Keep the Manager, Change the players ?

[Paul Gascoigne]

Am I the only one who thinks that keeping Jose and changing the players is the answer ?

MOTD showed that both he and Poch got the same results from this bunch of players !

We are going to go through a huge change in the next 24 months and I cannot see anyone else better.

The easiest thing is to sack Jose and get another guy in to try.

So someone who hasn't worked in the Prem or someone else's cast off? Is Potter, Howe a better choice ?

I simply put this out for discussion as Gross, Ramos, Graham AVB and even Harry have come and gone.

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

 

[AussieYiddo]

Personally I back Jose, and I also didn't want us to sack Poch at the time. I don't think there are any managers available at the moment that I would prefer over Jose, and it would cost. a shit tonne to get rid of him. We also had a really good summer where I feel like we completed half of our rebuild.

Personally I'd give him until the end of the season and reassess then, I think if Jose goes Kane will too as he already sat through one transition period and it would have gone to shit. IMO we can still win silverware this season and winning something is what he was brought here to do, all eggs in the Europa basket.

 

[deadleyledley]

There is justification for that.

But Jose has never been a rebuild manager. He doesn't know how to build a squad. He is reliant on having top players pretty much all over the pitch.

So yes a rebuild is absolutely required. The new manager will fall foul off everything Poch and Jose have. But I don't think Jose is the right man to oversee a rebuild.

 

[Totti]

We've had worse squads and performed better. There are squads worse than ours that are above us in the league.

And on top of that we have a manager that tends to have a life span of 3 years and we're already half way into that.

Change the players? By all means.

But we'd need to change the manager before that truly matters.

 

[Yid04Life]

There is justification for that.

But Jose has never been a rebuild manager. He doesn't know how to build a squad. He is reliant on having top players pretty much all over the pitch.

So yes a rebuild is absolutely required. The new manager will fall foul off everything Poch and Jose have. But I don't think Jose is the right man to oversee a rebuild.

Agree. Should have let Poch do his “painful”rebuild. I didn’t welcome Mourinho and wanted to be wrong about him. Hard to keep backing him based on what his team delivers currently.

 

[Nabil Bentaleb]

Both

 

[OctopusOtto]

First of all, you can't compare Klopp with Jose. Of course Klopp deserves critism but he is nowhere near the situation Jose is in (he has already proven that he can be successful with his team and in which direction he wants to go).

It would be naive to say that the players are not to blame and would be world class with another manager. But then again it would also be naive to say that they can't do better than 9th place.

I don't know what is going on, but the further the season is progressing the less I think that Jose has the answers or is able to do something within the scope of his possibilities.

 

[H4SPURS]

Am I the only one who thinks that keeping Jose and changing the players is the answer ?

MOTD showed that both he and Poch got the same results from this bunch of players !

We are going to go through a huge change in the next 24 months and I cannot see anyone else better.

The easiest thing is to sack Jose and get another guy in to try.

So someone who hasn't worked in the Prem or someone else's cast off? Is Potter, Howe a better choice ?

I simply put this out for discussion as Gross, Ramos, Graham AVB and even Harry have come and gone.

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

I agree with you. There are no other manager that we bring in that is not a huge gamble.

It might be a big gamble right now staying with Jose but given time, I believe he will figure it out.

If he got the defensive signings that he asked for, we might well be in a different position today.

I have the patience to see this out. A bit rough right now but I believe with his ability and some investment, we’ll have better days ahead.

 

[Totti]

I agree with you. There are no other manager that we bring in that is not a huge gamble.

It might be a big gamble right now staying with Jose but given time, I believe he will figure it out.

If he got the defensive signings that he asked for, we might well be in a different position today.

I have the patience to see this out. A bit rough right now but I believe with his ability and some investment, we’ll have better days ahead.

What evidence do you have from Mourinho's past that makes you believe we'll have better days ahead with Mourinho moving forward?

We aren't the most successful club in our domestic league, we aren't the richest or best backed club in our domestic league and we don't have a squad riddled with world class talent. 3 things that Mourinho's most successful clubs tend to have or be.

What have you seen since we sacked Pochettino 15 months ago to now that makes you think that given even more time, our performances would improve?

I'd love to have my mind changed.

 

[Doom Funk]

Am I the only one who thinks that keeping Jose and changing the players is the answer ?

MOTD showed that both he and Poch got the same results from this bunch of players !

We are going to go through a huge change in the next 24 months and I cannot see anyone else better.

The easiest thing is to sack Jose and get another guy in to try.

