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Management ENIC

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ENIC In or ENIC Out

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    209
Shadydan said:
We've reached this stage of the transfer window

Sad Baby GIF
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Remember this
From, like...around 10 days ago

Shadydan said:
God also loves Daniel Levy, the man is absolutely cooking up a storm this Summer don't you think?
He's actually smashed it out the park this year actually, you lot were constantly. On at him to sack Ange, what happens he keeps him around and we win a trophy - something you and your ilk were adamant that we would never do under this regime ever again.
And now this Summer he is absolutely cooking, realising the error of his ways putting us folk to shame, you gotta love the man, truly!
Levy is king! 👑😍
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Tottenham Massive said:
The Levy IN brigade ⬇️

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🎶daniel levy....we want you to stay
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Imagine shitting on the club every moment you get and still having the gall to accuse the people who actually support the club of being fans of another club.

You realise that the shit you come up with is very similar copy to what they'll be saying about us on the shed end or gooner forums?
 
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CJJ said:
Imagine shitting on the club every moment you get and still having the gall to accuse the people who actually support the club of being fans of another club.

You realise that the shit you come up with is very similar copy to what they'll be saying about us on the shed end or gooner forums?
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That's pretty much it. I think what's really going on is they spend their lives listening to Goons and Chavs taking the piss out of Spurs, and they internalize it. Like an abuse victim they start to agree with their abusers and take on their mindset.

That's why they get so mad at Levy; they blame him for not solving their personal lives with an FA Cup win.
 
Datzlo said:
That's pretty much it. I think what's really going on is they spend their lives listening to Goons and Chavs taking the piss out of Spurs, and they internalize it. Like an abuse victim they start to agree with their abusers and take on their mindset.

That's why they get so mad at Levy; they blame him for not solving their personal lives with an FA Cup win.
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What passes me by is the whole kind of point of the argument, really.

If we were some super-successful club in the 90s, I would totally get the ire. I don't think it would be fully valid, but I would get it. Like the demise of Man Utd under the Glazers, or when ITV/Kronke/Usmanov bought into Woolwich, or Randy Lerner with Villa or something.
But, for one point, Spurs haven't really ever been consistent in the league, and have had a spotty history of competing for titles. Draw a line at 1963, and our highest league finish came under this ownership. In those 62 seasons, we've finished in the top 3 eight times, and 3 of those were under this period of ownership. In the first 9 years of the PL, prior to ENIC, our highest finish was 7th. In the last 20 seasons, we've finished 7th or above in 16 of them. We've seen the club build a totally new world class stadium and training ground. Quite possibly the only club that has managed to do that without being totally broke and falling away in the league at the same time. An unprecedented Champions League final (where at the start of the century, even being in a Europe competition was a distant dream). Several cup finals. "But we haven't won anything".
Now, despite a poor league season, we finally win a European competition.
"We don't have a net spent" turns into over half a billion net spend. "But wages" is next.

What is the argument? That the ownership haven't managed to turn the club into perennial trophy winners? Where's the precedent for that?

Why is it sneered on to enjoy supporting the club and to be happy for progress, and how is it somehow the high ground to be a pessimistic miserable cunt about absolutely every facet of the team, whilst praising rival teams for a blinkered view of what they do. Whinging about the club making 'excuses', whilst simultaneously moving the bar higher and making excuses as to why the owner isn't doing enough, or the team isn't good enough.
But, of course, not even stopping there - baiting and taunting people who aren't equally negative, and accusing them of being the rival fans - despite being able to perfectly camouflage their posts in kneesupmotherbrown or shedend.
 
LeParisien said:
We both know that’s a distinction without a difference.
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Not sure you're using that idiom correctly. Don't you mean there IS a big difference?

Anyway, as we enter a world where Tottenham Hotspur Stadium isn't the newest facility in the PL/CL anymore (which will only further continue, such is the passage of time) our financial position becomes less and less unique.

Other clubs are taking advantage of infrastructure spending being exempt from PSR/FFP. We are not.
 
