Spurs v Palace (h) 19/20 ratings and ramblings

  • The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...

    Get involved!

Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports

MOTM


  • Total voters
    52
The Importance of Being Earnest

It will be hard to resist cliches like "we got our Spurs back" etc after the scorline today, and it was nice to bang in some goals, but in truth, our intentions and application weren't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, where we came out and and controlled and pushed forward in both games from the get go, both those previous home games showed signs of us getting back to some basic former values, both showed a return to good intentions and practices, even if there were still clearly omnipresent issues (and I don't think they have vanished completely either). But in all three home games now we've seen a return to more earnest endeavours.

Villa
All in all this was a decent performance, not a scintillating one, but a welcome return to some of the old values for me. I like to see us control games through midfield, which we did, and once Eriksen came on that control turned into a stranglehold which eventually wrung a thoroughly deserved win out of the mangle.

Newcastle
As the title suggests, the similarities with our opening game against Villa were stark. A couple of curious selections - or lack thereof, an obdurate, organised deep block bus-park, a goal down against the run of play to some fucking sloppy defending, with two of the Villa culprits involved again, lots of possession and control and huffing and puffing, only this time there was no happy ending.

We weren't terrible, we had shitloads of the ball, lots of really inept huffing, puffing and bumbling in forward areas, plenty of head down scurrying, but without the likes of Eriksen, Ndombele, Lo Celso there was no one capable of getting their heads out of their arses long enough to make it count.


The big and obvious difference today was early breaks. And one early goal isn't enough these days, because bus parkers no longer let one goal ruffle a game plan, one goal changes nothing as they still only need one good counter and they are back on levels, so at one down they will still sit in and wait till 15-20 to go before changinging their games plan and committing men forward.

So geting a second and then a third early goals were massive. And as I said, the real difference was just a bit of rub. We get the first goal from a long punt - it was a lovely long punt, but even the lovely ones rarely get finished like this one, against Newcastle we hit a couple and they were bumbled away, and Son can be the worst culprit for this at times, but today he was having one of his "good" days, he took it down beautifully, stayed composed and slotted away calmly. Then the second break we get was an own goal. The third was a beautiful team move involving Sissoko, Winks, Aurier and Son, but it was almost identical to the chance KWP created for Son against Newcastle, then it was bumbled away, today it gets whacked home with aplomb. This isn't all about luck, the football leading to all the goals was good, but our approach play against Newcastle was good at times, the difference is some days the final actions click and some days they don't. Three goals up in 23 minutes and now Palace's game plan is decimated, the fourth - the best of the bunch - killed their spirit completely too.

I'm not saying the score is misleading or misrepresenting the game, it's not, I'm just saying the way we set about that game today wasn't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, just when you get the early breaks like we did today it can seem like we started with more intent today, and I don't really think this is the case, we just did better things, made better decisions and executed things better when we got in their box during this early phase then we did in those previous two home games. I didn't think they were terrible performances and I'm not going to get carried away by this one. We scored 4 goals with our first 3 shots on target today, that won't happen often. To back up what I'm saying we actually had an X/G today of 1.05, against Newcastle it was 1.25, against Villa 2.57. Really good news on that front is in those three games we've only allowed XG's against of Villa 0.64, Newcastle 0.51 and Palace 0.58.

The third and fourth goals today were particularly pleasing as they came from good team moves, with the ball flowing through midfield via Sissoko/Winks, out to flanks and ended wit good final balls, especially Kane's superb pass for Lamela for the fourth.

One big difference today was this was the first home game Eriksen had started. He wasn't scintillating today but just having him out there from the get go adds a different, more intelligent dimension, more composure, better movement, which has a knock on effect on those around him.

As I alluded to earlier, Son is always lively, brings a direct threat that none of our other players really do, but can go long phases looking like his boots are spring loaded and makes poor choices, then he has games like today where he's absolutely bang on it, looks a different class and can light up a game. If only he could do this every week, or even 70% of the time.

I've got to give Sissoko a mention, there was still some clunky moments, that's just who he is, I still don't want him out there, but after a poor first few minutes he was good for the rest of the first half and actually passed the ball vertically a few times.

Tactically this was a slightly strange one. We seemed to start in the 4231, but that seemed to morph into a 4222 with the ball and a 442 without, certainly second half anyway.

