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Club Come here to laugh at Dippers

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I fundamentally dislike the franchise club, Woolwich, built on a history of post-WW1 corruption. Then I fundamentally dislike that plastic club, Chelsea. Just look at how it was founded with money and no fans. Its hardcore supporters enthusiastically embraced fascist racism in the 70s, something which has rumbled on into the present. And then it bought success through financial doping, acting as a money laundering facility and a resource for corrupt agents.

Then there's West Ham, another harbour for fascist racism from the 70s onwards, and a deeply dislikable club.

Then there's Man City, another financially doped club, through which has coursed sovereign oil wealth from a regime that represses democracy and rights, and engages in sportswashing. It has previous form in courting criminally dodgy political figures. The doping is compounded by a certain kind of arrogance and sense of impunity as evidenced by its flouting of FFP with associated party transactions.

So... can I summon up a similar level of dislike against Liverpool? They've built their success sustainably in a way that should be a model. No doping. They don't have a racism eating away at their heart. Corruption? Well, if anything, they were victims of a more or less systematic and corrupt government and police campaign to discredit Hillsborough claims.

Though I guiltily smile at the mischief of the 'sign on, sign on' parody, I can't dislike them because inner city Liverpool is associated with social exclusion and deprivation. I don't get that kind of hatred. The Harry Enfield 'loads-a-money' routine satirised horrible Chelsea fans who waved wads of cash at Liverpool fans. Would we want to associate ourselves with that detestable attitude?

Folks don't like the emotionalism of Liverpool fans. A bit of bitter resentment there. If we'd won as many top flight titles and European Cups as them, I'm quite sure we'd ramp up the emotion of glory glory... I hope so.

True, our 'firms' had a right old scrap back in the day, but there was something of a fighting pride between Spurs and Liverpool, even if it was ultimately pathetic. Then the great mediatised, commercial wave of the 90s and beyond swept all that away in favour of merchandise-based identity and a stoking up of rivalry by the new football media. Recently, and in the context of structural economic travails, social media has parasitised mainstream media and promoted hatred as the coinage of fandom. And that goes in all kinds of direction, including that of self-destructive impulses. Yes, we can hate ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I'll have a good laugh at their expense but I can't be a hater. There are other clubs that deserve our contempt.
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
I fundamentally dislike the franchise club, Woolwich, built on a history of post-WW1 corruption. Then I fundamentally dislike that plastic club, Chelsea. Just look at how it was founded with money and no fans. Its hardcore supporters enthusiastically embraced fascist racism in the 70s, something which has rumbled on into the present. And then it bought success through financial doping, acting as a money laundering facility and a resource for corrupt agents.

Then there's West Ham, another harbour for fascist racism from the 70s onwards, and a deeply dislikable club.

Then there's Man City, another financially doped club, through which has coursed sovereign oil wealth from a regime that represses democracy and rights, and engages in sportswashing. It has previous form in courting criminally dodgy political figures. The doping is compounded by a certain kind of arrogance and sense of impunity as evidenced by its flouting of FFP with associated party transactions.

So... can I summon up a similar level of dislike against Liverpool? They've built their success sustainably in a way that should be a model. No doping. They don't have a racism eating away at their heart. Corruption? Well, if anything, they were victims of a more or less systematic and corrupt government and police campaign to discredit Hillsborough claims.

Though I guiltily smile at the mischief of the 'sign on, sign on' parody, I can't dislike them because inner city Liverpool is associated with social exclusion and deprivation. I don't get that kind of hatred. The Harry Enfield 'loads-a-money' routine satirised horrible Chelsea fans who waved wads of cash at Liverpool fans. Would we want to associate ourselves with that detestable attitude?

Folks don't like the emotionalism of Liverpool fans. A bit of bitter resentment there. If we'd won as many top flight titles and European Cups as them, I'm quite sure we'd ramp up the emotion of glory glory... I hope so.

True, our 'firms' had a right old scrap back in the day, but there was something of a fighting pride between Spurs and Liverpool, even if it was ultimately pathetic. Then the great mediatised, commercial wave of the 90s and beyond swept all that away in favour of merchandise-based identity and a stoking up of rivalry by the new football media. Recently, and in the context of structural economic travails, social media has parasitised mainstream media and promoted hatred as the coinage of fandom. And that goes in all kinds of direction, including that of self-destructive impulses. Yes, we can hate ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I'll have a good laugh at their expense but I can't be a hater. There are other clubs that deserve our contempt.
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Couldn't agree more!
There's WAY worse out there than Liverpool....
and until WE are in a position to TRULY GENUINELY mount a title challenge, it's up to someone else (Namely Liverpool) to stop the usual horrible suspects!
 
