downed tools.
The fanbase has now been relaxed, negative and positive. All the spectrums and the team won’t do much for any of them.
Totally puts to bed the notion of the fanbase being culpable, quite the opposite. Not sure ENIC or the team deserve this fanbases they really deserve the shitty Woolwich one.
The fanbase has now been relaxed, negative and positive. All the spectrums and the team won’t do much for any of them.
Totally puts to bed the notion of the fanbase being culpable, quite the opposite. Not sure ENIC or the team deserve this fanbases they really deserve the shitty Woolwich one.
A lot of angry people venting spleen , and they are perfectly right to do so . This is ENICs club . It has been for 25yrs . "ENIC" are fully responsible for the position we're in , and they're responsible for the losses that they'll suffer at the end of the season . The problem isn't the fact that we're going to be relegated . Everyone is resigned to the fact that this bunch of players don't have the guts for a fight or the wherewithal to fashion a last surge up the table . The problem is all of the players will have relegation clauses in their contracts , so most will find new clubs . The sponsors will have relegation clauses in their contracts too , so we'll have less money for players . We will have to survive on Championship PSR rules and bring in players to fill the spaces vacated by our supposed stars . We'll have the opportunity to sell the naming rights to the stadium , but will they sell them whilst they're getting so much publicity and recognition from "The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium" moniker . The events will help to plug some of the gap but we're likely to be £125mil worse off from dropping down to the Championship . We'll get the parachute payment but we'll still be struggling for money , so if we don't come straight back up we'll have to cope with even less money the season after .
In all honesty I can't see ENIC selling up now . The club will be worth less in the championship and everyone at ENIC will want top dollar for their shares so will try to weather the storm .
For all the money this club has had over the years we should be fighting for the Champions League title , instead we're fighting relegation .
Levy said "The new stadium will be a game changer" , we all thought that would've been a change for the good . Instead It turns out that the greedy fat cats just got greedier and ignored the one thing they should've been concentrating on .
I've said previously that I'll be renewing my season ticket , but the more I think about it , the more I'm leaning to the thought of not renewing . It took a lot of relocating to get the spot that I have and I don't want to go through all that again , but I'm frustrated and annoyed that unless people take action they'll consider my renewal as sanctioning their disgusting behaviour . There are 30,000 on the season ticket waiting list , so relegation will be a dream for those who'll be getting their season ticket earlier than expected . Does it make me a fair-weather supporter if I don't renew ? In all honesty I don't care if it does . Crikey just thinking about it - it's like a bereavement .
What a mess
COYS...&...TTID................CSWY
In all honesty I can't see ENIC selling up now . The club will be worth less in the championship and everyone at ENIC will want top dollar for their shares so will try to weather the storm .
For all the money this club has had over the years we should be fighting for the Champions League title , instead we're fighting relegation .
Levy said "The new stadium will be a game changer" , we all thought that would've been a change for the good . Instead It turns out that the greedy fat cats just got greedier and ignored the one thing they should've been concentrating on .
I've said previously that I'll be renewing my season ticket , but the more I think about it , the more I'm leaning to the thought of not renewing . It took a lot of relocating to get the spot that I have and I don't want to go through all that again , but I'm frustrated and annoyed that unless people take action they'll consider my renewal as sanctioning their disgusting behaviour . There are 30,000 on the season ticket waiting list , so relegation will be a dream for those who'll be getting their season ticket earlier than expected . Does it make me a fair-weather supporter if I don't renew ? In all honesty I don't care if it does . Crikey just thinking about it - it's like a bereavement .
What a mess
COYS...&...TTID................CSWY
As I've said before, it seems to make more sense if there was a wrestle of TLF moving to hire Vinai and have Lange as their DoF, whilst Levy, in parallel, was bringing Paratici back to be his DoF. A lot of double-hiring went on in the summer, that 's for sure.
still crazy that people are so obsessed with levy-blame that they aren't even holding the current lot to account
I think the fact that Levy was the main reason the club failed to challenge for the league for 20 odd yrs that they're blaming him for our current situation . He was in the hotseat when we bought most of the current squad and he brought in Venketeshan and Lange . The two people that said we wouldn't panic in January . I know it's hindsight to criticise once things have happened , but Levy wouldn't have let it get past October before he sacked Thomas Frank , he would've bought players in January when we had 12 players on the physios table , and he would've brought in a temporary manager with Premier league experience . But that said - Levy is still guilty of decades of poor chairmanship . For that reason I believe he's at least part to blame for the state of the footballing side of the club .
COYS...&...TTID..................CSWY
We did challenge for the league. Consistently broke into the CL places, had 3 top 3 finishes including a runner up, a champions league final. Would have won one if the league was honest.