FightingIllini said:
Not sure you're using that idiom correctly. Don't you mean there IS a big difference?

Anyway, as we enter a world where Tottenham Hotspur Stadium isn't the newest facility in the PL/CL anymore (which will only further continue, such is the passage of time) our financial position becomes less and less unique.

Other clubs are taking advantage of infrastructure spending being exempt from PSR/FFP. We are not.
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Maybe I misunderstood your point. Or you misunderstood mine.

The point is that we have invested significantly in our stadium. If you add the percentage of revenue spent on infrastructure to the wages then you would not see a significant difference woth the other clubs.

We will always take a long term view with Levy at the helm and that is worth celebrating.
 
CJJ said:
What passes me by is the whole kind of point of the argument, really.

If we were some super-successful club in the 90s, I would totally get the ire. I don't think it would be fully valid, but I would get it. Like the demise of Man Utd under the Glazers, or when ITV/Kronke/Usmanov bought into Woolwich, or Randy Lerner with Villa or something.
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I think it's more that, at least according to the ENIC Out crowd on the forum I generally frequent, that they feel we were a super-successful club in the 80s, not the 90s, and that this was a golden hey-day that Levy can't hold a candle to.

But the 80s weren't that great either, tbh. We came 3rd three times, which isn't awful, but it isn't a legacy of magnificence either, and we came 13th and 14th during that decade also. Of course, our signature successes came in the cups, but even then it's a little sketch when you look at it:

In 1981 we needed a replay to beat 12th place Manchester City in the final, but then again we came 10th that year, so maybe it was evenly matched. The leauge of course was won by Aston Villa, who then won the European Cup the following season.

In 1982 we needed a replay again, but this time against 2nd Division's QPR. 1-0 to the Tottenham, which is a little less impressive than the 3-1 Liverpool beat us with in the League Cup final, but then again they won the league while we came 4th.

In 1984 we fell to 8th in the league, but did manage to win the UEFA Cup, and much enjoyment was had, which was good because we were out of the FA Cup by the 4th Round; a common theme for us during the 80s. In fact, aside from losing to Coventry in 87, we didn't even so much as reach a quarter final in the competition for the rest of the decade, although we did manage another semi in the LC.

So three or four good seasons, but none of them particularly amazing, and the rest was fill with disappointment. Maybe that's why attendance figures weren't great in the 80s. Definitely some parts to be proud of, but otherwise we were little more than a 'good team' during this period.

But you just watch the complaints come hurling in now that I'm denigrating our illustrious past, "call yourself a Spurs fan" etc, without them once considering how juicy the irony is...

CJJ said:
Why is it sneered on to enjoy supporting the club and to be happy for progress, and how is it somehow the high ground to be a pessimistic miserable cunt about absolutely every facet of the team, whilst praising rival teams for a blinkered view of what they do. Whinging about the club making 'excuses', whilst simultaneously moving the bar higher and making excuses as to why the owner isn't doing enough, or the team isn't good enough.

But, of course, not even stopping there - baiting and taunting people who aren't equally negative, and accusing them of being the rival fans - despite being able to perfectly camouflage their posts in kneesupmotherbrown or shedend.
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Because again, they've internalized the hatred of others. Spurs became such a laughing stock in the 90s that we've never recovered, and probably the last time the old heads felt able to be proud of Tottenham was in the 80s. They yearn for the FA Cup, to redeem their broken hearts from decades ago, and to soothe the wounds of rival fans taking the piss out of our recent trophy cabinet.

They're not looking at the matter and considering the overrall health of the club and its place within the world of football. They're looking at it through the lens of wearing the shirt in London etc, and not getting wound up over it. Until Levy makes them whole again, until Levy gives them back their pride in winning the FA Cup, nothing is ever good enough and anyone who disagrees is a traitor to the God It Sucks To Be A Spurs Fan brigade.

At least, that's what I assume. I never hear much better arguments to persuade me otherwise.
 
Datzlo said:
I think it's more that, at least according to the ENIC Out crowd on the forum I generally frequent, that they feel we were a super-successful club in the 80s, not the 90s, and that this was a golden hey-day that Levy can't hold a candle to.

