Kieran Trippier

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Well I would argue the fact that Walker was our undisputed first choice ahead of Trippier before he asked to leave, was in the PFA team of the year two years in a row, is the second most expensive defender of all time and just recently won the Premier League whilst once again making the team of the year is quite substantial evidence myself....

And in the 18 months of Trippier playing first team football, he has surpassed Walker in most apsects of the game other than being really fast

I would argue Walkers pace and athleticism is very much a talent!

Its nothing you have to learn or practice though.....those areas he is weaker in

I assume you have seen Trippier trying to defend against wide players like Martial, Sane etc? If you genuinely think Walker would have struggled in the same way he did then I give up...

Ive also seen him against Ronaldo and Marcello, and Salah and Mane and Hazard and Willian....he did just fine....just like he did when we beat Utd 2-0 last season and they didnt get a look in.
Have you seen Walker against Salah and Mane by the way?
 
Not really. If England had superior centre back options then Walker wouldn't be playing there, and would start in his best position

It makes no sense. Why not play Rose there, or Dier then? Why just Walker?

I know, because Walker is fast, so can cover the role, and he wants Trippier at wing back.
 

Guido 🇺🇦

"Legacy Fan"
Are people really arguing that Walker is better on the basis he´s been effectively dropped from his role to incorperate Trippier...?
It would suggest that Walker is more versatile than Tripps, otherwise Tripps would be playing CB.

Lot's of ways to cut it. (My absolute best position was RB but I hardly ever played there, I was put out at LB. This fucked me off because I wasn't as good in that position. But I was played there because I was better than the other options for LB and the lad that played RB (my position) was shit at LB).
 
It would suggest that Walker is more versatile than Tripps, otherwise Tripps would be playing CB.

Lot's of ways to cut it. (My absolute best position was RB but I hardly ever played there, I was put out at LB. This fucked me off because I wasn't as good in that position. But I was played there because I was better than the other options for LB and the lad that played RB (my position) was shit at LB).

Walker is more versatile than Eriksen then, but it doesn’t really say much.
It’s not like he excelled at CB either.

Trippier can’t play CB and I’ve never claimed he should or could. Simply saying the better player has kept his place otherwise Southgate would be weakening us in two positions not just one
 

Guido 🇺🇦

"Legacy Fan"
Walker is more versatile than Eriksen then, but it doesn’t really say much.
It’s not like he excelled at CB either.

Trippier can’t play CB and I’ve never claimed he should or could. Simply saying the better player has kept his place otherwise Southgate would be weakening us in two positions not just one
Eriksen plays in multiple positions though. He drops deep in a Pirlo type position, plays as a 10 and as an 8 and plays across all three positions behind the striker in a 4-2-3-1, now that's a truly, truly versatile player (brought up in the Ajax academy under that very philosophy, where every player has to play other positions as part of their eduction). I didn't say he excelled at CB, although I didn't see him play poorly there too (I'm taking the line that that shouldn't have been a pen).

I'm suggesting that the better footballer is the one that is more versatile, has the ability to play in more than one position than the player that can't. He's the one trusted to do that too. Nothing ultimately wrong in a player that is nailed to one position per sey. Just claiming that the bloke that's being asked to play out of position is likely to be the better footballer, not in every case but in this particular case I'm taking that stance.
 
Eriksen plays in multiple positions though. He drops deep in a Pirlo type position, plays as a 10 and as an 8 and plays across all three positions behind the striker in a 4-2-3-1, now that's a truly, truly versatile player (brought up in the Ajax academy under that very philosophy, where every player has to play other positions as part of their eduction). I didn't say he excelled at CB, although I didn't see him play poorly there too (I'm taking the line that that shouldn't have been a pen).

I'm suggesting that the better footballer is the one that is more versatile, has the ability to play in more than one position than the player that can't. He's the one trusted to do that too. Nothing ultimately wrong in a player that is nailed to one position per sey. Just claiming that the bloke that's being asked to play out of position is likely to be the better footballer, not in every case but in this particular case I'm taking that stance.

Yes but Eriksen roles are all at AM, he doesn’t change position.
Being versatile doesn’t get Sissoko many plaudits, and I dont think being a utility players says a great deal.

For me it’s usually players that are ok in a few positions but don’t excel in any.
And aren’t massively missed when moved around.
I think it’s far more complimentary for Trippier to be ahead of Walker at RWB than it is for Walker to be put at CB because he pass 90 minutes there and is faster than Cahill.

If we play three actual CBs next match I truely hope Trippier gets the nod.
If not I think we will see a distinct lack of creativity down the right.

But for you that’s just aimlessly punting the ball into the box anyway, so for Trippier its lose lose
 
Yes. and thats exactly what our manager did last season? :pochfacepalm:
Conveniently leaving out this was after Walker had told our manager in the middle of the title run in that he wanted to leave!! Walker was undisputed first choice until then and you and many others who are now towing the "he's nothing without pace" line would have been calling Poch out if Trippier was picked ahead of him.
 

Guido 🇺🇦

"Legacy Fan"
Yes but Eriksen roles are all at AM, he doesn’t change position.
Being versatile doesn’t get Sissoko many plaudits, and I dont think being a utility players says a great deal.

For me it’s usually players that are ok in a few positions but don’t excel in any.
And aren’t massively missed when moved around.
I think it’s far more complimentary for Trippier to be ahead of Walker at RWB than it is for Walker to be put at CB because he pass 90 minutes there and is faster than Cahill.

If we play three actual CBs next match I truely hope Trippier gets the nod.
If not I think we will see a distinct lack of creativity down the right.

