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Spurs v Huddersfield (a) 18/19 ratings

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MOTM


  • Total voters
    33
Funk

It's official. Things are just not right. Our coach is making counter intuitive selections, our tactics are confused, our play without the ball is lethargic, with it erratic. We are in a funk.

This feels very much like that first few months of Poch's tenure when he was struggling to get a disparate bunch of players to buy in to a collective philosophy. Which makes this current funk harder to understand as this is a group that's had 4 years of that philosophy now. There's no Adebayor's with bad juju, no Soldado refusing to hit a barn door with his banjo, no wonky signings made at another's behest, this is a group that has been hugged into shape by Poch and Poch alone.

Yes we have a team that's had minimal rest this summer, that may well be physically and mentally fatigued, but a good coach, a brave coach, would not have kept picking some of those players relentlessly. Elsewhere other coaches have been prepared to make the brave sacrifice and leave a star player on a bench once or twice, take them out of games more often, found creative solutions.

We had a trio of busy little fuckers play through pre-season, but Poch has singularly refused to trust any one of them. Wanyama and Winks have been available lately but we've still seen the Dier and Dembele axis of amble start game after game in the league and CL.

As a result our midfield play has become as bad as it's been since Sherwood pretended he could be a manager. With the exception of the Watford game, our performances this season are littered with sloppy, open, chaos, devoid of control with or without the ball. We are winning games because ultimately we invariably have either better attacking players, better defending players or, like today, both, not because we are looking like a better coached or tactically smarter team.

When Poch was on top of things, we invariably had those better individual components, but were also clearly looking better coached and better tactically than most.

I wanted Wanyama and Winks to come on at half time today, but I wanted it to be for tactical reasons, and to change the tactical structure, it would appear that the fact that they did was forced by injuries, and this is one of Poch's weaknesses, I don't think if Dembele's hadn't been fucked he'd have taken off Dier, who should have been. If it was tactical then it should have been Dier and Alderweireld that went off, and we should have gone to a 433, and tried to completely starve them of the ball second half like we used to do in these situations. We shouldn't have needed 3 CB's in a game like this. And it's not like it was enabling our FB's to maraud either. Both fb's saw less ball (almost half) than they would normally see.

So I'd like to be able to give some credit to Poch for bringing the right two players into the game, but even if it turns out Dembele and Vertonghen were't injured, then he took off the wrong two, and still didn't really change anything tactically.

For the first 20 minutes of the second half we were marginally improved with the ball, and probably managed to prevent them from getting the early break they needed to encourage a full late onslaught, but the inevitable last 25 minutes of shelling our two goal lead did for that. But at least we can say that despite coming into the game cold, as a completely new CM2 pairing, the fact that we didn't look any worse with Wanyama and Winks suggests they should now be given a run of games, because now we know that not only is the Dier/Dembele axis of amble not the medium or long term solution, it's not the short term either.

Personally I think Winks would be better as an orthodox 8, in a midfield three, (with Wanyama and either Dembele, Eriksen, Amos as the other 8) not as the double pivot in a CM2, but for some reason Poch has 433 aversion, seemingly happy to play everything but, so I on't hold my breath, but either way, these two need to be given some trust, we can't play worse than we have been this season with Dier and Dembele. We are bypassing our midfield and resorting to long ball football.

We were of course missing our most important and influential player, Eriksen and normally I'd point out that this is what life looks like without Eriksen, and that definitely contributed today, as we were even worse than some other games this season, but lets be honest, even with Eriksen, we've been well below par this season so far.

We completed one more pass than Huddersfield first half, thirty less second half. We were out possessed both halves. By Huddersfield. This just isn't normal for a Poch Spurs side.

Personnel changes won't solve everything. We are lacking energy with and without the ball. We lack cohesion with and without the ball. Some press, others don't. We've played 442, 4231, 532, 543. This is all about the coach/coaching. And has always been one of Poch's strengths. He needs to get to grips with it. Needs to be brave. Get back to his root philosophy. Reboot. If older, star players won't do it, or aren't doing it right now, then get the kids in and get them pumping gas. If nothing else it'll give some senior players some much needed rest and even more needed kick up the arse. The midfield needs defibrillating, we need to get back to a collective ethos that everyone understands. Defending as a team, attacking as a team, being proactive, not a dysfunctional group reacting to chaos, making last ditch tackles and living on forward scraps.

