Management ENIC

[Kane you believe it]

Stadium walkout would be interesting , if we are 2 nil down on 23 mins it will be well supported. If unlikely as it might seem we are 2 nil up nobody will leave their seat . Well I will I need a piss every 23 minutes these days but I will be back by minute 26

Unless Mrs Perryman can pick me up a packet of Always Discreet Boutique next time she is in Boots to get some Nurofen

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Think the comment section had a good suggestion of a late walk in.

Then the commentary and pundits can focus on it early doors and during half time.

Then the fans paying their hard earned money can also enter at 15 or 20 mins to relax into the game.

 

[spurs_1961]

Yes, we are. Woolwich had years of being utter shit before they turned it around, so why wouldn't we face the same? We had our little good period under Pochettino. Everything at the club right now is a mess and will take years to fix without a massive cash injection, which we will not get. In fact we will scale all that down with no European football.

We may well recover in 5-6 years, but the overwhelming likelihood is we're staring down a dark period post Kane.

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Our ceiling is higher than le arse. Chelsea and le arse will not be able to touch us with our money making potential in the future. We are moving up the rich list year on year. It's only a matter of time where this money is put into the squad and we are able to spend 150 to 200 million every transfer window. I am so optimistic for the future. It was about building the foundations for future success. We will reap the fruits and rewards of the hard work of our owners in the coming years, you will see.

 

[LeParisien]

I don't disagree with it, I just know where we're headed. You can quote me on it. I've been saying it even when we were third because it was so obvious based on our actual quality of football. City lost these games due to bad luck whilst playing cohesively. If anything we were the luckiest team on the planet the week before to get 3 points vs Brighton. The way we play football will not get us positive results across a season.

Man Utd underperform? They appointed a new manager, won a cup, are deep in to the knockouts of two other cups, and are top 4 playing mostly cohesive football. Chelsea & Liverpool yes, they're in a mini-crisis, but these clubs have had very recent success and this season is more likely to be a blip. Our blip was finishing 4th under Conte, otherwise we're hovering round 6th/7th post-Poch. Same this season, you'll see.

Huh? So what, we need to wait for another decade to decide whether Levy goes or not? The football decisions have been bad for years now. He's made decisions which have led to frauds leading the football side of the club, so I highly doubt we're seeing building blocks for the future put in. Everything is a fucking mess mate, respectfully.

You won't find me saying that in terms of pure league performance, if we discount cups entirely, Levy/ENIC have over-performed in the past. But the methods they used to do so won't work in the current environment and they haven't kept pace with more data heavy, analytical clubs who are now punching far more above their weight than we are.

We used to be ahead of the curve in several departments - we're now behind. How we appoint managers, how we sign players, how we run the academy. It's all outdated & chaotic. We aren't remotely cohesive or progressive. Our manager search is once again a mess, to go with the mess of the last one, and the joke of appointing Jose before that.

The party is over under ENIC. I'm not blind and won't sit here and say they haven't done good things for the club, but I have zero faith whatsoever we will return to looking competently ran. There's no signs of that change at all. Maybe if I see some I'll become more patient, but right now its the same shit, different year. It'll only be more of the same next season.

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Above we saw how extreme fan anger (in April 2021 and later) has given way to something positive for Woolwich very quickly and under the same owners. I think we can agree on that?

So a moments thought tells us the same might be possible for us. Even when problems seem insurmountable, football moves very quickly.

We went though 10 years of meeting or exceeding expected league finishes under ENIC. For most of that time people were still highly critical. People in this thread have openly admitted that over the last few pages. So excellent football and great results still aren’t enough to protect Levy from criticism!

Remember that Kroenke did not have that track record at Woolwich.

Results and performances have clearly been bad lately. We all agree on that. It’s worth remembering that our league finishes post Poch have been 4-6-7-4. So even in this bad run we still have an average league position of 5th which is exactly where we should be (and ahead of Woolwich!).

The biggest complaints should really be around the style of play and the managerial appointments which have been really bad. I’ve been critical of Levy for those things. It’s a serious failure of leadership.

But where we differ is that you say there is zero chance of this being turned around. For me that’s an emotional reaction that doesn’t fit with reality. If the next managerial appointment is a progressive appointment who trusts young players then we will quickly see an improvement in playing style and results.

