"Sad and weird"
- A. Cunt. From Charlton
- A. Cunt. From Charlton
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I'm not sure football has changed as much as you think it has......it's natural to remember things in the past more fondly and forget some of the bad things
There is this theory that, because of our recent success, a new type of "fan" has been infecting White Hart Lane - a cardboard fan with lots of cash.
I'm not so sure.
I guess there is some evidence of this, but whether or not it's to the extent that it effects the atmosphere amongst a crowd of 30,000 is questionable.
Everyone can see the noise reduction coincides with our team's upturn in fortunes but that does not necessarily equal more plastic fans. I wonder if it is a bit more simple than that and we, simply, have more on the line just now.
It's easy to sing on regardless if we are mid-table, neither here-nor-there. If we lose as many as we win and we don't really compete for honours nor fight against relegation then our pride comes through in our voice.
Now though, there's real tension about the place, and the knock-on effect of that tension is we all clam up. it's a natural response. in 2009-10 we were doing better than we ever thought, so we were excited, and we got the bonus at the end of the season of qualifying for the UCL. Then we had a taste of that & we wanted more.
in 2010-11 we enjoyed the UCL, and our nights in Europe (where you could easily argue were the nights most exposed to cash-saturated, wannabe fans) had the best atmospheres at the Lane by far. In the League though, we were struggling and we could all see UCL qualification for the following season was touch-and-go.
We all held our collective breath in the League as we ran it close but, in Europe where we could all just let go and enjoy the experience, we all sang loud and proud even when we saw ourselves get smashed 5 nil on agg by Real Madrid in the QF.
It's similar this season. We're playing our best football for years & we're pushing near the top of the league again, but we all know Spurs too well and we all know that it can quickly and easily slip away from us. We all want to be back in the UCL and seeing our beloved club back dining at the top table, and that brings more tension.
What we need to be able to do is manifest that tension in pure noise. I guarantee that screaming at the top of your lungs is a great release, but just as a song or chant can be contagious and once started it can quickly reverberate around the stadium, so can the quiet tension that grips one corner of the Lane and spreads all over.
Who knows really, it's just a theory
We need a fukkin cliff!
I'm not so sure.
I guess there is some evidence of this, but whether or not it's to the extent that it effects the atmosphere amongst a crowd of 30,000 is questionable.
Everyone can see the noise reduction coincides with our team's upturn in fortunes but that does not necessarily equal more plastic fans. I wonder if it is a bit more simple than that and we, simply, have more on the line just now.
It's easy to sing on regardless if we are mid-table, neither here-nor-there. If we lose as many as we win and we don't really compete for honours nor fight against relegation then our pride comes through in our voice.
Now though, there's real tension about the place, and the knock-on effect of that tension is we all clam up. it's a natural response. in 2009-10 we were doing better than we ever thought, so we were excited, and we got the bonus at the end of the season of qualifying for the UCL. Then we had a taste of that & we wanted more.
in 2010-11 we enjoyed the UCL, and our nights in Europe (where you could easily argue were the nights most exposed to cash-saturated, wannabe fans) had the best atmospheres at the Lane by far. In the League though, we were struggling and we could all see UCL qualification for the following season was touch-and-go.
We all held our collective breath in the League as we ran it close but, in Europe where we could all just let go and enjoy the experience, we all sang loud and proud even when we saw ourselves get smashed 5 nil on agg by Real Madrid in the QF.
It's similar this season. We're playing our best football for years & we're pushing near the top of the league again, but we all know Spurs too well and we all know that it can quickly and easily slip away from us. We all want to be back in the UCL and seeing our beloved club back dining at the top table, and that brings more tension.
What we need to be able to do is manifest that tension in pure noise. I guarantee that screaming at the top of your lungs is a great release, but just as a song or chant can be contagious and once started it can quickly reverberate around the stadium, so can the quiet tension that grips one corner of the Lane and spreads all over.
Who knows really, it's just a theory
We need a fukkin cliff!
I sort of agree to an extent Bass, because I've been at games where the atmosphere has been shit and I've thought first-hand "it feels tense, that's why people aren't making as much atmosphere".
BUT, I've seen clubs fighting against oblivion, not even just relegation, but literally their club going out of business altogether, and their fans have made some of the best atmospheres I've ever witnessed in person. Now, if your club's very existence doesn't make you tense, I don't know what will. But still they made the noise.
Yet, when the tension happens to coincide with a team fighting for honours at the top of the Premier League, all of a sudden that tension stops people from making atmosphere. Seems too coincidental for me. I think if you can't make noise when you're playing Wigan or not winning 4-0 against Sunderland then you need to sort your shit out. That or just admit you aren't a noisy type supporter.
BUT, I've seen clubs fighting against oblivion, not even just relegation, but literally their club going out of business altogether, and their fans have made some of the best atmospheres I've ever witnessed in person. Now, if your club's very existence doesn't make you tense, I don't know what will. But still they made the noise.
Yet, when the tension happens to coincide with a team fighting for honours at the top of the Premier League, all of a sudden that tension stops people from making atmosphere. Seems too coincidental for me. I think if you can't make noise when you're playing Wigan or not winning 4-0 against Sunderland then you need to sort your shit out. That or just admit you aren't a noisy type supporter.
its not patronising, years ago, if you wanted to go to a game, with your mates, you could, and did. now days its a mare getting tickets and being able to afford them. i used to go most away games with the same people, often 2 coach loads and i knew 90% of the people on them. massive sing songs in varied pubs and clubs around the country, especially miners clubs up north. with the loyalty points and prices, its much harder to get that atmosphere these days, if it wasnt, there probably wouldnt have been a 'spurs ultras' .