This was another game where very few come out with heaps of credit. Often under Poch in the last two or three seasons it's hard to pick one out for MOTM because there's been so many on it.

The upside is we are this bad and picking up wins. But we all know that in the medium and long term these types of performances catch up with you.

Individual

Gazzaniga - Good game.

Trippier/Rose - Neither were great, far less involved than usual, but part of that is the collective quagmire. Trippier still managed to create a goal, and complete more key passes than everyone else put together, and Rose did win a penalty, but that was pretty much where the good news ended for these two.

Alderweireld - IF Vertonghen hadn't been injured I'd have yanked him off at half time and switched to a back 4. He wasn't terrible, wasn't great either and Sanchez is quicker and allows us to play higher.

Sanchez - Probably MOTM today, and that pretty much sums up our collective performance, because even he was just "good".

Vertonghen - OK while on.

Dier - Really bad, and to be honest, and didn't do much better when shuffled back. Needs a rest. At the very least should not be anywhere near a midfield ever again.

Dembele - Marginally better than Dier, but also pretty insipid first half, the game just whizzed around him for the most part, maybe it was disorientation that saw him off at half time.

Son/Moura - Bumbled about like a pair of stewed prunes caught in the vortex of a moulinex hairdryer.

Kane - Great header for the first and stuck his penalty away well. Looking more comfortable back in that No.9 fulcrum role.

Wanyama - OK. Needs a run back in the side now. Can't watch Dier fucking about any more.

Winks - One lovely little moment where he dropped a shoulder, twisted one way then the other and spun away from two markers then set an attack in motion. Last two games we're seeing glimpses of a what could be a decent 8, needs to be played in a CM3 though IMO, to get the best as I still think he flounders a bit when given too much defensive responsibility.
 
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Probably give MOTM to Gazzaniga.

Promising signs were Kanes overall performance improving by the game, Sanchez looking less of a liability and Winks in the second half looking more like Winks of old.
 
Fuck off BC. Nobody gives a shit about discussing the performances of players of a club we all care about, and your long-winded egotistical ramblings.

Sorry. Just filling in for Mick Cooper Mick Cooper in his absence. Am I doing it right?
 
Pretty negative review after an away win. There are no easy games in the prem, and I don't think that's a cliche, more a fact. Huddersfield didn't look likely to get back into it after we scored, and we managed the game well.

I wonder if you were this pessimistic last season? You do know we're better off points-wise than we were then?

Can't not make Kane MOTM after 2 goals.
 
Fuck off BC. Nobody gives a shit about discussing the performances of players of a club we all care about, and your long-winded egotistical ramblings.

Sorry. Just filling in for Mick Cooper Mick Cooper in his absence. Am I doing it right?

Can you do it again but with a soupçon more lovechild of Basil Fawlty and Ray Winston having a tampon enema.....ness
 
Funk

It's official. Things are just not right. Our coach is making counter intuitive selections, our tactics are confused, our play without the ball is lethargic, with it erratic. We are in a funk.

This feels very much like that first few months of Poch's tenure when he was struggling to get a disparate bunch of players to buy in to a collective philosophy. Which makes this current funk harder to understand as this is a group that's had 4 years of that philosophy now. There's no Adebayor's with bad juju, no Soldado refusing to hit a barn door with his banjo, no wonky signings made at another's behest, this is a group that has been hugged into shape by Poch and Poch alone.

Yes we have a team that's had minimal rest this summer, that may well be physically and mentally fatigued, but a good coach, a brave coach, would not have kept picking some of those players relentlessly. Elsewhere other coaches have been prepared to make the brave sacrifice and leave a star player on a bench once or twice, take them out of games more often, found creative solutions.