Football moves incredibly quickly

 

[Deuterz]

Above we saw how extreme fan anger (in April 2021 and later) has given way to something positive for Woolwich very quickly and under the same owners. I think we can agree on that?

So a moments thought tells us the same might be possible for us. Even when problems seem insurmountable, football moves very quickly.

We went though 10 years of meeting or exceeding expected league finishes under ENIC. For most of that time people were still highly critical. People in this thread have openly admitted that over the last few pages. So excellent football and great results still aren’t enough to protect Levy from criticism!

Remember that Kroenke did not have that track record at Woolwich.

Results and performances have clearly been bad lately. We all agree on that. It’s worth remembering that our league finishes post Poch have been 4-6-7-4. So even in this bad run we still have an average league position of 5th which is exactly where we should be (and ahead of Woolwich!).

The biggest complaints should really be around the style of play and the managerial appointments which have been really bad. I’ve been critical of Levy for those things. It’s a serious failure of leadership.

But where we differ is that you say there is zero chance of this being turned around. For me that’s an emotional reaction that doesn’t fit with reality. If the next managerial appointment is a progressive appointment who trusts young players then we will quickly see an improvement in playing style and results.

Football moves incredibly quickly

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Kroenke had shit league results but won multiple FA cups. The problem is that you view success as purely sustained league finishes. Tell that to the Champions Leagues Chelsea & Liverpool won whilst not doing particularly well in the league. The league is only one marker of success.

But yes, we do disagree. And I will be proven correct, as I was about this season. It's only a matter of time till we see that. But I doubt even if we see the same thing for the next 2-3 seasons that your opinion will shift, as you will still argue that the previous decade was sustained improvement so we should stick with ENIC.

So all the circular debates/arguments are pointless: you will never shift from this pro-ENIC position. Whereas if we legitimately see us turn all this round in the next 2-3 years I will happily credit them, even if we don't win anything.

A progressive managerial appointment isn't fixing this mess. It'll help make it more entertaining, but the squad is inherently flawed. The two players who have carried it for years (Son & Kane) are declining and/or leaving. Good luck funding their replacements.

 

[skywalker68]

I must admit as much as I am Levy Out i can’t get wound up to much by the Levy In brigade . Life’s to short , at least it seems that way to me now I’m 61. People are entitled to have an opposing view


Also and perhaps more to the point ENIC are going nowhere no matter how much I loathe them owning the club . So to get wound up over something that you can have no control over changing will just raise my blood pressure for no upside

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Unfortunately no, they are not leaving, at least not for some considerable time.
In the meantime it's, business as usual, waiting, hoping for a mystery new owner to appear.

 

[LeParisien]

Kroenke had shit league results but won multiple FA cups. The problem is that you view success as purely sustained league finishes. Tell that to the Champions Leagues Chelsea & Liverpool won whilst not doing particularly well in the league. The league is only one marker of success.

But yes, we do disagree. And I will be proven correct, as I was about this season. It's only a matter of time till we see that. But I doubt even if we see the same thing for the next 2-3 seasons that your opinion will shift, as you will still argue that the previous decade was sustained improvement so we should stick with ENIC.

So all the circular debates/arguments are pointless: you will never shift from this pro-ENIC position. Whereas if we legitimately see us turn all this round in the next 2-3 years I will happily credit them, even if we don't win anything.

A progressive managerial appointment isn't fixing this mess. It'll help make it more entertaining, but the squad is inherently flawed. The two players who have carried it for years (Son & Kane) are declining and/or leaving. Good luck funding their replacements.

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The reason league finishes are better than cup runs is mostly explained here:

Luck does play a significant role. That’s a factual statement. There is the luck of draw (both the teams and whether you’re at home), whether you are playing a team that happens to be in or out of form, the role luck plays in injuries and the role luck plays in a low-scoring one-off game game like a cup competition. There’s lots of luck involved.

Luck plays far less of a role in a league format because:
1) There are a larger number of games
2) Everyone plays the same teams home and away

However some of the luck factors above apply to the league too (I’m sure you can pick them out). If you can play Liverpool and Chelsea during weak moments this season, or Brentford after Toney’s ban then you have advantages. Not likely to be huge but can it be worth 3-5 points? Easily.

Also refereeing decisions are overplayed but if the referee doesn’t give that ridiculous penalty against Southampton then imagine how our season could be different. Two more points and conte almost certainly still at the club.