If that's poor chairmanship then I'm sorry, but the fanbase is deluded. We've been run by a guy who did all of that with next to no (if any) investment from the Lewises, and now people are acting like they were the good guys this whole time whilst turning us into a gooner rage room project
I think you’ll struggle to find a single Tottenham fan who thinks that the lewises are “the good guys”. You can hold the view that they’re parasitic owners while also holding the view that Levy was leapfrogged by more canny, modern chairmen in the league and ran the club incredibly inadequately over the last 6 years, leading to the mess we’re in now?
Two boils on the same arse
Some ramblings !
“We” - as in the club collective.
There is no “we” it is ENIC + the customer. As a fan base we are no more connected to these bastards than we are to the owners of M&S if we buy their under pants.
“interim head coach” - currently Igor the Engine
Interim because it suits them ( not us ) Interim because it’s cheap. Not because it sets a direction, not because it sets a standard. Got away with it before. Hoping to get away with it again. It’s not interim as that is in the best interests of the club.
“Shit players” - as judged by the customers.
“Shit” as in not fit for purpose. However, it’s not that. There are too many under 21’s marketed as first team squad members. And too many players retained years past being worked out as sub standard.
The football team is not going to be relegated due to not trying nor not caring. That is an emotional assessment that suggests it can be fixed if they just tried or cared. It’s incorrect.
They are getting relegated as 50% of the squad are compromised, cheap or too young. Stop and consider that Gray, is still at least 2 seasons from being considered “ready”. He’s never played or indeed been called to the bench for England, yet he is the saviour. How absurd is that ?
Terrible Sporting Director - Johan Lange.
He is an employee of the corporation. He is clearly doing exactly what his bosses want him to do.
No point moaning, Screaming at him or Shouting and deriding. He didn’t employ himself. He does not sign players without permission and due diligence. When you see him “fucking up” never forget that he’s doing exactly what his bosses want. Cheapest possible purchase with the highest potential resale value. No more no less. Profit. Not long term sporting success.
Relegation - this is just slightly less money for the pricks in charge.
It’s that simple. The customer / fan base has already been duped into large fees to watch an inferior product, but the net result of where the football clubs finds itself is that the powers that be will be marginally less well off, until something comes along to plug the hole - hello NFL summer series and anchor Tennant.
All scare stories about fire sales are just a way to taper the expectations of the customer. Customers can pay exactly the same for a lesser product.
And they have a whole year to 18 months of not having to buy anyone who costs more than £15m. It’s a fucking wet dream from their point of view. Never forget that. To Dare was always too Dear, less money coming in v less money spent on transfer fees and wages. They have already considered all of this. And I guarantee that at board level the panic we feel is not bleeding though.
The future - The right thing to do, if you care, is announce a new manager this week, on a 5 year contract and signal intent.
Yet more drift and more uncertainty due to some unknown faith in a bloke you have already sacked is frankly insane.
Tudor’s appointment was / is absolutely the wrong one. Accept that. Be grown up. It’s ok to make a mistake. It’s unfortunate. To keep on making that mistake because a wish might come true is childish. Don’t wish. Make it happen. stand for something other then money, but of course that won’t happen.
Put a full stop on this drift? Nah. Far better to pretend to care, while keep on not caring really.
“We” - as in the club collective.
There is no “we” it is ENIC + the customer. As a fan base we are no more connected to these bastards than we are to the owners of M&S if we buy their under pants.
“interim head coach” - currently Igor the Engine
Interim because it suits them ( not us ) Interim because it’s cheap. Not because it sets a direction, not because it sets a standard. Got away with it before. Hoping to get away with it again. It’s not interim as that is in the best interests of the club.
“Shit players” - as judged by the customers.
“Shit” as in not fit for purpose. However, it’s not that. There are too many under 21’s marketed as first team squad members. And too many players retained years past being worked out as sub standard.
The football team is not going to be relegated due to not trying nor not caring. That is an emotional assessment that suggests it can be fixed if they just tried or cared. It’s incorrect.
They are getting relegated as 50% of the squad are compromised, cheap or too young. Stop and consider that Gray, is still at least 2 seasons from being considered “ready”. He’s never played or indeed been called to the bench for England, yet he is the saviour. How absurd is that ?
Terrible Sporting Director - Johan Lange.
He is an employee of the corporation. He is clearly doing exactly what his bosses want him to do.
No point moaning, Screaming at him or Shouting and deriding. He didn’t employ himself. He does not sign players without permission and due diligence. When you see him “fucking up” never forget that he’s doing exactly what his bosses want. Cheapest possible purchase with the highest potential resale value. No more no less. Profit. Not long term sporting success.