We had a trio of busy little fuckers play through pre-season, but Poch has singularly refused to trust any one of them. Wanyama and Winks have been available lately but we've still seen the Dier and Dembele axis of amble start game after game in the league and CL.

As a result our midfield play has become as bad as it's been since Sherwood pretended he could be a manager. With the exception of the Watford game, our performances this season are littered with sloppy, open, chaos, devoid of control with or without the ball. We are winning games because ultimately we invariably have either better attacking players, better defending players or, like today, both, not because we are looking like a better coached or tactically smarter team.

When Poch was on top of things, we invariably had those better individual components, but were also clearly looking better coached and better tactically than most.

I wanted Wanyama and Winks to come on at half time today, but I wanted it to be for tactical reasons, and to change the tactical structure, it would appear that the fact that they did was forced by injuries, and this is one of Poch's weaknesses, I don't think if Dembele's hadn't been fucked he'd have taken off Dier, who should have been. If it was tactical then it should have been Dier and Alderweireld that went off, and we should have gone to a 433, and tried to completely starve them of the ball second half like we used to do in these situations. We shouldn't have needed 3 CB's in a game like this. And it's not like it was enabling our FB's to maraud either. Both fb's saw less ball (almost half) than they would normally see.

So I'd like to be able to give some credit to Poch for bringing the right two players into the game, but even if it turns out Dembele and Vertonghen were't injured, then he took off the wrong two, and still didn't really change anything tactically.

For the first 20 minutes of the second half we were marginally improved with the ball, and probably managed to prevent them from getting the early break they needed to encourage a full late onslaught, but the inevitable last 25 minutes of shelling our two goal lead did for that. But at least we can say that despite coming into the game cold, as a completely new CM2 pairing, the fact that we didn't look any worse with Wanyama and Winks suggests they should now be given a run of games, because now we know that not only is the Dier/Dembele axis of amble not the medium or long term solution, it's not the short term either.

Personally I think Winks would be better as an orthodox 8, in a midfield three, (with Wanyama and either Dembele, Eriksen, Amos as the other 8) not as the double pivot in a CM2, but for some reason Poch has 433 aversion, seemingly happy to play everything but, so I on't hold my breath, but either way, these two need to be given some trust, we can't play worse than we have been this season with Dier and Dembele. We are bypassing our midfield and resorting to long ball football.

We were of course missing our most important and influential player, Eriksen and normally I'd point out that this is what life looks like without Eriksen, and that definitely contributed today, as we were even worse than some other games this season, but lets be honest, even with Eriksen, we've been well below par this season so far.

We completed one more pass than Huddersfield first half, thirty less second half. We were out possessed both halves. By Huddersfield. This just isn't normal for a Poch Spurs side.

Personnel changes won't solve everything. We are lacking energy with and without the ball. We lack cohesion with and without the ball. Some press, others don't. We've played 442, 4231, 532, 543. This is all about the coach/coaching. And has always been one of Poch's strengths. He needs to get to grips with it. Needs to be brave. Get back to his root philosophy. Reboot. If older, star players won't do it, or aren't doing it right now, then get the kids in and get them pumping gas. If nothing else it'll give some senior players some much needed rest and even more needed kick up the arse. The midfield needs defibrillating, we need to get back to a collective ethos that everyone understands. Defending as a team, attacking as a team, being proactive, not a dysfunctional group reacting to chaos, making last ditch tackles and living on forward scraps.

This was another game where very few come out with heaps of credit. Often under Poch in the last two or three seasons it's hard to pick one out for MOTM because there's been so many on it.

The upside is we are this bad and picking up wins. But we all know that in the medium and long term these types of performances catch up with you.

Individual

Gazzaniga - Good game.

Trippier/Rose - Neither were great, far less involved than usual, but part of that is the collective quagmire. Trippier still managed to create a goal, and complete more key passes than everyone else put together, and Rose did win a penalty, but that was pretty much where the good news ended for these two.

