Spurs v Liverpool, 15th September, 12:30

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sammyspurs said:
Kane, Eriksen and Dier for me

Apparently and CM would make Kane run though
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We agree on Dier.
The problem is in the middle, Dembele is excellent player but slow nowadays and Winks is not world class but decent squad player.
We needed one signing to address this and will pay for it against top teams.
This is effecting Eriksen and the forwards because they have to come back and help.
 
We deserved nothing other than a 5-0 thrashing the worst Spurs display Ive seen in a long long time. And dare I mention Harry Kane? He might as well not have been on the pitch today truly awful as was Eriksen. Many more performances like today and we are in big trouble.
 
hrytn said:
We agree on Dier.
The problem is in the middle, Dembele is excellent player but slow nowadays and Winks is not world class but decent squad player.
We needed one signing to address this and will pay for it against top teams.
This is effecting Eriksen and the forwards because they have to come back and help.
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Kane has been deployed deeper by Poch, not because Dier was poor.
Moura was excellent, even though Dier was crap.......Lamela created, Son created....

Eriksen was poor because he was poor. Not because Dier was poor.
 
My immediate reaction is to blame Poch for this. It's like he just doesn't learn that playing such an open game against this kind of opposition is fucking suicidal. It was laughable how much space they had behind us from start to end, clear for everyone to see except the manager. We could have got absolutely hammered, the fact that this game ended 1-2 is miraculous. We are not good enough man for man to play the kind of system that Poch is dreaming (especially on current form and fatigue levels), and he is seemingly unwilling or unable to come up with a more pragmatic plan of halting clearly superior opposition on any reliable basis. We are so slow and predictable, and they were so quick and elusive, the gap was unbelievable. The term 'played into their hands' is a huge understatement.
Kane looks dead right now. I can't remember the last time Eriksen was this poor, if ever. Dembele is finished, we must must must stop thinking that he can be relied upon to stand alone and exposed in the center and receive the ball with a pack of hungry wolves charging him down from all sides. Dier is not a top quality CM, never has been and maybe never will be, or at best he needs someone far more dynamic and energetic alongside him to make up for his shortcomings; and his supposed flexibility to drop in and out of defence, is not really helping anything, but rather creating confusion for the players. Rose was sloppy, likely lacking confidence and sharpness. Trippier is consistently bullied or nullified in the biggest games. Lamela is perfect for this kind of game with his intensity and quick passing, should have started. Lucas was probably the only player who did ok today.
I was dreading this game so much and it went pretty much as I expected, which is in itself telling. We had nothing up our sleeve today. We walked out for our execution without any sort of plan, just hope and prayer. Like I said after the last defeat, I feel that this will be a long old season for us, and we would do very well to keep a top 4 place.
 
sammyspurs said:
Kane has been deployed deeper by Poch, not because Dier was poor.
Moura was excellent, even though Dier was crap.......Lamela created, Son created....

Eriksen was poor because he was poor. Not because Dier was poor.
Click to expand...
Lamela should have started, he is been in good form plus he didn't play internationals.
 
Hazza said:
My immediate reaction is to blame Poch for this. It's like he just doesn't learn that playing such an open game against this kind of opposition is fucking suicidal. It was laughable how much space they had behind us from start to end, clear for everyone to see except the manager. We could have got absolutely hammered, the fact that this game ended 1-2 is miraculous. We are not good enough man for man to play the kind of system that Poch is dreaming (especially on current form and fatigue levels), and he is seemingly unwilling or unable to come up with a more pragmatic plan of halting clearly superior opposition on any reliable basis. We are so slow and predictable, and they were so quick and elusive, the gap was unbelievable. The term 'played into their hands' is a huge understatement.
Kane looks dead right now. I can't remember the last time Eriksen was this poor, if ever. Dembele is finished, we must must must stop thinking that he can be relied upon to stand alone and exposed in the center and receive the ball with a pack of hungry wolves charging him down from all sides. Dier is not a top quality CM, never has been and maybe never will be, or at best he needs someone far more dynamic and energetic alongside him to make up for his shortcomings; and his supposed flexibility to drop in and out of defence, is not really helping anything, but rather creating confusion for the players. Rose was sloppy, likely lacking confidence and sharpness. Trippier is consistently bullied or nullified in the biggest games. Lamela is perfect for this kind of game with his intensity and quick passing, should have started. Lucas was probably the only player who did ok today.
I was dreading this game so much and it went pretty much as I expected, which is in itself telling. We had nothing up our sleeve today. We walked out for our execution without any sort of plan, just hope and prayer. Like I said after the last defeat, I feel that this will be a long old season for us, and we would do very well to keep a top 4
place.
Click to expand...

Poch wasn't to blame for that. He picked a team capable of winning, it wasn't his fault the players he put in each position was so bad. It wasn't his fault that no one could pass to the right players, it wasn't his fault they strolled around the pitch, it wasn't his fault that so many put in very little effort.
This one is on the players.
 
hrytn said:
Lamela should have started, he is been in good form plus he didn't play internationals.
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Now is the real test of what Poch is made of. The next game is where we judge, todays line up was ok........its not valid to say we dont have options. I posted some old quotes in the Kane thread where it was pointed out we scored 18 goals in ten games in a period Kane scored 1.