But the 80s weren't that great either, tbh. We came 3rd three times, which isn't awful, but it isn't a legacy of magnificence either, and we came 13th and 14th during that decade also. Of course, our signature successes came in the cups, but even then it's a little sketch when you look at it:

In 1981 we needed a replay to beat 12th place Manchester City in the final, but then again we came 10th that year, so maybe it was evenly matched. The leauge of course was won by Aston Villa, who then won the European Cup the following season.

In 1982 we needed a replay again, but this time against 2nd Division's QPR. 1-0 to the Tottenham, which is a little less impressive than the 3-1 Liverpool beat us with in the League Cup final, but then again they won the league while we came 4th.

In 1984 we fell to 8th in the league, but did manage to win the UEFA Cup, and much enjoyment was had, which was good because we were out of the FA Cup by the 4th Round; a common theme for us during the 80s. In fact, aside from losing to Coventry in 87, we didn't even so much as reach a quarter final in the competition for the rest of the decade, although we did manage another semi in the LC.

So three or four good seasons, but none of them particularly amazing, and the rest was fill with disappointment. Maybe that's why attendance figures weren't great in the 80s. Definitely some parts to be proud of, but otherwise we were little more than a 'good team' during this period.

But you just watch the complaints come hurling in now that I'm denigrating our illustrious past, "call yourself a Spurs fan" etc, without them once considering how juicy the irony is...



Because again, they've internalized the hatred of others. Spurs became such a laughing stock in the 90s that we've never recovered, and probably the last time the old heads felt able to be proud of Tottenham was in the 80s. They yearn for the FA Cup, to redeem their broken hearts from decades ago, and to soothe the wounds of rival fans taking the piss out of our recent trophy cabinet.

They're not looking at the matter and considering the overrall health of the club and its place within the world of football. They're looking at it through the lens of wearing the shirt in London etc, and not getting wound up over it. Until Levy makes them whole again, until Levy gives them back their pride in winning the FA Cup, nothing is ever good enough and anyone who disagrees is a traitor to the God It Sucks To Be A Spurs Fan brigade.

At least, that's what I assume. I never hear much better arguments to persuade me otherwise.
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Zzz Ok GIF by Jim Gaffigan
 
Shadydan said:
All kings have off an off days, Pep finished 3rd last season :ledley:

He will be back on top very soon, I have faith in my chairman 💪
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You're the most unique football fan I've ever come across, pal.

Spurs fans the world over will wax lyrical about the great Bill Nic. Others idolise past players such as Hoddle of Greavesie. Or current players like Sonny.

Fans of other clubs have their own hero's and icon's

But fair play. You're the only one I've found anywhere who's idol and football hero is....

......the fucking club chairman :mourweird:
 
Datzlo said:
I think it's more that, at least according to the ENIC Out crowd on the forum I generally frequent, that they feel we were a super-successful club in the 80s, not the 90s, and that this was a golden hey-day that Levy can't hold a candle to.

But the 80s weren't that great either, tbh. We came 3rd three times, which isn't awful, but it isn't a legacy of magnificence either, and we came 13th and 14th during that decade also. Of course, our signature successes came in the cups, but even then it's a little sketch when you look at it:

In 1981 we needed a replay to beat 12th place Manchester City in the final, but then again we came 10th that year, so maybe it was evenly matched. The leauge of course was won by Aston Villa, who then won the European Cup the following season.

In 1982 we needed a replay again, but this time against 2nd Division's QPR. 1-0 to the Tottenham, which is a little less impressive than the 3-1 Liverpool beat us with in the League Cup final, but then again they won the league while we came 4th.

In 1984 we fell to 8th in the league, but did manage to win the UEFA Cup, and much enjoyment was had, which was good because we were out of the FA Cup by the 4th Round; a common theme for us during the 80s. In fact, aside from losing to Coventry in 87, we didn't even so much as reach a quarter final in the competition for the rest of the decade, although we did manage another semi in the LC.