I personally would have preferred Eriksen central and Son as the wide left AM. I just like him running at and cutting in from wider, inside channels and Eriksen in that more congested central zone, able to drift around, where his composure can be applied, but today it was moot.

These opening three home games have shown some green shoots of some kind of return to the former blue print, control, possession. In two of the games we've hit 7 goals. We aren't allowing - inferior quality, pragmatic - opponents to have chunks of the game and create lots of situations and chances. But both the Villa and Newcastle games still showed signs that our fragilities of the last 24 months hadn't been eradicated. But if we can keep being earnest about the way we go about things, doing the basics right, and our forwards and creatives can start delivering more composed final actions, it will bode well for the season.

Individual

Lloris - Fuck all to do.

Aurier - Good game. Please no more fucking CB's at RB Poch.

Alderweireld - Lovely ball for the first, a TA special, not overly tested but a couple of good bits of defensive tidying up at times.

Vertonghen - Decent game.

Rose - Very careless with the ball at times, didn't really contribute heaps going forward. Meh.

Sissoko - gave away another stupid free kick near our box early on, and against teams like this it's their biggest threat, and early on killed a couple of attacks with backwards passing, but for the rest of the first half was decent, playing some vertical passes. Second half faded offensively but was fine.

Winks - Good game, like Sissoko was the conduit for a goal or two.

Lamela - Great run and and finish for his goal, did some decent things and the odd clumsy thing. Decent overall.

Son - Eyes bright like a samelar hound first half for sure, exceedingly good game overall.

Eriksen - Quietly efficient game without being spectacular.

Kane - Decent game. I saw him actually pressing first half, which was nice, and his awareness and pass for Lamela's goal was the ball of the game for me.

Davies - I actually thought he looked more sure footed than Rose when he came on. Wouldn't mind seeing him get some starts in the next few games.

Ndombele - Nice little cameo, couple of moments where he dropped a shoulder, left his marker and then popped the ball forward. This is the difference between him and his almost namesake Dembele, Dembele had that shoulder drop, but would then too often drop the shoulder a couple more times before playing it square. But I do think Dembele was more robust without the ball, so I hope we find our way to a 433 if we want to get the best out of Ndombele.
 
Last edited:
The Importance of Being Earnest

It will be hard to resist cliches like "we got our Spurs back" etc after the scorline today, and it was nice to bang in some goals, but in truth, our intentions and application weren't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, where we came out and and controlled and pushed forward in both games from the get go, both those previous home games showed signs of us getting back to some basic former values, both showed a return to good intentions and practices, even if there were still clearly omnipresent issues (and I don't think they have vanished completely either). But in all three home games now we've seen a return to more earnest endeavours.

Villa


Newcastle



The big and obvious difference today was early breaks. And one early goal isn't enough these days, because bus parkers no longer let one goal ruffle a game plan, one goal changes nothing as they still only need one god counter and they are back on levels, so at one down they will still sit in and wait till 15-20 to go before changinging their games plan and committing men forward.

So geting a second and then a third early goals were massive. And as I said, the real difference was just a bit of rub. We get the first goal from a long punt - it was a lovely long punt, but even the lovely ones rarely get finished like this one, against Newcastle we hit a couple and they were bumbled away, and Son can be the worst culprit for this at times, but today he was having one of his "good" days, he took it down beautifully, stayed composed and slotted away calmly. Then the second break we get was an own goal. The third was a beautiful team move involving Sissoko, Winks, Aurier and Son, but it was almost identical to the chance KWP created for Son against Newcastle, then it was bumbled away, today it gets whacked home with aplomb. This isn't all about luck, the football leading to all the goals was good, but our approach h play against Newcastle was good at times, the difference is some days the final actions click and some days they don't. Three goals up in 23 minutes and now Palace's game plan is decimated, the fourth - the best of the bunch - killed their spirit completely too.

I'm not saying the score is misleading or misrepresenting the game, it's not, I'm just saying the way we set about that game today wasn't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, just when you get the early breaks like we did today it can seem like we started with more intent today, and I don't really think this is the case, we just better things in their box during this early phase then we did in those previous two home games. I didn't think they were terrible performances and I'm not going to get carried away by this one. We scored 4 goals with our first 3 shots on target today, that won't happen often. To back up what I'm saying we actually had an X/G today of 1.05, against Newcastle it was 1.25, against Villa 2.57. Really good news on that front is in those three games we've only allowed XG's against of Villa 0.64, Newcastle 0.51 and Palace 0.58.