1882 said:
Couldn't agree more!
There's WAY worse out there than Liverpool....
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Not if you go back just a few short years really. I've posted this before as the reason why I absolutely detest Liverpool.
Back when Rogers was their manager, the club went to New York on a tour. We all know that these tour matches are to garner more support, but the dippers took it to another level, visiting ground zero, then coming out and saying that they "identified" with New Yorkers because they'd had their own tragedy. Basically, using 9/11 as a vehicle to get supporters by playing on the tragedy of thousands killed in a terrorist attack, when their own "tragedy" was as a result of their own fans looking to get into a match without paying. Yes, the Police were culpable for their gross mismanagement, but it was thousands of dipper fans that did the actual damage.

If that wasn't enough to disgust, they then followed up by sending their youth to Auswitz and having them plaster the area with Liverpool branded candles.

They've tried to monetise tragedy, and they've piggy backed onto the tragedy of others to do so. As much as I dislike Utd, they've never tried to trade off Munich.

I went for dislike of the dippers, because of their domination through the General's years, to actively despising them for the above.

My dislike of Woolwich is borne out of tribal rivalry and their corrupt history. My distaste for Chelsea is because they show themselves as consistently despicable. West Ham I couldn't give a toss about, they're just there.

The dippers though sit at the top of the tree for my distaste, and are the nearest I can come to with "hate," purely because they've tried to monetise death. I'd be happy to see them disappear off the face of the earth alongside Chelsea.
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
I fundamentally dislike the franchise club, Woolwich, built on a history of post-WW1 corruption. Then I fundamentally dislike that plastic club, Chelsea. Just look at how it was founded with money and no fans. Its hardcore supporters enthusiastically embraced fascist racism in the 70s, something which has rumbled on into the present. And then it bought success through financial doping, acting as a money laundering facility and a resource for corrupt agents.

Then there's West Ham, another harbour for fascist racism from the 70s onwards, and a deeply dislikable club.

Then there's Man City, another financially doped club, through which has coursed sovereign oil wealth from a regime that represses democracy and rights, and engages in sportswashing. It has previous form in courting criminally dodgy political figures. The doping is compounded by a certain kind of arrogance and sense of impunity as evidenced by its flouting of FFP with associated party transactions.

So... can I summon up a similar level of dislike against Liverpool? They've built their success sustainably in a way that should be a model. No doping. They don't have a racism eating away at their heart. Corruption? Well, if anything, they were victims of a more or less systematic and corrupt government and police campaign to discredit Hillsborough claims.

Though I guiltily smile at the mischief of the 'sign on, sign on' parody, I can't dislike them because inner city Liverpool is associated with social exclusion and deprivation. I don't get that kind of hatred. The Harry Enfield 'loads-a-money' routine satirised horrible Chelsea fans who waved wads of cash at Liverpool fans. Would we want to associate ourselves with that detestable attitude?

Folks don't like the emotionalism of Liverpool fans. A bit of bitter resentment there. If we'd won as many top flight titles and European Cups as them, I'm quite sure we'd ramp up the emotion of glory glory... I hope so.

True, our 'firms' had a right old scrap back in the day, but there was something of a fighting pride between Spurs and Liverpool, even if it was ultimately pathetic. Then the great mediatised, commercial wave of the 90s and beyond swept all that away in favour of merchandise-based identity and a stoking up of rivalry by the new football media. Recently, and in the context of structural economic travails, social media has parasitised mainstream media and promoted hatred as the coinage of fandom. And that goes in all kinds of direction, including that of self-destructive impulses. Yes, we can hate ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I'll have a good laugh at their expense but I can't be a hater. There are other clubs that deserve our contempt.
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Their fans are the worst over here in Ireland. Worse than gooners. Fucking insufferable. Most hated club by all others id say
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
I fundamentally dislike the franchise club, Woolwich, built on a history of post-WW1 corruption. Then I fundamentally dislike that plastic club, Chelsea. Just look at how it was founded with money and no fans. Its hardcore supporters enthusiastically embraced fascist racism in the 70s, something which has rumbled on into the present. And then it bought success through financial doping, acting as a money laundering facility and a resource for corrupt agents.

Then there's West Ham, another harbour for fascist racism from the 70s onwards, and a deeply dislikable club.

Then there's Man City, another financially doped club, through which has coursed sovereign oil wealth from a regime that represses democracy and rights, and engages in sportswashing. It has previous form in courting criminally dodgy political figures. The doping is compounded by a certain kind of arrogance and sense of impunity as evidenced by its flouting of FFP with associated party transactions.

So... can I summon up a similar level of dislike against Liverpool? They've built their success sustainably in a way that should be a model. No doping. They don't have a racism eating away at their heart. Corruption? Well, if anything, they were victims of a more or less systematic and corrupt government and police campaign to discredit Hillsborough claims.

