I haven't bothered looking that up!
I take for granted he will suffer a quadruple fractured leg! Him or Vicario or Sonny!
It's that kind of season!
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Player Timo Werner
- Thread starter Starks
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I take for granted he will suffer a quadruple fractured leg! Him or Vicario or Sonny!
It's that kind of season!
That's a long fucking medical, Monday to Friday, geez!!!
Nothing surprises with our medical department anymore!!!
Players make mistakes, it's part of the game really. In his case mind, he should probably be prepared for a tsunami lol
I didn’t like him at the Chavs but I rarely like anyone who does play for them or who manages them
But I hope he does get game time on Sunday and does well for us
Simple really?
Nope!! Been busy monitoring FlightRadar!!!
Ten Hag phoned him and when Werner found out that he had to share a seat with Fernandes
Slags
Levy probably upgraded him to Jet2
View: https://x.com/TheAthleticFC/status/1744335895128682833?s=20
This is a very good piece (sorry if already posted I can't be arsed to read 33 pages looool).
Timo Werner needs to play for an optimistic football team – Spurs may suit him perfectly
By Sebastian Stafford-Bloor
8h ago
24
Timo Werner’s career has not recovered from his last visit to the Premier League.
When it ended in August 2022, he limped back to Germany and RB Leipzig. If the aim was to reclaim his status in the game, then it did not work. Werner leaves Germany again having made the needle twitch a few times but he has ultimately become peripheral at club and international level.
It makes his loan move to Tottenham Hotspur, perhaps to become a permanent one, intriguing. Ange Postecoglou has a habit of rebalancing players who have lost their equilibrium. Postecoglou’s attacking football is so vibrant and varied that Werner, 27, who has been searching for relevance, should be able to find a home within it. Maybe he can discover some form, too.
GO DEEPER
Can Angeball unlock Timo Werner's potential? We're about to find out
But perhaps that is the wrong lens through which to assess him. Maybe Werner is not someone chasing his yesterdays at all. This idea that he fell from greatness to mediocrity, and is now trying to claw his way back, might be a seductive angle but it’s an embellishment of his talent. He is an eye-catching, dynamic and often effective player, but he is not an exceptional one. That supporters are clear-eyed about that now is helpful.
His new head coach’s attacking vision should suit him, too. Postecoglou has already managed to blend the distilled virtues of complicated players into his team this season. Giovani Lo Celso, Richarlison, Pedro Porro, Yves Bissouma. One of the subtle characteristics of this Tottenham side is how it emphasises the strengths of players, while minimising their weaknesses. They are an optimistic football team in that sense, making this the best possible re-entry point for Werner in England.
He arrives with little pressure, too, and given the terms of the deal Spurs see the move as one with little risk and potentially a good deal of reward. He covers positions they need to reinforce, principally on the left and through the centre of their attack — where they’re currently especially light with Son Heung-min away at the Asian Cup. And he has played in the Premier League and lived in London before so would not need to acclimatise.
He is highly motivated to perform and to win a place in Germany’s squad for the European Championship. If that does not happen, then the finances of the loan agreement would only make it a missed opportunity for him, rather than a serious mistake for the club.
From a technical perspective, though, there is good reason to think positively. Werner’s speed, his waspish pressing and his capacity to distort defences and race into gaps will enhance Tottenham’s existing dynamics. As intricate as their football can be, it is sometimes more blunt in the final 30 yards. Although partly the legacy of this season’s debilitating injury crisis and the absence of James Maddison’s craft, that stutter in their football also describes a forward group that is still slightly conservative.
Most often, that shows when Tottenham counter-attack or skip through a press. There are times when they fashion a numerical advantage only to let it slip away, with a cautious action — a sideways pass, a check infield — allowing an opponent to regroup. Werner’s south-to-north mentality should help with that. His instinct is always to move forward and race towards the defensive line and that should allow Spurs to exploit space more ruthlessly.
His role at RB Leipzig between 2016 and 2020 had similarities and it was ideal for him.
During those years, Werner was a fast-breaking player in a well-coached team that had been built to exploit the Bundesliga’s transitional nature. He was the club’s top scorer in each of his four years. But while that may be the headline of an exceptional goalscorer, his finishing remained largely in step with his expected goals. He took the chances he was supposed to; he finished what he was meant to finish.
