Beating the Chavs away (finally!)
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Tottenham's most important games
- Thread starter Princess Bleach
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And this was a club that had a solitary CL campaign to its name when he arrived. Was Poch a failure when he scraped a fifth place finished on the final day of the season in his first campaign? How many years were we behind at that point? AVB should gain some sympathy from the fact that he was walking into a team that was breaking up - Modric was gone, Van De Vaart was finished and it was only a matter of time before Bale was gone. It will be interesting to see how Poch contends with Dembele, Alderwield and Eriksen departing within the next 12 months.
That run of big games beating the them, Arse & Chavski... Consecutive big wins against 'bigger' teams...
You'd probably have to go back to the 80s for similar.
The most important result for us on the last 10 years was the away win at Hull in 2009.
Of course 4this better than 5th, but the achievement of 5th having lost people like Modric, VDV, Gallas, (normal) Adebayor, King (for good) etc and then the following season losing Bale (who AVB turned from an inconsistent winger with bags of potential, into a prolific wide striker and the worlds most expensive player) and then have us still at 6th, was equally impressive in coaching terms.
AVB and Pochettino are far more similar coaches than many on here understand or appreciate. They both have very similar collective principles, possession based ethoses, and if you watched AVB’s Porto you’d realise that when he had the players his football was far more progressive and explosive, he ended up working with the shittest squad that Spurs had had in the last 10 years or so, still had us playing possession football, rather than just fucking Pullis-ing it. There was just very little creative spark to work with. Eriksen was having his first season in a new country surrounded by donkeys like Michael Dawson and Clint Dempsey.
Look at the way we are played initially under Poch, and the way we are playing now under him, hardly high octane stuff is it, most of what we have played the last 12 months has been almost identical to AVB. Methodical possession based football, just punctuated with more higher quality attacking (and defending) individuals.
Poch is a direct evolution of AVB. Not a complete revolution. Poch benefitted enormously from lessons Levy learnt during the AVB regime. Like clearing the decks of cunts working against you behind the scenes like Sherwood and Freund, and having the autonomy to handle wankers like Adebayor how they should be handled and not being undermined. In other words, creating an environment for the coach to have a better chance to succeed.
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Poch didn’t take us backwards. He equaled 5th, while implementing a definite philosophy and system, we got 3rd in his second season rather than looking like we were heading for the championship by November.
VDV was finished? No, VDV was dropped for Dempsey and Siggy. AVB has seven players lavished on him and failed. Hold on a minute......surely that’s what a manager needs right. Loads and loads of new players......so how come the 110M spent that summer was not enough for such a competent manager?
Bale was probably the best player in Europe when AVB had him......what did he achieve under him though?
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Pochettino understood what it means to play the game.
AVB read a book.
Like Mourinho, Sacchi, Sarri don’t understand what it means to play the game you mean?
If only they’d played the game as much as Tim Sherwood eh?
I didn’t have you down as cliche-bantersaurus Sammy
But the people you mentioned are successful managers, and AVB isn’t.
AVB read a book, and failed. Why are you taking about Jose?
That’s the point he didn’t fail. He’s won league titles, trophies, European trophies, and did a good job with what he had to work with at Spurs. (He’s won more than Sarri and Pochettino).
Why are you talking about managers playing the game? It’s cliche’d bollocks.
He inherited a team that Fat Sam wouldn’t have failed with.
Then he went to Chelsea and lost the dressing room, confused the fuck out of the players, bored the fans shitless and got sacked.
Then he went to Spurs and lost the dressing room, confused the fuck out of the players, bored the fans shitless and got sacked.
Then he went to Russia and fuck knows what he’s doing today...racing F1 probably.
I’m not talking about “managers” playing the game. I’m talking about AVB not playing it.
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I don’t think the Princess was actually playing, so what did it matter what she thought? You’re always arguing that online opinions don’t affect how the team plays, so why the change of heart now?
Short sided yourself again you old hypocrite.
AVB won the league with by far the best squad in portugal and did the same in Russia which was what was expected of any manager in that position. He came to England with Chelsea and Spurs and was awful, his football was the most boring in my lifetime. I couldn’t wait till he left, even Sherwood made me slightly happy actually attacking once in a while.
Not a bad shout. 2008-09. Supposedly the match that had we lost would have put us right back in the relegation shit. If we'd got some long term injuries at that point, who knows. Maybe lose Modric and co.
I'd chose the week before, a home 0-0 with Goons, but the first match that Wilson P played. At kick off we were one point off relegation spots. After it, I'd seen enough to know that we'd bossed them and actually had a very good first XI, and most importantly we didn't have to rely on Jenas or Zokora as our DM.