He was referring to Blanchflower
Flav said:
I honestly don't know a single Spurs fan that doesn't go because of the cost of tickets - it's either lack of availability or just idleness
Blanchflower said:
Well I personally can't go as much as I'd like because of the cost. With the cost of the ticket, travel, food and beers you're looking at spending a oner, easily... I struggle to afford one game on the odd occasion, let alone a few times a month.
If the cost of tickets were more reasonable, it'd certainly help.
I agree with the above from Leroy , its become almost impossible to get hold of tickets at decent prices and because of that i cant get my loyalty points up and so on
And what has also changed a lot is the way you are allowed to express your support , last time i was at the Lane a steward threatened to kick me out because i was standing up (mind you i was in the last row so wasnt impeding the view of anybody) and screaming a bit too loud , wtf. English stewards a very strict about the chants you are allowed to sing (even if its just a bit of innocent banter) , you cant sing about Terry being a racist ? Isn't that just taking it way to far ?
I know they wanted to make it more a family game and kill off the violence but is it really necessary to take it to the extreme ?
Its become an increasingly corporate controlled game.
And what has also changed a lot is the way you are allowed to express your support , last time i was at the Lane a steward threatened to kick me out because i was standing up (mind you i was in the last row so wasnt impeding the view of anybody) and screaming a bit too loud , wtf. English stewards a very strict about the chants you are allowed to sing (even if its just a bit of innocent banter) , you cant sing about Terry being a racist ? Isn't that just taking it way to far ?
I know they wanted to make it more a family game and kill off the violence but is it really necessary to take it to the extreme ?
Its become an increasingly corporate controlled game.
Great write up Flav, i tried to post on this from my iphone via the app but it didnt like me doing that for some reason... :vdv:
About the atmosphere or lack of it at some games and the nostalgia about how great it was in the old days i put the blame in the majority on the all seat stadia now..
When i started going on my own (about 13 yrs old) in the early 80's all the noise came from the Shelf/shelf side and occasionally the park lane if this wasnt taken up by the away fans. all of this was lower terracing and the posh seats in the uppers never really made a peep - they werent for that type of fan. I could as a junior get in on the day paying 50p - i remember being gutted one season when it went up to £1.10 - that was a weeks paper round money then!
On Thursday we all stood shoulder to shoulder, singing, dancing having fun with the pressure mainly off and basically going back to the old terracing days. We really need to get back to that sort of arrangement somehow - in the new ground with any luck but can you see Levy etc issuing cheaper priced seats to encourage old school style supporters along unless its wednesday night Carling cup winter games?
Terracing is what we need - and more cowbell
About the atmosphere or lack of it at some games and the nostalgia about how great it was in the old days i put the blame in the majority on the all seat stadia now..
When i started going on my own (about 13 yrs old) in the early 80's all the noise came from the Shelf/shelf side and occasionally the park lane if this wasnt taken up by the away fans. all of this was lower terracing and the posh seats in the uppers never really made a peep - they werent for that type of fan. I could as a junior get in on the day paying 50p - i remember being gutted one season when it went up to £1.10 - that was a weeks paper round money then!
On Thursday we all stood shoulder to shoulder, singing, dancing having fun with the pressure mainly off and basically going back to the old terracing days. We really need to get back to that sort of arrangement somehow - in the new ground with any luck but can you see Levy etc issuing cheaper priced seats to encourage old school style supporters along unless its wednesday night Carling cup winter games?
Terracing is what we need - and more cowbell
i used to get £4 a week paper round wages, meant i could do a few away games as well. when i started going in mid 70's, it was 35 fucking pence to get in. 
[/quote]
£4 a week in the 70's? where the fuck did you deliver newspapers? begravia? or did you offer xtras to the french fella called himself arse or summink?
[/quote]£4 a week in the 70's? where the fuck did you deliver newspapers? begravia? or did you offer xtras to the french fella called himself arse or summink?
foxyf said:i used to get £4 a week paper round wages, meant i could do a few away games as well. when i started going in mid 70's, it was 35 fucking pence to get in.
£4 a week in the 70's? where the fuck did you deliver newspapers? begravia? or did you offer xtras to the french fella called himself arse or summink?
[/quote]nah, the 4 quid was late 70's early 80's got well paid cos no one wanted to deliver to the estates down caledonian road where i delivered. used to go with the supporters club away games, was really cheap with them and molly used to look after the kids really well.
mum used to give us 10 bob when i first started going, 5p there 5p back 5 p programme and 35 to get in, sorted, occasionally knocked the programme for a bag of chips in the topo gigio by the paxton.
Since getting a season ticket in the Shelf I have a much better view than when I was behind the goal. Because of this I get immersed in the game more. I still shout loads and join in with the Park Lane chants, but because I get to see more of the game then I did behind the goal I think that's one reason the Shelf isn't as loud as Park Lane (that and lots of annoying twunts that sing at all)
Blanchflower said:
The people I used to go with about 10 years ago have stopped attending matches because of cost. I've recently paid £51 for Woolwich and £59 for Chelsea. That's £110 for 3 hours 'entertainment'. Some of my mates have families, and can't justify spending that kind of cash when both games are live on tv
Yeah I also don't go because of the price.Blanchflower said:
The bigger games I can't get tickets for, and when I look at the smaller games in my head i'm thinking "is it really worth £XX for Bolton or West Brom when the atmosphere's gonna be shit anyway". A part-time job in a supermarket unfortunately means I don't have that kind of money to go every week (as much as i'd love to).
I mostly stick to away games now, atmosphere is far better and tickets are generally cheaper. A lot of the time Stoke away or wherever it may be is cheaper than going Spurs (even when you include the petrol, you lose the cost of the train to Northumberland Park and the beers).
Last home game I went to was Wigan, but I think that's the only one i've been to at WHL this year.