It may be unusual to describe a forward in this way, but Werner was just part of that Leipzig team. It just so happened that it was the part responsible for scoring goals. As Chelsea discovered, that is not quite the same as being a goalscorer by trade.
Litigating the Premier League section of his career is as difficult as it is worthless. He can be damned for it and it can be mitigated. He did not play well enough, underperforming his xG in both seasons in England, but the circumstances — the side being rebuilt, the coaching changes and uncertainty — were probably not in his favour, either. Where Chelsea’s responsibility ended and his began is difficult to determine.
What is clear — and nothing which has happened since he returned to Germany has proven otherwise — is that Werner’s game has weaknesses that prevent him from occupying certain positions. He is not a centre-forward, because he is not a reliable enough finisher. His long stride and the speed-skater gait which make him effective in the channels is a hindrance, too, and can often make him look uncomfortable when trying to adjust his feet around a shooting chance.
He is not really a winger, either, because he does not dribble past players very often, nor does he really cross the ball. One of the issues that appeared at Chelsea, which had never been as relevant at Leipzig, was that he is not incisive with the ball around the box; he cannot play intricately in the way that, for instance, Dejan Kulusevski can.
But Spurs do not need him to do any of those things. Werner is excellent at finding space in a way that allows his teammates to target him as a receiver and move the ball up the field. That is a prerequisite of Red Bull football but clearly relevant at Spurs now, too. In addition, his acceleration mandates that individual defenders cannot be caught in isolation against him; the butterfly effect being that, when an opposing centre-back or deep midfielder lends support, space appears elsewhere.
Most obviously, though, he can run beyond a defence — and in a way that is difficult to contend with. The graphic below provides a good example, showing the build-up to a goal he scored against Borussia Monchengladbach in March 2023.
From a turnover in midfield, Werner made a run which allowed Benjamin Henrichs to play a slide-rule pass through the defence. A simple bit of play, but the speed at which his movement changed the shape of the game characterises his influence. Notice the clock in the top-left corner. Gladbach went from being structurally secure to their centre-backs turning and chasing one of the quickest players in the league within less than three seconds.
Werner rounded the goalkeeper and scored. Where he ran from and how rapidly he altered the passing options would, had that analysis been part of this transfer decision, surely have arched one of Postecoglou’s eyebrows.
It’s a run Richarlison probably is not quick enough to make. It is one that might be in Son Heung-min’s past, too. But it’s a through ball that a player of James Maddison’s calibre could produce easily, so too Kulusevski, Rodrigo Bentancur and the resurgent Lo Celso. The chart below illustrates that Spurs are generating strong counter-attacking numbers, but, per Opta, only one of them has resulted in a goal this season.
So if the challenge in this transfer window is for Tottenham to vary their attack, then they have probably already done so.
That’s only in theory, though, because Spurs are not getting a fully rehabilitated player.
Werner has had good moments back in the Bundesliga. Nine goals in 2022-23 was a fair return given the circumstances. Leipzig sacked Domenico Tedesco just a few weeks after Werner moved back, in August 2022, and then spent the season preparing for a summer of transition. Andre Silva, Dominik Szoboszlai, Christopher Nkunku and Josko Gvardiol all left in the summer of 2023 and while the side performed well enough under new coach Marco Rose, rarely did they gain any momentum.
This season, as well as a troublesome abductor injury, Werner has found himself marginalised. Leipzig rebuilt their attack over the summer, signing Lois Openda and Benjamin Sesko and loaning Xavi Simons. Sesko and Openda are the club’s future, both outstanding in their own ways, and Yussuf Poulsen has also enjoyed a renaissance, often being used as a foil for one or the other.
Rose is using a 4-2-2-2 formation and there is no home for Werner as one of the No 10s behind the forward line, either. Simons has been wonderful in one of those roles, while Dani Olmo has been just as good in the other.
It left no room for Werner. In the literal sense, because he has no role to play, but also because Leipzig did not lack any of the abilities he possesses, either. Openda is a superior finisher and every bit as quick. Sesko is one of the great all-round forwards in the making. Poulsen has a physical presence and pressing game that Werner could never match. He has played barely 200 minutes in the Bundesliga and, rationally, that makes sense.
Werner’s most recent league goal came in October against Cologne (Maja Hitij/Getty Images)
He has not played for Germany since June 2023 either, which — for a player with nearly 60 caps — describes his malaise. Even with his former head coach appointed to the national team, players like Stuttgart’s Chris Fuhrich are — rightly — being selected in the squad ahead of him.