But for you that’s just aimlessly punting the ball into the box anyway, so for Trippier its lose lose
Sissoko has got many plaudits from me though, all my comments are there in his thread (never a MOM performance from him though, but did the job he was asked to do, in the position the manager told him to play).

You might be right about a jack of all trades master of none, but not in this particular case. Walker is the best RB in the League and one of the best in Europe and I'm struggling to pick many ahead of him in the World. This is his best position, not CB. No one is saying he's a great CB, mainly because it's not his position having only played their 3 times or whatever it has been. Walker has openly said his position is RB (or wingback).

So I do not see it at all that Tripps is picked ahead of Walker. I see it that the manger wants to play with 3 CB's and the three that played last night are judged the best available to him based on their ability to play with the ball at their feet. 100% this is the reason why Smalling isn't in the squad as the manger has public stated exactly this as the reason. So given this admission from the manager, it's entirely reasonable to suggested the reason why Walker was picked ahead of Cahill for the same reasons. IMO it has absolutely nothing to do with how the manager views Walker vs Tripps but all about the ability of the three CB's being comfortable on the ball, able to bring it out of defence.

2nd guessing what Southgate is doing of course and can only let this play-out with further with more games and maybe a more conclusive pattern will emerge but for me the key is three at the back, not who plays RB. If we go 4 at the back my guess is he goes with Walker as RB and not Tripps.
 
Sissoko has got many plaudits from me though, all my comments are there in his thread (never a MOM performance from him though, but did the job he was asked to do, in the position the manager told him to play).

You might be right about a jack of all trades master of none, but not in this particular case. Walker is the best RB in the League and one of the best in Europe and I'm struggling to pick many ahead of him in the World. This is his best position, not CB. No one is saying he's a great CB, mainly because it's not his position having only played their 3 times or whatever it has been. Walker has openly said his position is RB (or wingback).

So I do not see it at all that Tripps is picked ahead of Walker. I see it that the manger wants to play with 3 CB's and the three that played last night are judged the best available to him based on their ability to play with the ball at their feet. 100% this is the reason why Smalling isn't in the squad as the manger has public stated exactly this as the reason. So given this admission from the manager, it's entirely reasonable to suggested the reason why Walker was picked ahead of Cahill for the same reasons. IMO it has absolutely nothing to do with how the manager views Walker vs Tripps but all about the ability of the three CB's being comfortable on the ball, able to bring it out of defence.

2nd guessing what Southgate is doing of course and can only let this play-out with further with more games and maybe a more conclusive pattern will emerge but for me the key is three at the back, not who plays RB. If we go 4 at the back my guess is he goes with Walker as RB and not Tripps.

Fair enough, we probably won’t see 100% eye to eye and nor do we need to....I know you’re the type of fan who would rather be wrong and if Trippier becomes a top player in your eyes you’ll be happy to say so.

A back 4 does change the issue somwhat, that I can admit
 
Conveniently leaving out this was after Walker had told our manager in the middle of the title run in that he wanted to leave!! Walker was undisputed first choice until then and you and many others who are now towing the "he's nothing without pace" line would have been calling Poch out if Trippier was picked ahead of him.
But you’re conveniently leaving out that Trippier isn’t the same player he was back then.
No one was calling for him to start ahead of Walker, least of all me.
Doesn’t mean he isn’t better today though.
 

Guido 🇺🇦

"Legacy Fan"
Fair enough, we probably won’t see 100% eye to eye and not do we need to....I know you’re the type of fan who would rather be wrong and if Trippier becomes a top player in your eyes you’ll be happy to say so.

A back 4 does change the issue somwhat, that I can admit
There is also the possibility that Dire's inclusion at DM could be determined because it gives us the ability to switch between 3ATB and 4ATB rather than just "he's better than" or "worse than Henderson". The oppo will have noticed that we can be slowed when they match us up with their formation (also going 3/5 at the back) and maybe Southgate hasn't thought about us changing to a back four when they do this because the oppo we are playing against should see us with the quality to beat them, like against Nigeria and last night. But lets' say if we go 3ATB against Belgium and they do also? Maybe having Dier as an option to drop in as CB without the need to use up a sub is going to be just as important as it is for us. But I'm currently convinced how we set-up at the back is the number one factor to the style in which Southgate wants us to play and is more important than player 'x' over player 'y'.
 

ILSpur

ESL founding member
...IMO it has absolutely nothing to do with how the manager views Walker vs Tripps but all about the ability of the three CB's being comfortable on the ball, able to bring it out of defence.

2nd guessing what Southgate is doing of course and can only let this play-out with further with more games and maybe a more conclusive pattern will emerge but for me the key is three at the back, not who plays RB. If we go 4 at the back my guess is he goes with Walker as RB and not Tripps.

Agreed, and I think that it will be much more interesting to see how he lines up the squad when it's not Tunisia but Belgium. Will he trust the back 3 that much to risk it against a much more potent offensive unit.

Maybe the Walker/Trippier issue is really more about tactics than a demonstration as to who is "better". Against one team and style of play, Trippier is first choice. Against an other, it'd be Walker.
 

Guido 🇺🇦

"Legacy Fan"
Agreed, and I think that it will be much more interesting to see how he lines up the squad when it's not Tunisia but Belgium. Will he trust the back 3 that much to risk it against a much more potent offensive unit.

Maybe the Walker/Trippier issue is really more about tactics than a demonstration as to who is "better". Against one team and style of play, Trippier is first choice. Against an other, it'd be Walker.
Notice Belgium are also playing three at the back at the moment too.
 
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