So three or four good seasons, but none of them particularly amazing, and the rest was fill with disappointment. Maybe that's why attendance figures weren't great in the 80s. Definitely some parts to be proud of, but otherwise we were little more than a 'good team' during this period.

But you just watch the complaints come hurling in now that I'm denigrating our illustrious past, "call yourself a Spurs fan" etc, without them once considering how juicy the irony is...



Because again, they've internalized the hatred of others. Spurs became such a laughing stock in the 90s that we've never recovered, and probably the last time the old heads felt able to be proud of Tottenham was in the 80s. They yearn for the FA Cup, to redeem their broken hearts from decades ago, and to soothe the wounds of rival fans taking the piss out of our recent trophy cabinet.

They're not looking at the matter and considering the overrall health of the club and its place within the world of football. They're looking at it through the lens of wearing the shirt in London etc, and not getting wound up over it. Until Levy makes them whole again, until Levy gives them back their pride in winning the FA Cup, nothing is ever good enough and anyone who disagrees is a traitor to the God It Sucks To Be A Spurs Fan brigade.

At least, that's what I assume. I never hear much better arguments to persuade me otherwise.
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It’s always going to be subjective and dependent on what argument anyone puts forward at anyone time to make their point.

The truth is that we tend to have underachieved, rather than overachieved across our history based on supporter base, finance etc the two league titles are not reflective.
 
Datzlo said:
I think it's more that, at least according to the ENIC Out crowd on the forum I generally frequent, that they feel we were a super-successful club in the 80s, not the 90s, and that this was a golden hey-day that Levy can't hold a candle to.

But the 80s weren't that great either, tbh. We came 3rd three times, which isn't awful, but it isn't a legacy of magnificence either, and we came 13th and 14th during that decade also. Of course, our signature successes came in the cups, but even then it's a little sketch when you look at it:

In 1981 we needed a replay to beat 12th place Manchester City in the final, but then again we came 10th that year, so maybe it was evenly matched. The leauge of course was won by Aston Villa, who then won the European Cup the following season.

In 1982 we needed a replay again, but this time against 2nd Division's QPR. 1-0 to the Tottenham, which is a little less impressive than the 3-1 Liverpool beat us with in the League Cup final, but then again they won the league while we came 4th.

In 1984 we fell to 8th in the league, but did manage to win the UEFA Cup, and much enjoyment was had, which was good because we were out of the FA Cup by the 4th Round; a common theme for us during the 80s. In fact, aside from losing to Coventry in 87, we didn't even so much as reach a quarter final in the competition for the rest of the decade, although we did manage another semi in the LC.

So three or four good seasons, but none of them particularly amazing, and the rest was fill with disappointment. Maybe that's why attendance figures weren't great in the 80s. Definitely some parts to be proud of, but otherwise we were little more than a 'good team' during this period.

But you just watch the complaints come hurling in now that I'm denigrating our illustrious past, "call yourself a Spurs fan" etc, without them once considering how juicy the irony is...



Because again, they've internalized the hatred of others. Spurs became such a laughing stock in the 90s that we've never recovered, and probably the last time the old heads felt able to be proud of Tottenham was in the 80s. They yearn for the FA Cup, to redeem their broken hearts from decades ago, and to soothe the wounds of rival fans taking the piss out of our recent trophy cabinet.

They're not looking at the matter and considering the overrall health of the club and its place within the world of football. They're looking at it through the lens of wearing the shirt in London etc, and not getting wound up over it. Until Levy makes them whole again, until Levy gives them back their pride in winning the FA Cup, nothing is ever good enough and anyone who disagrees is a traitor to the God It Sucks To Be A Spurs Fan brigade.

At least, that's what I assume. I never hear much better arguments to persuade me otherwise.
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You care too much about what other people think. That's never healthy. Folk should let people support their team the way they like.
 
LeParisien said:
The point is that we have invested significantly in our stadium. If you add the percentage of revenue spent on infrastructure to the wages then you would not see a significant difference woth the other clubs.
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I'm not sure how true that is. Real Madrid and Barcelona have billion euro stadium projects, United apparently will soon, everybody is trying to do this.