And now we have Moura. If Kane starts the next PL game, a pretty big chunk of my mostly unwavwering faith in Poch knowing best will be really tested to the limit.
 
TomHotspur said:
I think a big point that hasn't been highlighted enough is simply that Liverpool, City and to a lesser extent perhaps, Chelsea, have all upgraded their midfield over the last two years to a level that is now way above ours. As a result we're always going to struggle to win the midfield battle against these teams and thus are going to seriously struggle to control a game, which is absolutely essential to how Poch sets us up. Our midfield isn't bad, but it's just not at the level required to really challenge for a title. Mousa is a genius but has been on the way down for many years now and IMO really doesn't want to be here anymore. Dier to me looks like a player who has completely and utterly maxed out his abilities, he needs to be absolutely 100 percent at it/switched on or he looks like a Championship player, he's just not good enough to coast through games which he has been doing for some time now. Wanyama had great potential before his injury troubles but he's just no
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I thought our midfield was an omnishambles at times today. Every single midfielder we have is deeply flawed, and Eriksen and Alli do their best work in the final third. We haven't got the type of players who can give us the right blend in midfield.

The last time I remember Dier, Dembele and Winks playing in midfield was at home to West Ham two years ago, and it was an appalling combination. And it's still an appalling combination.

Our midfield has needed surgery for as long as Poch has been here-not just this summer or the summer before that, but Poch seems to favour brutes. We need some fucking brains. Someone who can take the ball in a tight spot, and do something progressive with it.
 
SouthStand Billy said:
Poch wasn't to blame for that. He picked a team capable of winning, it wasn't his fault the players he put in each position was so bad. It wasn't his fault that no one could pass to the right players, it wasn't his fault they strolled around the pitch, it wasn't his fault that so many put in very little effort.
This one is on the players.
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SouthStand Billy said:
I read the comments after our team was announced and many were saying it was the right team and right formation. Now we've lost so many of those players shouldn't have started and it's Poch's fault.
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For me Pochs responsibility comes with fixing the problem. Line up was fine, per se, but that needed drastically changing at half time
 
Eriksen and Kane need a wake up call.
That free kick at the edge of the box was perfect for a curl, and Moura/Tripp’s would have probably buried it. But Eriksen just took our best chance at that point with some clever mind game with the gk
 
sammyspurs said:
For me Pochs responsibility comes with fixing the problem. Line up was fine, per se, but that needed drastically changing at half time
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He slightly changed the formation and then bought the first sub on after 60 mins I believe??
I would have liked to have seen at least one change at half time but can't remember the last time Poch did that for tactical purposes.
 
SouthStand Billy said:
Poch wasn't to blame for that. He picked a team capable of winning, it wasn't his fault the players he put in each position was so bad. It wasn't his fault that no one could pass to the right players, it wasn't his fault they strolled around the pitch, it wasn't his fault that so many put in very little effort.
This one is on the players.
Click to expand...
The players are to blame as well, but that was such a comprehensive shit show that there is no way I'm accepting that it wasn't in huge part down to the system and tactics. A manager like Conte would have never taken the ridiculous risks that Poch took today. He needs to learn to play the hand he is dealt and mitigate the weaknesses in his team on a case by case basis instead of always going on faith and feeling. He is not tactically cold and calculated enough, sure I appreciate that he is trying to build something long term, but we clearly don't have the right tools for that and some of our players peaked a while ago, so some pragmatism is needed to keep the whole project from falling apart, given the situation we find ourselves in.
 
Hazza said:
The players are to blame as well, but that was such a comprehensive shit show that there is no way I'm accepting that it wasn't in huge part down to the system and tactics. A manager like Conte would have never taken the ridiculous risks that Poch took today. He needs to learn to play the hand he is dealt and mitigate the weaknesses in his team on a case by case basis instead of always going on faith and feeling. He is not tactically cold and calculated enough, sure I appreciate that he is trying to build something long term, but we clearly don't have the right tools for that and some of our players peaked a while ago, so some pragmatism is needed to keep the whole project from falling apart, given the situation we find ourselves in.
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40% players, 35% Pochettino, 25% Levy
 
On that performance, I worry about us against Barcelona to be honest.

Hopefully by then, our players are all a little bit fitter, key players are on form and Pochettino has found out what his preferred team is.
 
Totti said:
On that performance, I worry about us against Barcelona to be honest.

Hopefully by then, our players are all a little bit fitter, key players are on form and Pochettino has found out what his preferred team is.
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Before we cross that bridge, we have the Inter match to deal with.

At least a point there is essential really. They'll have watched this game and be rubbing their hands together. MP needs to earn his crust in the next few days
 
Bill Madrid said:
Before we cross that bridge, we have the Inter match to deal with.

At least a point there is essential really. They'll have watched this game and be rubbing their hands together. MP needs to earn his crust in the next few days
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Very true.

Inter Milan are absolute cabbage - but they'll be up for it and certainly have players who can cause us problems. I was thinking more of the pressing side. Barcelona don't do it as ferociously as they did in past years but they still press and with Suarez, Dembele, Coutinho and Messi, could really cause our defence nightmares if we play like we did today
 
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