To deny luck plays a significant role is just wrong.

However luck is only one piece of the puzzle. There are other more significant factors. But at the margins, luck can explain results - particularly if the over performance occurs in just ONE season. All your examples of smaller teams doing well occur in one season. If a team consistently performs better than expected over multiple seasons then it’s no longer luck - we need to look for alternative explanations.

To tie all this together. Is there a team that has consistently overachieved in the league (the most reliable measure of performance, least prone to luck)?

Cough cough

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Our champions league run is a great example of luck in the cups. If we had beaten Liverpool then we would have won the biggest prize in club football … with a LOT of luck. And winks and Sissoko in midfield. In the end we lost thanks to an unlucky penalty call in the final. In the end Liverpool won with a lot of luck (in at least the semifinal and final).

Nobody has ever said winning a cup is not a great moment for fans though.

Only sustained overachievement is worthy of serious consideration. For example, Real Madrid have won half the champions leagues in the past decade - that is an incredible achievement.

I have been very clear about my criticisms of Levy and I have been very clear about what it would take to be ENIC out. I cannot really be any clearer about either.

 

[Rafa]

Yes, we are. Woolwich had years of being utter shit before they turned it around, so why wouldn't we face the same? We had our little good period under Pochettino. Everything at the club right now is a mess and will take years to fix without a massive cash injection, which we will not get. In fact we will scale all that down with no European football.

We may well recover in 5-6 years, but the overwhelming likelihood is we're staring down a dark period post Kane.

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I’ve been hearing that we’re headed for midtable mediocrity for years and it still hasn’t happened yet.

 

[Archie]

You are an example of the root of the issue. You would love a stadium walk out. I can hear it in the tone of your message. You sound like some evil movie villain rubbing your hands together. Do you know the hit on the club profits that walkouts and the damage to the club reputation it would bring. You really think this will improve things. You care nothing for the repercussions this would bring. Levy got us one of the best stadiums in the world. The stadium is a statement and provides an image to others. Other clubs are jealous of our stadium. I bet you give levy and Enic no credit whatsoever. Support the club and players no matter what is what a real fan's role and responsibilities of a supporter should be. You can always support another club if you are not happy.

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I give Levy and Enic credit for the stadium and training ground, however they get no credit whatsoever for the football side of things (the thing there suppose to care most about) They've made a pigs ear of it
firing Jol at half time.
Interfering in transfers,
Asking stupid money for unwanted players
Sacking Poch for telling them we need a painful rebuild
Not backing managers properly
Hiring a piss poor scouting team
Giving himself several pay rises
And many many more!!!

Not forgetting the crowning turd in the water closet
1 trophy in 23 years...
And still mugs on here support them

 

[LeParisien]

I give Levy and Enic credit for the stadium and training ground, however they get no credit whatsoever for the football side of things (the thing there suppose to care most about) They've made a pigs ear of it
firing Jol at half time.
Interfering in transfers,
Asking stupid money for unwanted players
Sacking Poch for telling them we need a painful rebuild
Not backing managers properly
Hiring a piss poor scouting team
Giving himself several pay rises
And many many more!!!

Not forgetting the crowning turd in the water closet
1 trophy in 23 years...
And still mugs on here support them

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You would be great on TottenhamFanTV too.

You’d be our Ty.

 

[Ed Vanderlay]

You are an example of the root of the issue. You would love a stadium walk out. I can hear it in the tone of your message. You sound like some evil movie villain rubbing your hands together. Do you know the hit on the club profits that walkouts and the damage to the club reputation it would bring. You really think this will improve things. You care nothing for the repercussions this would bring. Levy got us one of the best stadiums in the world. The stadium is a statement and provides an image to others. Other clubs are jealous of our stadium. I bet you give levy and Enic no credit whatsoever. Support the club and players no matter what is what a real fan's role and responsibilities of a supporter should be. You can always support another club if you are not happy.

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You seem to have taken my comment as very serious despite the Mrs P comment . I was simply pointing out that it’s success or failure would depend on the score at the time

Do I want ENIC , out very much so though

 

[Ed Vanderlay]

You would be great on TottenhamFanTV too.

You’d be our Ty.

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Not sure that anything he said is a lie, maybe he sacked Poch for slightly different reasons , but the root cause of the sacking was Poch‘s dissatisfaction over the rebuild

 

[Honest John]

And I imagine stevee AberdeenYid and Get in! will still be coming in here after every matchweek where we get slapped up by some team with 1/4 of our resources & telling everyone they can't expect to be City, that we're better than we were under Sugar, and that the fans are just entitled.

