Stellini did a good job until he had a mental breakdown setting the team up against Newcastle. No idea why he did that, there must be a back story we haven't been told.
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Manager Thomas Frank
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Mason got 7 points in his 6 games in charge, including Liverpool and Man Utd. Stellini got 4 points in 4 games, including the 6-1 battering. In Conte's 12 games from 1st Jan 2023 to his weird outburst and absconding back home, he had 19 points (6W, 1D, 5L) which is just under 1.6 PPG. On 1st Jan, we had played 1 more game than other teams around us and were in 4th, 1 point ahead of Man Utd. By the time he left we were 1 point behind Man Utd, in 4th, but we had played 2 games more than the teams around us and were only 2 points ahead of newcastle.
The reason why we ended up in 8th wasn't "mainly" because of Stellini / Mason, it was 100% because Conte went to shit in 2023 and abandoned his coaching staff to look after a project that he knew was going to show him up when the teams below us played their games-in-hand.
When we finished in 8th we were 2 points off 6th, so Conte getting battered 4-1 by a soon to be relegated Leicester is a pretty solid reason why we finished 8th.
I don't buy the argument that Ange overplayed and burnt out the players early in both seasons. He rested Romero, VDV, Udogie in pretty much all of the cup games and they were playing 1 game per week.
Our running and distance covered stats sat firmly in line with other high performing teams in the league, and in fact our most hard-working player was always Son (who's hamstrings didn't explode) and the most minutes were played by Porro (who again, didn't have exploding hamstrings).
The massive number of injuries suffered was most likely attributed to poor preparation and conditioning training by the medical team.
The first season was not a 1 off flash. Again, in the 2nd season by Game week 12 (1/3rd into the season) Spurs were just a few points off 2nd place. Then we got injuries to important players and, had a game every 3 days for almost 3 months without a break.
If the medical dept get their shit together, the expectation should be that this squad challenges for the title. Liverpool's best players (Alison, Salah, VVD) are getting older, City are going through a squad overhaul, Woolwich suck balls, United are well, United. Spurs have a better squad than Newcastle. Chelsea may be the ones to watch next season if they can get some consistency out of their younger players.
Yes, the odds are against Spurs - but at least fucking try and have some belief. The players, the fans and the club have to believe they can win - or its all a waste of time.
Good post.
When assessing Postecoglou some flat out make no allowance for the injuries to key players, or blame him for them and then make no allowance for them.
Frank has a new medical team, just about a fully fit squad, he has had some good additions already (still needs a 6), and the young players now have valuable experience and a European trophy.
I'm looking forward to a season where we're in with a fighting chance to win something.
Agree
Fighting chance of winning a flick on from repeated long throws…. Unless he adapts he will lose the squad and not make the season
Throw in Frank
I agree with some of your points but despite the negative issues related to Conte (at Spurs and his other previous clubs), he’s still is/was a better coach than Ange, and I don’t any reasoning in comparing the achievements of both coaches at top level leagues.
Except that to qualify to play for the Super Cup you need to have achieved over two seasons whereas the Charity Shield requires only one.
You're clutching here
Not in the slightest.
By any measure you care to mention, the Super Cup is more prestigious than the Charity Shield.
It is, you're correct. It's a more prestigious Charity Shield.Not in the slightest.
By any measure you care to mention, the Super Cup is more prestigious than the Charity Shield.
It 100% was.
1st season 10 games 26 points.
2nd season 10 games 16 points (!!) TEN LESS (!!!). Also in 1st season at this point we were 2 points ahead of everyone else, II season 9 points behind 1st place. Also what you said is blatant lie - when all teams had completed 12 games in last season we had 19 points 2nd placed City had 23, so 4 points, not 2 off 2nd place (and 12 !!! points behind then leader, when you want to talk about only 1st places).
These two season starts are not comparable at all, not by any stretch of imagination.
Also I never said that he overplayed players. It was all about how the team was set up. How there was zero control and tactical periodization within the game. How some players need to make some totally uncontrolled sprints while already potentially being in red zone. If you use plainly "distance covered" metric to say who had what kind of pressure on himself, it says next to nothing. You can jog in controlled tempo 11 km per game, but if you are forced to make 4 70 meter sprints in 2 minutes - thats what kills things.
All I know and have to show for it is that we had 1st "worst ever" injury crises in 1st year of Ange reign. To be topped of with far worse crises in his 2nd spell. Sure there could have been some movements here and there, but without better knowing, I assume most of the medical department was same for managers preceeding Ange too.
But yeh, sure. It was all just bad luck and fault of everyone else. Ange was the best thing that could have ever happen to anyone and he is by far greatest tactical thinker (despite his absolute garbage results since 11th round first season)
.
First press conference today
Choo choo!
Where are you getting this information from??
Defining being a good coach is different to being a good manager. And being a good coach or manager is so different depending on the challenge at hand. Personally I think the type of coach/managers who have performed miracles in lieu of style (Allardyce, Moyes, Pulis) are unfairly judged as if they were managing the same sides as Klopp, Pep, or Ferguson, and Warnock/Parker seemingly able to get teams regularly promoted from a tough league.
Only have to look at Kompany's dichotomous CV between Burnley and Bayern.
I'd say that Ange was tactically naive, didn't actually do any coaching as far as any obvious signs or anecdotes suggest, but his man management seems to have totally eclipsed anything we've had in the PL era.
Evidence for most of this is rather obvious, but the ability to win a cup has set him apart, obviously in part due to his motivational speaking ability, but it's rather bizarre to have a manager lose so many PL games and yet still not only not lose the dressing room, but to also have them hugely disappointed that he left after the fact.
Conte seems to be able to win leagues, but only when he is given huge funds to do so, and has a rather different mantra to Ange, in that he may was well say "I ALWAYS fuck it up in my second season", so if he lasts the summer at Napoli it will be interesting to see
Short memories eh?
What time?First press conference today
Choo choo!
Not in the slightest.
By any measure you care to mention, the Super Cup is more prestigious than the Charity Shield.
I think the fact that people on here don’t even know its name, the Community Shield Is not up there with something that’s literally called Super.