From that point till the end of the season our form was Top 4 (unthinkable at the 2 pts from 8 at the start). First match next season we beat Liverpool 2-1, got top 4, finished above them every season bar one.....I'd say that was a massive turning point.
But how could you be in a position to say that at the end of his first season when we scrapped 5th on the final day? Isn’t the basis for failure finishing outside of the top 4? So therefore Poch must have been a failure after season 1 right? His philosophy only resulted in that league placing after all.
The reality is that the only person who set the club back in the PL era was Alan Sugar. The notion that AVB who secured our highest PL points total in his first season, who played a part in the likes of Lloris, Vertonghen, Lamela, Eriksen and Dembele being at the club set the club back years is just absurd. Even Ramos didn’t set the club back because we qualified for the CL just over 12 months later. And no few coaches want to lose a player of Bales calibre and what you don’t do in that instance as proven is take a scatter gun approach to recruitment. It failed here just as it did with Everton. As for VDV - he was finished, he was 31 and couldn’t finish a game and did absolutely nothing in his career onwards.
What did we achieve under AVB? Well just like the current tenure absolutely nothing on the silverware front.
Also should be mentioned that the lack of actual games being mentioned in this thread is a bit depressing
ochfacepalm:
ochfacepalm:Football that made your eyes bleed, a habit of getting smashed, and a fractured squad who didn’t want to play for each other. Other than that the fella was magic.
What?
This is what happened:
AVB took us from 4th to 5th and CL to no CL, then lost the dressing room and was fired. He failed.
Poch took us from 6th to 5th, to 3rd, to 2nd to 3rd.
AVB took us backwards. Poch took us forwards. It’s that simple.
He set us back years because in 2010 we were playing in the CL and the next time we got there was 2016.
Don’t worry about Vertonghen and Lamela and Lloris and Eriksen....I thought Levy only signed shit. Now they were all on AVB, who actually had a DoF? Jog on
The current tenure has achieved taking us from EL to CL regulars and in a position where certain fans are demanding we buy players so we can win the PL.
Didn’t see anyone talking titles under AVB did you?
Funny how you narrow it down to silverware for Poch, yet for AVB it was a success because we bought Eriksen and finished 5th.
I remember a great comment on RAWK of all places when Spurs fans were celebrating the record points tally trophy.
“Only Spurs could see 5th as a step up from 4th”
How true.
And besides the current tenure is a work in progress (if you know what progress means).
AVBs tenure ended in failure.
Maybe you thought it a great era? Which mak s it even more baffling why you are so critical of the current set up.
No he didn't because we didn't have CL due to Chelsea winning. What set us back was selling Modric and Bale and the retirement of King and VDV coming to the end of his career. That was the spine and driving force behind the 2010 CL season - any club will almost always take a step back unless they purchase ready made replacements which we cannot do. If you want to look it as in such a simplistic manner so be it but I also fully expect you to be calling for Poch to go when this current group of players starts to break up ( which is already starting) because we certainly don't possess the finances to purchase ready made replacements.
Do you even know what setting back years actually means? Look up Alan Sugar for that and the actual damage he did to the club. Finishing 5th and 6th which the club had previously finished 4-5-4-8 with the previous manager is not putting the club back years. And we know full well it didn't put us back years because following his tenure we finished 5th, 3rd, 2nd and 3rd. Can you please point me to these actual wilderness years? Which seasons were they?
I'm sorry but you must be confusing me with another poster - I'm not trying to claim AVB is a coach on a par with Poch my contention is with your assertion that he set us back years which is quite frankly absurd. The same absurdity is at play with Sherwood's tenure , I've seen the same said for what was a 5 month period.
I judge a manager on the players that they have available to them and the stability at the club at that time and Pochettinho has had the best Spurs squad in the whole PL era which has remained relatively untouched in that period. And yes I am critical because he hasn't been able to take advantage of that opportunity because we have nothing to show for it when it comes to silverware. AVB didn't have those luxuries - he inherited a team that was breaking and would need a period of transition which is why they shouldn't be compared or held to same standard. Becoming CL regulars accounts for little - all of the vaunted benefits have proven to be false. We haven't signed a single player that we couldn't have before(, if anything our transfer activity has been worse since then culminating in last season's shambolic window). And it hasn't enabled us to convince some of our major players such as Walker, Alderwield and Eriksen to stay or to sign new contracts. Poch has been at the club going on 5 years and is the longest serving PL manager so the notion that we are still work in progress is hilarious. It's Moyes/Everton syndrome all over again.
AVB was a fucking mess but I’m glad you enjoyed the ride.