Though I guiltily smile at the mischief of the 'sign on, sign on' parody, I can't dislike them because inner city Liverpool is associated with social exclusion and deprivation. I don't get that kind of hatred. The Harry Enfield 'loads-a-money' routine satirised horrible Chelsea fans who waved wads of cash at Liverpool fans. Would we want to associate ourselves with that detestable attitude?

Folks don't like the emotionalism of Liverpool fans. A bit of bitter resentment there. If we'd won as many top flight titles and European Cups as them, I'm quite sure we'd ramp up the emotion of glory glory... I hope so.

True, our 'firms' had a right old scrap back in the day, but there was something of a fighting pride between Spurs and Liverpool, even if it was ultimately pathetic. Then the great mediatised, commercial wave of the 90s and beyond swept all that away in favour of merchandise-based identity and a stoking up of rivalry by the new football media. Recently, and in the context of structural economic travails, social media has parasitised mainstream media and promoted hatred as the coinage of fandom. And that goes in all kinds of direction, including that of self-destructive impulses. Yes, we can hate ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I'll have a good laugh at their expense but I can't be a hater. There are other clubs that deserve our contempt.
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They did not cover themselves in glory at Hysel. As a man with an Italian partner there's plenty to dislike. And your essay overlooked thd Gerrad assault and the handling of Patrice Evra being racially abused by that utter vermin Suarez. As Mrs P say they are merely the lesser of two evils
 
Shotgunofmichalebrow said:
They did not cover themselves in glory at Hysel. As a man with an Italian partner there's plenty to dislike. And your essay overlooked thd Gerrad assault and the handling of Patrice Evra being racially abused by that utter vermin Suarez. As Mrs P say they are merely the lesser of two evils
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Take your point. Of course, Heysel was partly Liverpool hoolies, but partly stadium neglect. And we've had bad hoolies, not least those who trashed Rotterdam and likely cost us a UEFA Cup.

We've also had some badly behaved players, as in most clubs. I'm not sure that these incidents justify an unalloyed hatred.
 
Ionman34 said:
Not if you go back just a few short years really. I've posted this before as the reason why I absolutely detest Liverpool.
Back when Rogers was their manager, the club went to New York on a tour. We all know that these tour matches are to garner more support, but the dippers took it to another level, visiting ground zero, then coming out and saying that they "identified" with New Yorkers because they'd had their own tragedy. Basically, using 9/11 as a vehicle to get supporters by playing on the tragedy of thousands killed in a terrorist attack, when their own "tragedy" was as a result of their own fans looking to get into a match without paying. Yes, the Police were culpable for their gross mismanagement, but it was thousands of dipper fans that did the actual damage.

If that wasn't enough to disgust, they then followed up by sending their youth to Auswitz and having them plaster the area with Liverpool branded candles.

They've tried to monetise tragedy, and they've piggy backed onto the tragedy of others to do so. As much as I dislike Utd, they've never tried to trade off Munich.

I went for dislike of the dippers, because of their domination through the General's years, to actively despising them for the above.

My dislike of Woolwich is borne out of tribal rivalry and their corrupt history. My distaste for Chelsea is because they show themselves as consistently despicable. West Ham I couldn't give a toss about, they're just there.

The dippers though sit at the top of the tree for my distaste, and are the nearest I can come to with "hate," purely because they've tried to monetise death. I'd be happy to see them disappear off the face of the earth alongside Chelsea.
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Fair enough. But is there any evidence that the wider supporter base or the club itself – rather than a few embarrassing fans – were attempting contemptibly to trade off 9/11 or Auschwitz?

I do think the nasty government and media attempts to blame the fans for Hillsborough have been exposed by subsequent investigations/inquiries as entirely unjustified. There were warnings (from a previous Spurs match there when there was a dangerous crush), poor policing and stewarding (opening the gate by the turnstiles to aggravate the crush), and a failure to open the pitchside fence until it was too late. The cover-up was disgraceful.
 
Go on son said:
Their fans are the worst over here in Ireland. Worse than gooners. Fucking insufferable. Most hated club by all others id say
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Thanks. I should know more about Ireland and what you say. It's interesting because of the big historical connection between Ireland and Liverpool. Plastic paddy scousers?

In any case, I don't get the impression that Liverpool is the most hated club on the other side of the Irish Sea. If anything, the prize of the most hated has to go to Woolwich, despised by most for nearly a century.
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
I fundamentally dislike the franchise club, Woolwich, built on a history of post-WW1 corruption. Then I fundamentally dislike that plastic club, Chelsea. Just look at how it was founded with money and no fans. Its hardcore supporters enthusiastically embraced fascist racism in the 70s, something which has rumbled on into the present. And then it bought success through financial doping, acting as a money laundering facility and a resource for corrupt agents.

Then there's West Ham, another harbour for fascist racism from the 70s onwards, and a deeply dislikable club.