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When the yearly profit margins and growth charts are revealed

 

[Deuterz]

I’ve been hearing that we’re headed for midtable mediocrity for years and it still hasn’t happened yet.

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We won't be proper mid table. We'll hover between 6th/7th/8th for a while. This isn't even a prediction, its a current reality. Prior to last seasons 4th placed finish we finished 6th and 7th respectively. In the 6th placed finish we were 3 points ahead of 8th place. In the 7th placed season we were 3 points ahead of Everton who were 10th. This season we're on course to be 7th or 6th at best, and we will be 3-4 points ahead of 8th.

We are INCREDIBLY close to upper mid table and mostly have been for years. It's actually delusional to think dropping there isn't a possibility as it would only take a small drop off. If we've been hovering on the edge of 8th/9th WITH prime Kane & Son, why is it impossible to drop there when we don't have them at all?

Answer: It isn't.

 

[LeParisien]

Not sure that anything he said is a lie, maybe he sacked Poch for slightly different reasons , but the root cause of the sacking was Poch‘s dissatisfaction over the rebuild

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First there’s a lot of speculation in the post.

But mostly it’s the over dramatic and one-sided take. To give Levy no credit on the football side is not a serious position. You can see that, no?

 

[spurs_1961]

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This is so pathetic and uncalled for. This is not helping anyone but further dividing us. I hope the club are all over this and have systems in place to counter this. This sort of behaviour is what can start riots and put fans in danger. It is revolting and sick.

 

[Honest John]

I’ve been hearing that we’re headed for midtable mediocrity for years and it still hasn’t happened yet.

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That's funny. I've been hearing for years the New stadium would see us finally start winning silverware again and that hasn't happened either.

 

[FightingIllini]

Well, I’m pretty pessimistic as we’re a one dimensional show pony, and the pony will be leaving either this Summer or next.

I don’t think we have the ability to successfully replace Harry Kane’s goals and assists and we’re not very good at defending.

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Replacing Kane would take aggressive and decisive transfer market investment, calculated with a vision of the entire squad and way of playing that's intelligently thought out and diligently and patiently followed.

We're ten million miles from being any part of that sentence. Night and day. Kane probably wouldn't be leaving in the first place if that described our club.

 

[Honest John]

Every time the ENIC out sentiment gets ramped up a notch a few new random Levy fanatics start appearing in this thread.
Would any of them like to justify the recent appointment of 2 serial winning managers, only for both those managers to belly flop for the first and only time in their careers working for Daniel Levy?
Or his decision to Sack Conte, and play out the remainder of the season with his assistant?

 

[spurs_1961]

I give Levy and Enic credit for the stadium and training ground, however they get no credit whatsoever for the football side of things (the thing there suppose to care most about) They've made a pigs ear of it
firing Jol at half time.
Interfering in transfers,
Asking stupid money for unwanted players
Sacking Poch for telling them we need a painful rebuild
Not backing managers properly
Hiring a piss poor scouting team
Giving himself several pay rises
And many many more!!!

Not forgetting the crowning turd in the water closet
1 trophy in 23 years...
And still mugs on here support them

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They have made some mistakes but the overall quality of our team is improving. Kulu, bentacur, romero, Pedro porro and richarlison have improved the team. It can take time. We have made some bad buys but enic and levy are trying to put things right. Levy wants spurs to succeed long term. It is not a short term project like others are doing. Building a massive foundation for success. Levy does not like to be conned by other clubs and I respect that. You and others demands is what makes us waste 60 million odd on ndombele. You can't have it both ways. Success does not occur overnight. Other clubs like Chelsea and Liverpool are struggling as well but we are in a better position than them at the moment. You are far too spoilt. I supported spurs during times much worse than this.

 

[Cranston]

I’ve been hearing that we’re headed for midtable mediocrity for years and it still hasn’t happened yet.

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Who’s replacing Kane’s goals?

That’s a genuine question. Not confrontational. Let’s be conservative and say 25, with 5 assists per year?

Is the assumption that’s he just going to resign? Or Richarlison is going to step up?

We’ve managed to secure Top 4 whilst having the greatest striker of the generation at our disposal.