To the extent they can they become just like us, except with an ethic of competition that Spurs have never and will never have under Levy.

To the extent they can't they get left in the dust on the turnover side, but because of said ethic of competition they will extend their club's limited resources much more aggressively to maintain parity at least.

To Dare Is Too Dear for us, for EVERYONE else it is not.

Disagree with that if you like, identify with the profit accumulation logic of ENIC if you like, whatever. But the post I responded to was performatively wondering how could anyone not be happy with ENIC? It ain't fuckin' rocket science.
 
Datzlo said:
I think it's more that, at least according to the ENIC Out crowd on the forum I generally frequent, that they feel we were a super-successful club in the 80s, not the 90s, and that this was a golden hey-day that Levy can't hold a candle to.

But the 80s weren't that great either, tbh. We came 3rd three times, which isn't awful, but it isn't a legacy of magnificence either, and we came 13th and 14th during that decade also. Of course, our signature successes came in the cups, but even then it's a little sketch when you look at it:

In 1981 we needed a replay to beat 12th place Manchester City in the final, but then again we came 10th that year, so maybe it was evenly matched. The leauge of course was won by Aston Villa, who then won the European Cup the following season.

In 1982 we needed a replay again, but this time against 2nd Division's QPR. 1-0 to the Tottenham, which is a little less impressive than the 3-1 Liverpool beat us with in the League Cup final, but then again they won the league while we came 4th.

In 1984 we fell to 8th in the league, but did manage to win the UEFA Cup, and much enjoyment was had, which was good because we were out of the FA Cup by the 4th Round; a common theme for us during the 80s. In fact, aside from losing to Coventry in 87, we didn't even so much as reach a quarter final in the competition for the rest of the decade, although we did manage another semi in the LC.

So three or four good seasons, but none of them particularly amazing, and the rest was fill with disappointment. Maybe that's why attendance figures weren't great in the 80s. Definitely some parts to be proud of, but otherwise we were little more than a 'good team' during this period.

But you just watch the complaints come hurling in now that I'm denigrating our illustrious past, "call yourself a Spurs fan" etc, without them once considering how juicy the irony is...



Because again, they've internalized the hatred of others. Spurs became such a laughing stock in the 90s that we've never recovered, and probably the last time the old heads felt able to be proud of Tottenham was in the 80s. They yearn for the FA Cup, to redeem their broken hearts from decades ago, and to soothe the wounds of rival fans taking the piss out of our recent trophy cabinet.

They're not looking at the matter and considering the overrall health of the club and its place within the world of football. They're looking at it through the lens of wearing the shirt in London etc, and not getting wound up over it. Until Levy makes them whole again, until Levy gives them back their pride in winning the FA Cup, nothing is ever good enough and anyone who disagrees is a traitor to the God It Sucks To Be A Spurs Fan brigade.

At least, that's what I assume. I never hear much better arguments to persuade me otherwise.
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I was born in the 80s but had little cognisance for football back then, but as I understand it Everton were 'the team' of that decade, behind Liverpool, up until - dare I phrase this badly - Liverpool fucked it up and teams like Everton and Spurs suffered very badly from the european exile (losing players to european teams, financial issues and so on), while Liverpool (as a more stable and bigger club) had no such issues and were able to waltz into the 90s on the same trajectory.

We've never been in that top section of clubs that have regularly been up there (Liverpool, Man Utd, Woolwich) and always were in the other bag of clubs that occasionally upset them (Everton, Villa, Leeds, Forest etc), so with all the complains about the club as it is, it feels a bit like the criticism is unfairly levelled against not only "because we're not Liverpool" (and yet, who is?) but also in the fact that the sport itself is just a different beast, from Abramovich era onwards, to what it has ever been before, where teams have gone from Fergies "we don't want to play in the FA Cup, thanks" to teams like City fielding full strength League Cup teams because they see any trophy as an opportunity to sportswash.
 
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