And yet, because football will always be about who requires what and when, Werner’s situation is not nearly as important as what he might be able to provide. For all their improvement, Spurs could use a dose of something. An unpredictable element that might, on better days, make them more forceful.
If Timo Werner does nothing more than that, then that would still make this move a success.
View: https://x.com/TheAthleticFC/status/1744335895128682833?s=20
This is a very good piece (sorry if already posted I can't be arsed to read 33 pages looool).
Timo Werner needs to play for an optimistic football team – Spurs may suit him perfectly
By Sebastian Stafford-Bloor
8h ago
24
Timo Werner’s career has not recovered from his last visit to the Premier League.
When it ended in August 2022, he limped back to Germany and RB Leipzig. If the aim was to reclaim his status in the game, then it did not work. Werner leaves Germany again having made the needle twitch a few times but he has ultimately become peripheral at club and international level.
It makes his loan move to Tottenham Hotspur, perhaps to become a permanent one, intriguing. Ange Postecoglou has a habit of rebalancing players who have lost their equilibrium. Postecoglou’s attacking football is so vibrant and varied that Werner, 27, who has been searching for relevance, should be able to find a home within it. Maybe he can discover some form, too.
GO DEEPER
Can Angeball unlock Timo Werner's potential? We're about to find out
But perhaps that is the wrong lens through which to assess him. Maybe Werner is not someone chasing his yesterdays at all. This idea that he fell from greatness to mediocrity, and is now trying to claw his way back, might be a seductive angle but it’s an embellishment of his talent. He is an eye-catching, dynamic and often effective player, but he is not an exceptional one. That supporters are clear-eyed about that now is helpful.
His new head coach’s attacking vision should suit him, too. Postecoglou has already managed to blend the distilled virtues of complicated players into his team this season. Giovani Lo Celso, Richarlison, Pedro Porro, Yves Bissouma. One of the subtle characteristics of this Tottenham side is how it emphasises the strengths of players, while minimising their weaknesses. They are an optimistic football team in that sense, making this the best possible re-entry point for Werner in England.
He arrives with little pressure, too, and given the terms of the deal Spurs see the move as one with little risk and potentially a good deal of reward. He covers positions they need to reinforce, principally on the left and through the centre of their attack — where they’re currently especially light with Son Heung-min away at the Asian Cup. And he has played in the Premier League and lived in London before so would not need to acclimatise.
He is highly motivated to perform and to win a place in Germany’s squad for the European Championship. If that does not happen, then the finances of the loan agreement would only make it a missed opportunity for him, rather than a serious mistake for the club.
From a technical perspective, though, there is good reason to think positively. Werner’s speed, his waspish pressing and his capacity to distort defences and race into gaps will enhance Tottenham’s existing dynamics. As intricate as their football can be, it is sometimes more blunt in the final 30 yards. Although partly the legacy of this season’s debilitating injury crisis and the absence of James Maddison’s craft, that stutter in their football also describes a forward group that is still slightly conservative.
Most often, that shows when Tottenham counter-attack or skip through a press. There are times when they fashion a numerical advantage only to let it slip away, with a cautious action — a sideways pass, a check infield — allowing an opponent to regroup. Werner’s south-to-north mentality should help with that. His instinct is always to move forward and race towards the defensive line and that should allow Spurs to exploit space more ruthlessly.
His role at RB Leipzig between 2016 and 2020 had similarities and it was ideal for him.
During those years, Werner was a fast-breaking player in a well-coached team that had been built to exploit the Bundesliga’s transitional nature. He was the club’s top scorer in each of his four years. But while that may be the headline of an exceptional goalscorer, his finishing remained largely in step with his expected goals. He took the chances he was supposed to; he finished what he was meant to finish.
It may be unusual to describe a forward in this way, but Werner was just part of that Leipzig team. It just so happened that it was the part responsible for scoring goals. As Chelsea discovered, that is not quite the same as being a goalscorer by trade.
Litigating the Premier League section of his career is as difficult as it is worthless. He can be damned for it and it can be mitigated. He did not play well enough, underperforming his xG in both seasons in England, but the circumstances — the side being rebuilt, the coaching changes and uncertainty — were probably not in his favour, either. Where Chelsea’s responsibility ended and his began is difficult to determine.
