What a load of utter shite.
-
The Fighting Cock is a forum for fans of Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Here you can discuss Spurs latest matches, our squad, tactics and any transfer news surrounding the club. Registration gives you access to all our forums (including 'Off Topic' discussion) and removes most of the adverts (you can remove them all via an account upgrade). You're here now, you might as well...
Transfers The Winter Transfer Thread - 25/26
- Thread starter The Fighting Cock
- Start date
Latest Spurs videos from Sky Sports
Cheers for the analysis. Very interesting and I can see your points.
FWIW, I've seen us play out from the back in many matches, centrally and down the wings. I think there's some order to do it when a) a certain scenario occurs or b) to mix it up if under pressure/other things aren't working. Which means it's down to Vic's decision making. I lost count of the times he hoofed it against Brentford, it was infuriating. I didn't see Frank's reaction to it, though, and of all teams, you'd imagine Bees would see that one coming. It's probably how they got 90% of their <5 mins goals.
Yeah the hoof-ball thing isn't an every game thing. We seem to pick out matches to really punt it. It's ugly and infuriating to watch but it's not constant - there have been a few games, usually against proper dogshit teams where we've played out from the back and largely kept the ball on the ground rather than lumping it 30 times per game. Presumably Frank's more comfortable playing out against weaker teams that don't press as much or something?
Hoof ball might not be the only thing but it’s definitely the main thing.
Even if we mix it up sometimes, what we see 90% of the time is hoof ball
Fucking madness in my book, we've barely improved in the summer, Palhinha is taking minutes off much younger and brighter Gray and we aren't all that better off for it, Simons is taking time to adapt to the PL, Muani has taken a while to get fit and being played out of position due to sheer lack of options, and Kudus has been bright but desperately needs other forwards on his wavelength. There will be question marks yet again over whether we have hung Frank out to dry with the summer window we had considering the injury situation being as it was before a ball was even kicked this season.
I thought the whole point of a director of football was that you bought players to fit the philosophy of the club
Then you hired managers that fit with that philosophy
We won't "sign players for Frank". We will sign them for whoever is in charge.
Then you hired managers that fit with that philosophy
We won't "sign players for Frank". We will sign them for whoever is in charge.
I just don’t see our midfield showing for the ball and the rare times the do, they boot it right back to the CB. Almost never seem to position to receive it and move upfield with it.
From the wings, Spence will. Porro not as much.
Of late especially, hoof-ball seems our only “plan”.
From the wings, Spence will. Porro not as much.
Of late especially, hoof-ball seems our only “plan”.
I'm not saying it IS, but I think this MIGHT be confirmation/recency bias. I'm trying to remember how annoyed I've been in the past few matches and it wasn't nearly as much as the brentford one. That felt at least 75% hoofball. Especially in the second half.
...Or I might be blessed with a short-term memory for pain.
My thoughts exactly.
If the club has a consistent philosophy, the transfers should be in support of it.
Wait, I think I see the problem…
If we can get loan signings or players who are manager neutral as in are good enough to be here for 4 or 5 years, regardless of the manager, then I'm all for it.
Anything tbat suggests we are buying players for a long Frank tenure would be worrying.
Anything tbat suggests we are buying players for a long Frank tenure would be worrying.
Yeah kinda - I'd say 90% we're really ugly to watch but we don't hoof it 90%.
I think Brentford and Palace are particularly stark examples of the hoofing. These are away games against direct teams that don't love having the ball when we're without any of our creative midfielders. If you put yourself in Frank's head then these are gonna be the games when you go to 100 on the Pulis-o-Meter and just punt it at every opportunity.
There are plenty games where we're similarly dire to watch but it's more cos we're just passing it about aimlessly around the back with no penetration rather than cos we're hoofing it. Although we do go long from goal-kicks and punt it a hell of a lot more in general than we used to.
So you're saying you don't want us to sign better players in January!
Rather than strengthen our first XI you'd rather us not spend any money just wing it with what we have! Because we appointed another dud manager!
Jeez man. Our fans never cease to amaze. ENIC's wet dream
Palace are absolutely NOT a hoof it football team. Good grief.
This is revisionist imo
A little bit at least.
Everyone was sure that was a window for the ages. Palinha was signing of the season, RKM was a genius loan signing, Kudus was an 80m player the season before.
And that’s how it looked to start the season. Then teams adjusted to the way we play and we saw the limitations of our system, manager and as usual, the form of our players dropped.
Nobody is forcing Frank to play RKM out of position. He has 2 LW’s fit with Tel and Odobert but he’s determined to play Richy. RKM is a striker who is historically better on the RW than the LW but he won’t use Kudus in the 10 and RKM on the RW either,
He spent 10 mins of the last press conference waxing lyrical about Sunderland. They would kill for Kudus and RKM but they could never sign them. He says they are doing an amazing job at Sunderland and I’m just wondering why isn’t he doing a wonderful job for us.
I didn't say that. I said they're direct. Very different thing. They have some of the lowest possession in the division and tend to play very quick through to their forward players. They thrive off space in behind and dont like it when teams sit deep against them and give them the ball.
Good grief
Sign Baleba and Mitoma from Brighton. They are PL proven quality players in the positions we desperately need. Any decent manager could get them to work, Frank doesn’t even enter the equation.
I didn't say that. I said they're direct. Very different thing. They have some of the lowest possession in the division and tend to play very quick through to their forward players. They thrive off space in behind and dont like it when teams sit deep against them and give them the ball.
Good grief
Your words
"Particular stark example of the hoofing"
I am not getting into a debate about Palace but I don't see them as a hoofing type of team.
I meant us hoofing you dolt.
(Also see: Eze & Olise.)
They also get the chance to play every week.
We sign young players from the champo and (with the exception of Dele) they spend the next few years scratching around for minutes with no consistent gametime or on loan at a lower level than we require them to play at, similarly scrambling for minutes.
"Do it like Brighton/Palace/(formerly) Southampton" or indeed "do it like Dortmund" (i.e. the deluxe CL version of the former) has never directly translated to us because of the top 6/7/8 nature of the EPL and the expectations upon us within that yearly dogfight.
It's a shitty dichotomy that there's no one-fix strategy out of....... Other than that, when we do spend at the more expensive end of the scale they MUST be a hit cos it fucks everything up for the other developing players too. The high price newbies have to be given all the patience and nurturing that might otherwise be afforded to the young'ns and punts (whist also creating a lower functioning platform for them to learn from).... Creating a vicious circle.
Last edited:
United have shown their leg at Baleba, so forget that, and it's a perfect example of if it went badly it was us taking the easy option and not going for proven ability. If it went well there would be silence and we got lucky. It won't happen so all moot.
Mitoma can't get into the Brighton first team, is 28,and we should sign him. Rightio.