• The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...

    Get involved!

Transfers January 2020 transfer thread

Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports

Status
Not open for further replies.
He played most, as in the majority of the 2017-18 season in the AM3 and almost exlclusively in the first half of the season. I don't know if you been off to find statistical ammo but you know I watched those games. In the second half he got more time in the MF proper. Memphis took back his position in the second half of the season.

He earned those minutes and I can find my SC posts saying how much more useful he was than Memphis. Point is a youth player displaced a senior player on merit and not being coddled...just like Tanganga is attempting to do now.

Aouar’s first three appearances were in 15/16 all as a CM. In 16/17 he made another 8 appearances 3CM, 1 LM, 4 AM. 17/18 his real break out season he played 22 as a CM, 8 LM and 2 as an AM.

I probably watched as many of these as you, as you know I was talking about this kid 3 or so years ago on SC (with you probably). The thing with Aouar is he can play there, and probably did at youth levels. And still does play there sometimes.

That's great, bit not all players can and do. But here's the thing. Omnomah is not and never will be a winger. But he still didn't shit the bed on any of the games he played there (Dortmund away in the Europa eg) he just didn't look great, but why would he, he does not have the tools to be a winger. He still only had 20 minutes of proper first team football, with the "first team" around him in three years. Aouar had had 3000 Ligue 1 minutes by the time Onomah had 20.

The bottom line is, you cannot judge a kid in 20 minutes or even 5 or 10 whole games. Kane looked like a donkey his first dozen games and on some of his loans. Looked awkward, immobile, heavy touch and missed easy chances.

I do not expect the few academy products I suggest (and it is just a few) to become world class. But we are wasting hundreds of millions buying players who ARE NOT AND NEVER WILL BE WORLD CLASS, all I'm saying is some of those minutes could have gone to a handful of the very best academy players and our team would have almost certainly been no worse off, perhaps better even.

And that money could be used much more wisely on players that would genuinely improve our first team group.

Lesniak, Marsh and Amos are all categorically better DM's than Sissoko. They get about the pitch better, are more tenaciously dynamic and technically more comfortable on the ball. But for some reason we would rather ship them out and watch a 30yo winger with poor mobility, poor cognitive skills and terrible technique clunk about while our football goes down the toilet - for want of a simple functioning busy cunt.

In one game in 17/18 KWP created more assists than Aurier had in that entire season. Did that earn him a run of games? No. Of course KWP made mistakes - but so did Aurier, still is. There is not 50m (fee and wages of Aurier) of value between these two players. There's about £10 and I'm not sure which way.

But this isn't what happens widely in France, where kids will get far more trust and game time to develop, if they are perceived to actually be a viable alternative. And then we will pay 50m for them.

It's not like we are City or Liverpool and we have an uber talented bunch of seniors blocking progress.

We have kids that have been (generally) excellently coached, often for 10 years or more, have won world cups, but we would rather piss money up the wall on mediocre dross - and that is what our football became as a result - than give them minutes.

I don't want an academy player to play for the sake of it. I don't want quotas. There are academy players that I do not rate at all. Did not rate or want Townsend, CCV or Livermore to play for example. Don't overly rate Winks. But when we've got clear weaknesses in our squad, and a very highly regarded academy player in that position, it seems like common sense to me to give them game time rather than buy some mediocre player or play some older player out of position who's also going to make constant mistakes and effect the team dynamic.
 
The thing with Aouar is he can play there,
So what you're admitting is he is more talented then? Your honor the prosecution rests. Thanks for playing BC. I will entertain the rest of your post seeing as you've gone through the bother.

And that money could be used much more wisely on players that would genuinely improve our first team group.
I actually agree with you on squad setup and have said many a time. If a foreign playeer is to be brought in then he should be of unquestioned starting ability. And if a HG player is starting then unless he is of harry's class then a player should be recruited on top of him. And even in Harry's case there should be a capable alternative that is given minutes no matter what. And once a player is decidedly 2nd team then they should be moved on unless there is a HG consideration.

My biggest issue is with Dier and Davies whose federation affiliation don't help us in one way or another yet we keep re-signing them and clogging the team with mediocrity. But as the astute and handsome of us would point out it is cheaper to re-sign than the xfer in.

I'll tell you one thing, if it meant I saw us win the League and the European Cup before I become incontinent and start stuffing my dinner into the pockets of my dressing gown, I'd be bang up for Doing a Leeds
I think bus-conductor bus-conductor would tell us that it would be worth it even after this stage. What say you BC?
 
This club is led by two lads that just cannot help their self destructive tendencies

:levywtf::mourcry:

How is trying to negotiate a price higher than what's being offered, gaining us multiple Champions League qualifications consecutively for the first time in our history, highest finish in the league since the 60s and our first ever Champions League final seen as having self destructive tendencies?

Levy is absolutely right for trying to drive the price higher and with all negotiations when you do that there's either a deal struck or parties walk away. Unless sarcastic, which I dont believe this is as I recall you being a bit anti Levy in the past how is Levy doing a bad thing for pushing for the most he can at this moment when negotiating with a team who could genuinely win Serie A this year with a little extra help from class like Eriksen?

As for Jose, the bloke has won more major trophies than we as a club have in our entire history. Hardly self destructive work he's done is it?
 
Levy is absolutely right for trying to drive the price higher and with all negotiations when you do that there's either a deal struck or parties walk away.

The value of just moving the fuck on and spending time on something else vastly exceeds the sums at stake here.

He'll probably "win" this negotiation (though don't rule out the possibility of a desultory Eriksen being stuck submarining squad morality the rest of the season), but the point is, and honestly I think Levy's backers and his critics agree on this, the man truly just cannot help himself. He HAS to grind these deals into dust personally trying to better and humiliate his counterparty.