The third and fourth goals today were particularly pleasing as they came from good team moves, with the ball flowing through midfield via Sissoko/Winks, out to flanks and ended wit good final balls, especially Kane's superb pass for Lamela for the fourth.

One big difference today was this was the first home game Eriksen had started. He wasn't scintillating today but just having him out there from the get go adds a different, more intelligent dimension, more composure, better movement, which has a knock on effect on those around him.

As I alluded to earlier, Son is always lively, brings a direct threat that none of our other players really do, but can go long phases looking like he can't control the ball and makes poor choices, then he has games like today where he's absolutely bang on it, looks a different class and cal light up a game. If only he could do this every week.

I've got to give Sissoko a mention, there was still some clunky moments, that's just who he is, I still don't want him out there, but after a poor first few minutes he was good for the rest of the first half and actually passed the ball vertically a few times.

Tactically this was a slightly strange one. We seemed to start in the 4231, but that seemed to morph into a 4222 with the ball and a 442 without, certainly second half anyway.

I personally would have preferred Eriksen central and Son as the wide left AM. I just like him running at and cutting in from wider, inside channels and Eriksen in that more congested central zone, able to drift around, where his composure can be applied, but today it was moot.

These opening three home games have shown some green shoots of some kind of return to the former blue print, control, possession. In two of the games we've hit 7 goals. We aren't allowing - inferior quality, pragmatic - opponents to have chunks of the game and create lots of situations and chances. But both the Villa and Newcastle games still showed sings that our fragilities of the last 24 months hadn't been eradicated. But if we can keep being earnest about the way we go about things, doing the basics right, and our forwards and creatives can start delivering more composed final actions, it will bode well for the future.

Individual

Lloris - Fuck all to do.

Aurier - Good game. Please no more fucking CB's at RB Poch.

Alderweireld - Lovely ball for the first, a TA special, not overly tested but a couple of good bits of defensive tidying up at times.

Vertonghen - Decent game.

Rose - Very careless with the ball at times, didn't really contribute heaps going forward. Meh.

Sissoko - gave away another stupid free kick near our box early on, and against teams like this it's their biggest threat, and early on killed a couple of attacks with backwards passing, but for the rest of the first half was decent, playing some vertical passes. Second half faded offensively but was fine.

Winks - Decent game, like Sissoko was the conduit for a goal or two.

Lamela - Great run and and finish for his goal, did some decent things and the odd clumsy thing. Decent overall.

Son - Eyes bright like a samelar hound first half for sure, exceedingly good game overall.

Eriksen - Quietly efficient game without being spectacular.

Kane - Decent game. I saw him actually pressing first half, which was nice, and his awareness and pass for Lamela's goal was the ball of the game for me.

Davies - I actually thought he looked more sure footed than Rose when he came on. Wouldn't mind seeing him get some starts in the next few games.

Ndombele - Nice little cameo, couple of moments where he dropped a shoulder, left his marker and then popped the ball forward. This is the difference between him and his almost namesake Dembele, Dembele had that shoulder drop, but would then like too often drop the shoulder a couple more times before playing it square. But I do think Dembele was more robust without the ball, so I hope we find our way to a 433 if we want to get the best out of Ndombele.

What seemed to distinguish this game from the earlier ones this season was more slick passing to move the ball round and more of our players in better form.

Whilst not back to our best, passes out to Aurier were the kind that KWP could have only dreamed of in earlier games. And generally unmarked he put in some decent crosses. Winks had a good game constantly keeping the ball going forward or out to the wings as did Alderweireld. Son equally had a good game, very positive ruining rings round Palace defence. Kane whilst seemingly quiet seemed to be playing a withdrawn striker role with plenty of passing. Don't think any Spurs players had a bad or even average game - in previous games it seemed too few players had good games and far more just average performances.

Whatever Poch said to the squad last week they seemed to be playing far more coherently together
 
I've got to give Sissoko a mention, there was still some clunky moments, that's just who he is, I still don't want him out there, but after a poor first few minutes he was good for the rest of the first half and actually passed the ball vertically a few times.

A good summary one of your best, by why spoil it with your usual bias ....