Alderweireld - IF Vertonghen hadn't been injured I'd have yanked him off at half time and switched to a back 4. He wasn't terrible, wasn't great either and Sanchez is quicker and allows us to play higher.

Sanchez - Probably MOTM today, and that pretty much sums up our collective performance, because even he was just "good".

Vertonghen - OK while on.

Dier - Really bad, and to be honest, and didn't do much better when shuffled back. Needs a rest. At the very least should not be anywhere near a midfield ever again.

Dembele - Marginally better than Dier, but also pretty insipid first half, the game just whizzed around him for the most part, maybe it was disorientation that saw him off at half time.

Son/Moura - Bumbled about like a pair of stewed prunes caught in the vortex of a moulinex hairdryer.

Kane - Great header for the first and stuck his penalty away well. Looking more comfortable back in that No.9 fulcrum role.

Wanyama - OK. Needs a run back in the side now. Can't watch Dier fucking about any more.

Winks - One lovely little moment where he dropped a shoulder, twisted one way then the other and spun away from two markers then set an attack in motion. Last two games we're seeing glimpses of a what could be a decent 8, needs to be played in a CM3 though IMO, to get the best as I still think he flounders a bit when given too much defensive responsibility.

I do wonder if this season Poch has a problem.

He's often not a big fan of rotation (other than of full backs) tending to run players into the ground. And he likes his players very fit so they often run further than any others on the pitch, pressing is also what a Poch team does which is sapping on the energy levels.

Problem is we had the most players on the latter stages of WC with Kane, Dele, Rose, Dier, Trippier, Dembele, Vertonghen, Alderweireld and Lloris - and while Eriksen's Denmark didn't get out of the group Eriksen put in his usual shift running more than most.

So 10 of our best players start the season fatigued and really need a rest (thanks PL for bringing the start of the season forward and FIFA to enlarging the WC to make extra games), which Poch is neither used to doing nor with the numbers can he easily rotate . Add to that Winks and Wanyama just coming back from long term injury so that makes 12 players he needs to be careful with. And he hasn't used players like Walker-Peters on any of the youngsters who played in US to help relieve the pressure.

So I think he's decided to forgo some of his style of football requiring supreme fitness in order to stick with a very limited rotation policy - and that's affected our football,

It maybe that despite this, the lack of rest is catching up with some of the players which is why Lloris, Eriksen, Vertonghen and Dembele are picking up things like hamstring injuries and other basically strained muscle type injuries. If so, its going to be another month or so before the players are back to normal

ATM I'm just glad we are picking up points, but I'd certainly like to see more rotation to help manage the fatigue issue, but the change of players each game of course will not help us play the fluid football we want.

Just hope I'm being overly pessemistic
 
Central midfield this season has offered so little and on performance level looks very weak.
Whoever plays has very little influence and compared to the 3 teams above looks miles away in quality. I'm not sure what are the solutions but as normal we will muddle through as usual.
Full / Wing backs once our strongest asset are a shadow of what they were 2 years ago.
Plus side , a scrappy win , Kane improving, central defence, Gazza a respectable back up and not a liability as Vorm. Strong in players behind Kane , Son so wasteful, Moura coming through as a major asset and Lamela who didnt play being our most influential player so far but hopefully not another false dawn.
Overall 6/10.
 
He had so many opportunities to wrap that game up, just kept on making the wrong choice.

I would have hooked him for Lamela mid-second half.

I can only think he was conscious about making all three subs again with so many players carrying niggles. The last quater of an hour was crying out for Lamela to come on and wrestle control of the game again.
 
OP played some FIFA last night with Spurs and won the league so he feels he’s right when he’s criticizing Pochettino and the way we played. Are you aware that we missed three key players and that there are some players getting minutes after long term injuries? Wait until we get everyone back and chain a few games together before acting like you’d be better in the job.
 
I can only think he was conscious about making all three subs again with so many players carrying niggles. The last quater of an hour was crying out for Lamela to come on and wrestle control of the game again.


I think if there were any danger of Huddersfield scoring two goals then he would have done.........sadly for them the game was dead after Kane's second
 
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