He's incredibly good at it. I just don't see how it's any way to run a football club of this size.
 
The value of just moving the fuck on and spending time on something else vastly exceeds the sums at stake here.

So let's move on from Kane because he misses 10 games a season 300m for Icardi ... let's move on from Hugo he's to old 250m for Oblak ... let's move on from Tanganga we don't have the time to develop talent 200m for VvD... we have to move on so who cares about the money

Your logic is just bonkers, pushing for 20m or 'moving on' and getting nothing, are you serious? Do that enough times and you end up where Woolwich now are
 
So let's move on from Kane because he misses 10 games a season 300m for Icardi ... let's move on from Hugo he's to old 250m for Oblak ... let's move on from Tanganga we don't have the time to develop talent 200m for VvD... we have to move on so who cares about the money

Huh?

What I am saying is just take the money and move on from Eriksen.

5 million euro is not worth the risk of him still being here in April. It's time for this to end.
 
The value of just moving the fuck on and spending time on something else vastly exceeds the sums at stake here.

He'll probably "win" this negotiation (though don't rule out the possibility of a desultory Eriksen being stuck submarining squad morality the rest of the season), but the point is, and honestly I think Levy's backers and his critics agree on this, the man truly just cannot help himself. He HAS to grind these deals into dust personally trying to better and humiliate his counterparty.

He's incredibly good at it. I just don't see how it's any way to run a football club of this size.

He's the money man, that's his job isn't it surely? To grind out the best deal for the club? Since ENIC have taken over there's been well over 100 players come through the door, maybe around 115 or so when all tallied up so I can only guess the players out are similar. 200-250 transfers combined. Haggle £1m-£2m off an incoming, beef up a sale by £1m-£2m and you go from a team breaking even to a team with anything from £200m-£500m in the coffers which we do. Yes it can be tedious but you know what's worse than a tedious chairman? A reckless one and he's taken us to greater levels off the pitch due to his efficiency and how he's handled the club.

Yes he's had his wobbles, dropped a few changers but off the pitch, which really is his main duty as a non-coach based member of the club is run in a way that gives us muscle whenever we need to invest on the pitch. His job is to focus purely on the best interests of Tottenham Hotspur and when looking at the decisions he's made with the stadium, our commercial partnerships, the financial results, the manager shift this year and the fact that he's got £200m's worth of talent through the door to bolster the squad (Perm and/ or loan, ultimately they are still here right now) I don't see the hate for him. If offered Levy or any other chairman that isn't an oligarch or sultan and I'd still take Levy all day long. Each to their own and all of that but the complexities of running a football are clearly harder than what we normal folk probably believe it to be. No issues with him haggling with me ultimately it's his job to.
 
He's the money man, that's his job isn't it surely? To grind out the best deal for the club?

His job is to focus purely on the best interests of Tottenham Hotspur

These overlap considerably, but they are not the same.

5m Euros pays for 18 months worth of Gedson Fernandes loan. If it means nothing why didn't Benfica just give him to us for free for that duration?

5m is not nothing. Eriksen's continued presence at the club as a sort of ghost of Spurs past while the club tries to move toward the Mourinho-fueled rebound on which the medium-term financial future depends is not nothing either.
 
These overlap considerably, but they are not the same.



5m is not nothing. Eriksen's continued presence at the club as a sort of ghost of Spurs past while the club tries to move toward the Mourinho-fueled rebound on which the medium-term financial future depends is not nothing either.

Of 5m is nothing then why aren't Benfica just wiping their mouths of it and giving us Gedson for 18 months for zilch then? Look after the pennies and the pounds look after themselves. Yes Levy is a bit over the top with that but when you look at the 115+ players he's signed since ENIC took over, as mentioned previously negotiating £1m-£2m less or more on each of those deals makes us £230m richer than we would have been. Got to give him credit for that at a time where teams are huffing and puffing their way from owner loans to stay competitive.
 
Of 5m is nothing then why aren't Benfica just wiping their mouths of it and giving us Gedson for 18 months for zilch then? Look after the pennies and the pounds look after themselves. Yes Levy is a bit over the top with that but when you look at the 115+ players he's signed since ENIC took over, as mentioned previously negotiating £1m-£2m less or more on each of those deals makes us £230m richer than we would have been. Got to give him credit for that at a time where teams are huffing and puffing their way from owner loans to stay competitive.

It's beside my point, but I have to say, there's something really irritating about the idea that Spurs would just collapse without Levy, that he's the difference between us and being Aston Villa or something.

ENIC bought a club (in a growing, wealthy, thriving city, a critical factor to remember vis a vis Villa or Everton or whoever) with a huge and passionate support who eagerly snap up enormously expensive tickets rain or shine and who make Spurs a go-to TV presence for broadcasters as well.

THAT'S Tottenham Hotspur. Levy is just a steward, capable and accomplished though he may be.
 
It's beside my point, but I have to say, there's something really irritating about the idea that Spurs would just collapse without Levy, that he's the difference between us and being Aston Villa or something.

ENIC bought a club (in a growing, wealthy, thriving city, a critical factor to remember vis a vis Villa or Everton or whoever) with a huge and passionate support who eagerly snap up enormously expensive tickets rain or shine and who make Spurs a go-to TV presence for broadcasters as well.

THAT'S Tottenham Hotspur. Levy is just a steward, capable and accomplished though he may be.

Who has ever given the impression that Tottenham Hotspur would just collapse without Levy? I certainly haven't and apologies if others have flat out said such a thing but I can't recall reading it often on here or hearing about it down the pub etc.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top