Sissoko had the best pass success rate on the pitch ... so if he was a 'clunker' the rest must have been complete donkeys. In fact it was the very noticeable change in both Sissoko and Winks that made a huge difference today. Same balls forwards, backwards, sideways but for 45 minutes the ball forward was to feet and at pace. In fact a few times it arrived so fast that the forward players couldn't control it, but when they did it enabled them to find space in the final third as defenders and midfield players simply didn't have time to react, the very thing that has been so lacking in our previous parked-bus outings.

As Poch has said this was all about the same players actually realising that they haven't got a god given right to beat teams, yes we are better than Palace a lot better in fact, but we still need to put that extra ability to work. That's what we did today ... when we slowed the ball right down in the second half we looked no better than before, still in full control but not really threatening ... strangely that's a good thing Poch can just roll out the video of each half and point out that speed of ball makes all the difference ... hopefully lesson learned.

Just a thought on Aurier - Palace attacked almost exclusively on their right (Zaha) if you can't look decent when you have almost zero defending to do when can you look good? ... with luck this will have been a massive confidence booster for him, he now needs a run of games to finally make his mark. KWP may well have missed out on the easiest right back game of the season, sometimes that's just the way it goes.
 
The Importance of Being Earnest

It will be hard to resist cliches like "we got our Spurs back" etc after the scorline today, and it was nice to bang in some goals, but in truth, our intentions and application weren't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, where we came out and and controlled and pushed forward in both games from the get go, both those previous home games showed signs of us getting back to some basic former values, both showed a return to good intentions and practices, even if there were still clearly omnipresent issues (and I don't think they have vanished completely either). But in all three home games now we've seen a return to more earnest endeavours.

Villa


Newcastle



The big and obvious difference today was early breaks. And one early goal isn't enough these days, because bus parkers no longer let one goal ruffle a game plan, one goal changes nothing as they still only need one god counter and they are back on levels, so at one down they will still sit in and wait till 15-20 to go before changinging their games plan and committing men forward.

So geting a second and then a third early goals were massive. And as I said, the real difference was just a bit of rub. We get the first goal from a long punt - it was a lovely long punt, but even the lovely ones rarely get finished like this one, against Newcastle we hit a couple and they were bumbled away, and Son can be the worst culprit for this at times, but today he was having one of his "good" days, he took it down beautifully, stayed composed and slotted away calmly. Then the second break we get was an own goal. The third was a beautiful team move involving Sissoko, Winks, Aurier and Son, but it was almost identical to the chance KWP created for Son against Newcastle, then it was bumbled away, today it gets whacked home with aplomb. This isn't all about luck, the football leading to all the goals was good, but our approach h play against Newcastle was good at times, the difference is some days the final actions click and some days they don't. Three goals up in 23 minutes and now Palace's game plan is decimated, the fourth - the best of the bunch - killed their spirit completely too.

I'm not saying the score is misleading or misrepresenting the game, it's not, I'm just saying the way we set about that game today wasn't vastly different to the Villa or Newcastle games, just when you get the early breaks like we did today it can seem like we started with more intent today, and I don't really think this is the case, we just better things in their box during this early phase then we did in those previous two home games. I didn't think they were terrible performances and I'm not going to get carried away by this one. We scored 4 goals with our first 3 shots on target today, that won't happen often. To back up what I'm saying we actually had an X/G today of 1.05, against Newcastle it was 1.25, against Villa 2.57. Really good news on that front is in those three games we've only allowed XG's against of Villa 0.64, Newcastle 0.51 and Palace 0.58.

The third and fourth goals today were particularly pleasing as they came from good team moves, with the ball flowing through midfield via Sissoko/Winks, out to flanks and ended wit good final balls, especially Kane's superb pass for Lamela for the fourth.

One big difference today was this was the first home game Eriksen had started. He wasn't scintillating today but just having him out there from the get go adds a different, more intelligent dimension, more composure, better movement, which has a knock on effect on those around him.

As I alluded to earlier, Son is always lively, brings a direct threat that none of our other players really do, but can go long phases looking like he can't control the ball and makes poor choices, then he has games like today where he's absolutely bang on it, looks a different class and cal light up a game. If only he could do this every week.

I've got to give Sissoko a mention, there was still some clunky moments, that's just who he is, I still don't want him out there, but after a poor first few minutes he was good for the rest of the first half and actually passed the ball vertically a few times.