Then there's Man City, another financially doped club, through which has coursed sovereign oil wealth from a regime that represses democracy and rights, and engages in sportswashing. It has previous form in courting criminally dodgy political figures. The doping is compounded by a certain kind of arrogance and sense of impunity as evidenced by its flouting of FFP with associated party transactions.

So... can I summon up a similar level of dislike against Liverpool? They've built their success sustainably in a way that should be a model. No doping. They don't have a racism eating away at their heart. Corruption? Well, if anything, they were victims of a more or less systematic and corrupt government and police campaign to discredit Hillsborough claims.

Though I guiltily smile at the mischief of the 'sign on, sign on' parody, I can't dislike them because inner city Liverpool is associated with social exclusion and deprivation. I don't get that kind of hatred. The Harry Enfield 'loads-a-money' routine satirised horrible Chelsea fans who waved wads of cash at Liverpool fans. Would we want to associate ourselves with that detestable attitude?

Folks don't like the emotionalism of Liverpool fans. A bit of bitter resentment there. If we'd won as many top flight titles and European Cups as them, I'm quite sure we'd ramp up the emotion of glory glory... I hope so.

True, our 'firms' had a right old scrap back in the day, but there was something of a fighting pride between Spurs and Liverpool, even if it was ultimately pathetic. Then the great mediatised, commercial wave of the 90s and beyond swept all that away in favour of merchandise-based identity and a stoking up of rivalry by the new football media. Recently, and in the context of structural economic travails, social media has parasitised mainstream media and promoted hatred as the coinage of fandom. And that goes in all kinds of direction, including that of self-destructive impulses. Yes, we can hate ourselves.

Don't get me wrong, I'll have a good laugh at their expense but I can't be a hater. There are other clubs that deserve our contempt.
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Nah, they’re a bunch of cunts and I despise them completely. Cunt players, cunt fans, cunt pundits, cunt managers.

Just because I hate other teams too, I’ve still got plenty left for this shower of arseholes.
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
Fair enough. But is there any evidence that the wider supporter base or the club itself – rather than a few embarrassing fans – were attempting contemptibly to trade off 9/11 or Auschwitz?
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It was the club itself, not the fans. The evidence is out there in footage from that time and the media reports of both.
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
I do think the nasty government and media attempts to blame the fans for Hillsborough have been exposed by subsequent investigations/inquiries as entirely unjustified. There were warnings (from a previous Spurs match there when there was a dangerous crush), poor policing and stewarding (opening the gate by the turnstiles to aggravate the crush), and a failure to open the pitchside fence until it was too late. The cover-up was disgraceful.
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I don't and won't argue against that, but the fundamental truth here is that the crush happened because you had thousands trying to get into a game without paying. Horrendously mismanaged, but to contemplate that dippers were "innocent" of any wrongdoing here is farcical. No freeloaders, no crush.

The long and the short of it is that no dipper fans died from a terrorist attack, or from an evil regime committing genocide, yet they, the club, have tried to piggyback onto those tragedies in order to tap into the emotional pain suffered by thousands/millions to monetise it.

There isn't a single club in World Football, to my knowledge, that's ever sunk that low to make money.
 
Ionman34 said:
It was the club itself, not the fans. The evidence is out there in footage from that time and the media reports of both.

I don't and won't argue against that, but the fundamental truth here is that the crush happened because you had thousands trying to get into a game without paying. Horrendously mismanaged, but to contemplate that dippers were "innocent" of any wrongdoing here is farcical. No freeloaders, no crush.

The long and the short of it is that no dipper fans died from a terrorist attack, or from an evil regime committing genocide, yet they, the club, have tried to piggyback onto those tragedies in order to tap into the emotional pain suffered by thousands/millions to monetise it.

There isn't a single club in World Football, to my knowledge, that's ever sunk that low to make money.
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I've tried to find stuff about an official thing related to Auschwitz, but can't locate it. In principle, there might not be anything wrong with it, but, if as you say, there was an attempt to make money out of it, then that's another thing.

They have marked Holocaust Memorial Day, but so have we. Neither they nor we have tried to make money from it.

The club commemorated the 10th anniversary of 9/11, but I can't see how they made money out of it.

On Hillsborough, no doubt late fans tried to rush turnstiles, and this happened at other grounds. But it was extremely poor policing (and stewarding), which opened the gate by the turnstiles and failed to respond to an obviously dangerous crush at the Leppings Lane end.

This is the conclusion of the final inquiry.
 
Play Up Spurs!!!! said:
Thanks. I should know more about Ireland and what you say. It's interesting because of the big historical connection between Ireland and Liverpool. Plastic paddy scousers?

In any case, I don't get the impression that Liverpool is the most hated club on the other side of the Irish Sea. If anything, the prize of the most hated has to go to Woolwich, despised by most for nearly a century.
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Not anywhere close. Although its turning towards woolwich, by all other supporters liverpool are the most hated. Because of their supporters
 
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