What is clear — and nothing which has happened since he returned to Germany has proven otherwise — is that Werner’s game has weaknesses that prevent him from occupying certain positions. He is not a centre-forward, because he is not a reliable enough finisher. His long stride and the speed-skater gait which make him effective in the channels is a hindrance, too, and can often make him look uncomfortable when trying to adjust his feet around a shooting chance.
He is not really a winger, either, because he does not dribble past players very often, nor does he really cross the ball. One of the issues that appeared at Chelsea, which had never been as relevant at Leipzig, was that he is not incisive with the ball around the box; he cannot play intricately in the way that, for instance, Dejan Kulusevski can.
But Spurs do not need him to do any of those things. Werner is excellent at finding space in a way that allows his teammates to target him as a receiver and move the ball up the field. That is a prerequisite of Red Bull football but clearly relevant at Spurs now, too. In addition, his acceleration mandates that individual defenders cannot be caught in isolation against him; the butterfly effect being that, when an opposing centre-back or deep midfielder lends support, space appears elsewhere.
Most obviously, though, he can run beyond a defence — and in a way that is difficult to contend with. The graphic below provides a good example, showing the build-up to a goal he scored against Borussia Monchengladbach in March 2023.
From a turnover in midfield, Werner made a run which allowed Benjamin Henrichs to play a slide-rule pass through the defence. A simple bit of play, but the speed at which his movement changed the shape of the game characterises his influence. Notice the clock in the top-left corner. Gladbach went from being structurally secure to their centre-backs turning and chasing one of the quickest players in the league within less than three seconds.
Werner rounded the goalkeeper and scored. Where he ran from and how rapidly he altered the passing options would, had that analysis been part of this transfer decision, surely have arched one of Postecoglou’s eyebrows.
It’s a run Richarlison probably is not quick enough to make. It is one that might be in Son Heung-min’s past, too. But it’s a through ball that a player of James Maddison’s calibre could produce easily, so too Kulusevski, Rodrigo Bentancur and the resurgent Lo Celso. The chart below illustrates that Spurs are generating strong counter-attacking numbers, but, per Opta, only one of them has resulted in a goal this season.
So if the challenge in this transfer window is for Tottenham to vary their attack, then they have probably already done so.
That’s only in theory, though, because Spurs are not getting a fully rehabilitated player.
Werner has had good moments back in the Bundesliga. Nine goals in 2022-23 was a fair return given the circumstances. Leipzig sacked Domenico Tedesco just a few weeks after Werner moved back, in August 2022, and then spent the season preparing for a summer of transition. Andre Silva, Dominik Szoboszlai, Christopher Nkunku and Josko Gvardiol all left in the summer of 2023 and while the side performed well enough under new coach Marco Rose, rarely did they gain any momentum.
This season, as well as a troublesome abductor injury, Werner has found himself marginalised. Leipzig rebuilt their attack over the summer, signing Lois Openda and Benjamin Sesko and loaning Xavi Simons. Sesko and Openda are the club’s future, both outstanding in their own ways, and Yussuf Poulsen has also enjoyed a renaissance, often being used as a foil for one or the other.
Rose is using a 4-2-2-2 formation and there is no home for Werner as one of the No 10s behind the forward line, either. Simons has been wonderful in one of those roles, while Dani Olmo has been just as good in the other.
It left no room for Werner. In the literal sense, because he has no role to play, but also because Leipzig did not lack any of the abilities he possesses, either. Openda is a superior finisher and every bit as quick. Sesko is one of the great all-round forwards in the making. Poulsen has a physical presence and pressing game that Werner could never match. He has played barely 200 minutes in the Bundesliga and, rationally, that makes sense.
Werner’s most recent league goal came in October against Cologne (Maja Hitij/Getty Images)
He has not played for Germany since June 2023 either, which — for a player with nearly 60 caps — describes his malaise. Even with his former head coach appointed to the national team, players like Stuttgart’s Chris Fuhrich are — rightly — being selected in the squad ahead of him.
And yet, because football will always be about who requires what and when, Werner’s situation is not nearly as important as what he might be able to provide. For all their improvement, Spurs could use a dose of something. An unpredictable element that might, on better days, make them more forceful.
If Timo Werner does nothing more than that, then that would still make this move a success.
Not surprised to see our press and counter attack numbers similar to Liverpool. I know Ange is of the Puskas school and in theory should be closer to Pep but there is a slightly Klopp way about how we set up.