Tactically this was a slightly strange one. We seemed to start in the 4231, but that seemed to morph into a 4222 with the ball and a 442 without, certainly second half anyway.

I personally would have preferred Eriksen central and Son as the wide left AM. I just like him running at and cutting in from wider, inside channels and Eriksen in that more congested central zone, able to drift around, where his composure can be applied, but today it was moot.

These opening three home games have shown some green shoots of some kind of return to the former blue print, control, possession. In two of the games we've hit 7 goals. We aren't allowing - inferior quality, pragmatic - opponents to have chunks of the game and create lots of situations and chances. But both the Villa and Newcastle games still showed signs that our fragilities of the last 24 months hadn't been eradicated. But if we can keep being earnest about the way we go about things, doing the basics right, and our forwards and creatives can start delivering more composed final actions, it will bode well for the future.

Individual

Lloris - Fuck all to do.

Aurier - Good game. Please no more fucking CB's at RB Poch.

Alderweireld - Lovely ball for the first, a TA special, not overly tested but a couple of good bits of defensive tidying up at times.

Vertonghen - Decent game.

Rose - Very careless with the ball at times, didn't really contribute heaps going forward. Meh.

Sissoko - gave away another stupid free kick near our box early on, and against teams like this it's their biggest threat, and early on killed a couple of attacks with backwards passing, but for the rest of the first half was decent, playing some vertical passes. Second half faded offensively but was fine.

Winks - Good game, like Sissoko was the conduit for a goal or two.

Lamela - Great run and and finish for his goal, did some decent things and the odd clumsy thing. Decent overall.

Son - Eyes bright like a samelar hound first half for sure, exceedingly good game overall.

Eriksen - Quietly efficient game without being spectacular.

Kane - Decent game. I saw him actually pressing first half, which was nice, and his awareness and pass for Lamela's goal was the ball of the game for me.

Davies - I actually thought he looked more sure footed than Rose when he came on. Wouldn't mind seeing him get some starts in the next few games.

Ndombele - Nice little cameo, couple of moments where he dropped a shoulder, left his marker and then popped the ball forward. This is the difference between him and his almost namesake Dembele, Dembele had that shoulder drop, but would then like too often drop the shoulder a couple more times before playing it square. But I do think Dembele was more robust without the ball, so I hope we find our way to a 433 if we want to get the best out of Ndombele.
Against Newcastle we did not have a shot of any description until the 32nd minute against Palace we had a shot within 30 seconds and were 3-0 in 23 minutes - if we had played the same way as we did today against Newcastle we’d be 2nd in the table thinking we are going to win the league!
 
Great performance from everybody, we got a bit sloppy in the 2nd half due to complacency.

I gave Son the MOTM but I thought Lamela and Sissoko were great too.

Special mention for Winks, this kid is going to be amazing. My only slight criticism of him last season was that he didn't play enough forward passes into dangerous areas.
I think that this season he is trying to do that more often (eye test) and would be interested to see the stats on this if available.
 
Great performance from everybody, we got a bit sloppy in the 2nd half due to complacency.

I gave Son the MOTM but I thought Lamela and Sissoko were great too.

Special mention for Winks, this kid is going to be amazing. My only slight criticism of him last season was that he didn't play enough forward passes into dangerous areas.
I think that this season he is trying to do that more often (eye test) and would be interested to see the stats on this if available.

Think the difference yesterday was that Winks (and pretty much everybody) played passes quickly in the first half, and that often meant that Palace hadn't time to get back into their preferred defending shape, so any forward pass (including passes to Aurier at RB) generally meant the Spurs attacker at which it was aimed wasn't closely marked by a Palace defender and the forward pass therefore set off a decent attack.

Lesson for the first team is that most of PL cannot live with us at speed. If we slow the ball down, they can.
Obviously needs a fit Spurs side. And by the looks of things, other than Lo Celso and Foyth, we now have a squad of 20 or so players who are fit and if rotated can have a side out which is not fatigued and can play at speed.
 
Do not normally vote for MOM unless like today there is a clear winner in my eyes. Son was clearly MOM and really no one played badly but Son was exceptional. Normally it is Son that is subbed rather than Kane but he deserved the opportunity to get a 3rd. Best performance since those 2 big victories last Xmas
 
Back
Top Bottom