Relegation - this is just slightly less money for the pricks in charge.
It’s that simple. The customer / fan base has already been duped into large fees to watch an inferior product, but the net result of where the football clubs finds itself is that the powers that be will be marginally less well off, until something comes along to plug the hole - hello NFL summer series and anchor Tennant.
All scare stories about fire sales are just a way to taper the expectations of the customer. Customers can pay exactly the same for a lesser product.
And they have a whole year to 18 months of not having to buy anyone who costs more than £15m. It’s a fucking wet dream from their point of view. Never forget that. To Dare was always too Dear, less money coming in v less money spent on transfer fees and wages. They have already considered all of this. And I guarantee that at board level the panic we feel is not bleeding though.
The future - The right thing to do, if you care, is announce a new manager this week, on a 5 year contract and signal intent.
Yet more drift and more uncertainty due to some unknown faith in a bloke you have already sacked is frankly insane.
Tudor’s appointment was / is absolutely the wrong one. Accept that. Be grown up. It’s ok to make a mistake. It’s unfortunate. To keep on making that mistake because a wish might come true is childish. Don’t wish. Make it happen. stand for something other then money, but of course that won’t happen.
Put a full stop on this drift? Nah. Far better to pretend to care, while keep on not caring really.
No, there's plenty on here. "how can they be expected to fix all of this with one window"
That doesn't include the people who are giving the current architects of our destruction a free pass by putting the blame exactly where they want it to go.
You could just as well argue that the mess we're in now is a direct result of "the lewis family" grabbing the wheel and steering us off a cliff instead of doing what has always been needed - putting money into the club.
The current rhetoric from the gooner in chief has been that Levy was actually too frivolous, and they need to cut back. It's like a comedy
I'm not forgiving ENIC anything . The decades I was referring to were the 10yrs previous to Poch and 10yrs after Poch . ENIC/Levy struck lucky getting Pochettino , and we bought Dele ,Toby , Verts , Lloris , Dier , Rose , Walker , Dembele and Eriksen . Kane came through the academy , But my point is we had years of under funding from ENIC , then we had all these youngsters came through at the perfect time and we had a long purple patch - a bit like when Man Utd had all those kids come through at the same time . That period of 4yrs we were playing really well . But the club has been run on a shoestring budget by ENIC . My main gripe is that we failed to get players we went in for . We had more disappointments than we did successes
We didn't have "all these kids come through at the same time". We bought all of them except Kane. It's no different to when people were moaning that we bought "kids" that are our best players right now.
Every club fails to get players. That isn't a sign of a club being run rightly or wrongly, but I'd actually point to the fact that we were a much better club when we were steering clear of the 'big money roulette' and actually sticking to clever deasl
But levy put the processes in place that led to our current malaise.
The assembling of this squad goes back years. Levy flip flopped between managers, had shambolic recruitment structures in place, gave the likes of Paratici and Lange the keys to the clubs footballing future.
The result is a mishmashed squad of shit thrown at the wall, and millions upon millions of pounds wasted on the likes of Richarlison, Johnson, Solanke among many others.
This worked back in the mid 2000s and 2010s, it doesn’t work anymore, and clubs like Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth have all leapfrogged us in this regard and build squads and hire managers around a footballing philosophy set by their progressive, modern DOFs.
It’s no surprise to me at all that these kind of clubs are thriving in the premier league despite their financial shortcomings. Meanwhile 2 of the clubs who still operate in mid 2000s wheeling and dealing are languishing in a relegation battle in us and West Ham.
So my criticism of ENIC and the lewises is that they clearly didn’t invest enough money to take us to the title challenging capabilities we inherently have as a club, my criticism of levy is for his dated football philosophy that put us in a relegation battle.
I did say we bought them all except Kane , I just meant they came through at the same time , as in they were all in the same squad during Poch's tenure . The reason we failed to get players was Levy arguing over the last tenner . We missed out on a lot of good players because of Levy's valuations being far too low . Just one example - If you're happy with the fact that we signed Gedson Fernandes - when in fact we were trying to buy Bruno Fernandes but Levy wouldn't pay that little bit extra to get the deal over the line - you crack on mate . Me - I want the superstars that we should've signed in the first instance .
We were shit in 2001 too. Why do we have to completely ignore the most stable league era in the history of the club because of the last two years.
If you want to look at the reality under the skin - the club's downward spiral coincided with Joe's stepping away and "the family" taking over.
But let's protect the poor kids and blame people who had a track record of actually building something out of their austerity, eh?
Just think, the day they sell up will be one of the best days of all of our lives.