My opinion is that this is exactly the type of player we desperately need. I stated we needed a forward type player that is comfortable playing out wide (in particular on the left) and can double up as a striker. The links with Jota puzzled me because he is more a winger who cant play up top, doesn't really have much pace and not really what we need.
People posting his Chavski goal return are not understanding we are not in desperate need of a consistent goalscorer. Of course that would be great but what we actually need is someone that provides an attacking threat using his pace to occupy defenders and drag them out of position thus giving more freedom to other players, in particular the full backs. Werner is great at getting into goalscoring positions as well as being able to 'fizz in' a ball into the box (something Porro and Johnson are excelling at but Werner will be able to do that from the other side).
Now analyse our rivals. Woolwich who were top a week ago do not have a consistent goalscorer, Pool have Salah and others chipping in from time to time, United nobody, City Haaland with Alvarez and co helping out and Villa have Watkins with Douglas Luiz helping out.
We have Sonny who is consistent with Richi now providing that 'chipping in' ability and Johnson getting into excellent positions which will inevitably turn into more goals. Maddison and Kulu can also help out in that department.
Essentially Werner would be our Darwin Nunez without needing to splash 70m plus on him. A player that has devastating pace and occupies excellent goalscoring positions with the ability to go on a purple patch. That's what we really need.
People posting his Chavski goal return are not understanding we are not in desperate need of a consistent goalscorer. Of course that would be great but what we actually need is someone that provides an attacking threat using his pace to occupy defenders and drag them out of position thus giving more freedom to other players, in particular the full backs. Werner is great at getting into goalscoring positions as well as being able to 'fizz in' a ball into the box (something Porro and Johnson are excelling at but Werner will be able to do that from the other side).
Now analyse our rivals. Woolwich who were top a week ago do not have a consistent goalscorer, Pool have Salah and others chipping in from time to time, United nobody, City Haaland with Alvarez and co helping out and Villa have Watkins with Douglas Luiz helping out.
We have Sonny who is consistent with Richi now providing that 'chipping in' ability and Johnson getting into excellent positions which will inevitably turn into more goals. Maddison and Kulu can also help out in that department.
Essentially Werner would be our Darwin Nunez without needing to splash 70m plus on him. A player that has devastating pace and occupies excellent goalscoring positions with the ability to go on a purple patch. That's what we really need.
Yep.
I'm assuming those numbers are bang up to date. If they are then I actually find them surprising as last 3 or 4 games our press has gone, a couple of those games it was non-existent (and IMO was the root of our issues) - so just imaging what those numbers would look like if we had a fit squad and could play our best team!!!
The interesting comparison that I see with Liverpool is the use of players within an aggressive pressing structure. Everyone and their dog is fixated on Nunez, it's not just rival Twitter but the established media too all focus on him missing goals, his XG numbers etc. But despite him being a very poor finisher his running at the oppo, his presence in the box creates havoc and he's pulling oppo defences all over the shop. The result of this is only City have scored more goals this season (LFC 43, City 45 and us 42) IMO take Nunez out of LFC they don't get close to this number.
It's hear where I see the potential of Werner, his running, his pace to get behind the oppo, technically his build-up is also very good, probably better than Johnson's. I've no idea if he will work out or not (I'm glad it's a loan to see if he does) but if he does succeed I'm not expecting it to measure in the number of goals HE scores, it will be in the number of goals Spurs scores. There will the the purple and gold mob however tweeting and retweeting the rival fan banter about his goal tally such is going on with Nunez and LFC right now.
I mean could be a bit of both, but his stats in the PL are definitely underwhelming.
welcome Timberto Soldadner
Literally not a single person is talking about football manager. Generally it's his ability to stick the ball in the net (chief role of a striker), or how often he sets up other people to score (one of the major roles of a wide forward) that people are questioning. Real life things which have been measured.
Also I'd be surprised if anyone wants to ship him off before seeing him in our colours. I'm underwhelmed but massively hopeful personally. Plus I also agree that there is very little downside other than if he flunks badly he's taking up a precious squad place.
Can we buy a spare pair of hammies at the same time?I haven't bothered looking that up!
I take for granted he will suffer a quadruple fractured leg! Him or Vicario or Sonny!
It's that kind of season!
Why do people compare him to soldado?
They aren’t alike at all.
Werner is fast, soldado was not.
Soldado was a better goalscorer (pre spurs).
Soldado played only CF or ST. Werner can play wing.
Soldado was THE big summer permanent signing. Werner is a January loan.