So someone who hasn't worked in the Prem or someone else's cast off? Is Potter, Howe a better choice ?

I simply put this out for discussion as Gross, Ramos, Graham AVB and even Harry have come and gone.

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

you also thought we were gonna win the league so ....









:dierpochhug::dierpochhug:

 

[bonaspur23]

Am I the only one who thinks that keeping Jose and changing the players is the answer ?

MOTD showed that both he and Poch got the same results from this bunch of players !

We are going to go through a huge change in the next 24 months and I cannot see anyone else better.

The easiest thing is to sack Jose and get another guy in to try.

So someone who hasn't worked in the Prem or someone else's cast off? Is Potter, Howe a better choice ?

I simply put this out for discussion as Gross, Ramos, Graham AVB and even Harry have come and gone.

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

1) You are the one that made the title thread after we had a record of 2-1–1. So you deserve credit for blind optimism, but I would not trust you for a realistic viewpoint.

2) Liverpool are not sacking Klopp because last season he won the league by a landslide. The season before he got 99 points and won the UCL.

Jose’s spurs accomplishment is 6th place last year and reaching a league cup final (while only playing 1 premier league team).

 

[Igula]

Poch did not have a bunch of these players so whatever you saw on MOTD was wrong they did not get the same results with the same players.

Keeping Jose is a fucking terrible idea. There is no reason to think if he had an unlimited budget with his pick of players that Jose would get good results. He has repeatedly shown he is the problem and yet still people want to bury their head in the sand and make up excuses for him.

There is literally not a single reason to keep him.

 

[H4SPURS]

What evidence do you have from Mourinho's past that makes you believe we'll have better days ahead with Mourinho moving forward?

We aren't the most successful club in our domestic league, we aren't the richest or best backed club in our domestic league and we don't have a squad riddled with world class talent. 3 things that Mourinho's most successful clubs tend to have or be.

What have you seen since we sacked Pochettino 15 months ago to now that makes you think that given even more time, our performances would improve?

I'd love to have my mind changed.

I have a suspicion that no matter what anyone says or presents as far as evidence would change your mind or minds of many who have been calling for Jose’s sacking.

I trust individuals such as Jose, who has all his life proven to solve problems and have gone on to win things. Sometimes, it doesn’t work out to the levels he would prefer but I do believe that with any constraints that he might have to deal with he will get the best out of what he has to work with. These successful people hate to fail!

Successful individuals like him know how to get it done but they have to be allowed time to get there if they don’t have the ability to get the set up required to be successful right away. If you look at Porto and Inter, he had the ability to find the puzzle pieces he needed eventhough they weren’t record type signings. Key is to get the right pieces together. You gotta give someone with his track record a chance to get those puzzle pieces together before you can judge how he is performing. Klopp needed his pieces. Pep needed his pieces. Jose had most pieces but not all while he was at United and won things. If he only got the additional backing he needed that summer.

 

[Totti]

I have a suspicion that no matter what anyone says or presents as far as evidence would change your mind or minds of many who have been calling for Jose’s sacking.

I'd love for someone to change my mind - but they can never really provide me with any evidence from his history that tells me it'll end up working out well.

- 3 year max life expectancy at most clubs
- Usually spends a fortune or takes over a club that had previously spent a fortune
- Usually manages the clubs with the best resources and chairman willing to spend money
- Usually manages the biggest clubs in their domestic league

We tick none of the last 3 boxes - and we're nearly half way into the first one and we're actually getting worse.

I trust individuals such as Jose, who has all his life proven to solve problems and have gone on to win things. Sometimes, it doesn’t work out to the levels he would prefer but I do believe that with any constraints that he might have to deal with he will get the best out of what he has to work with. These successful people hate to fail!

I'm almost expecting a League Cup win with Mourinho - that's why he was brought in, no? To bring success to the club? For 15,000,000 a year it's the least I expect.

However, I don't think he'll win it regardless of his previous achievements at bigger and better clubs.

And even if he does. Well done him. He'd be the most successful Spurs manager of the last 30 years alongside George Graham and Juande Ramos.

Successful individuals like him know how to get it done but they have to be allowed time to get there if they don’t have the ability to get the set up required to be successful right away. If you look at Porto and Inter, he had the ability to find the puzzle pieces he needed eventhough they weren’t record type signings. Key is to get the right pieces together. You gotta give someone with his track record a chance to get those puzzle pieces together before you can judge how he is performing. Klopp needed his pieces. Pep needed his pieces. Jose had most pieces but not all while he was at United and won things. If he only got the additional backing he needed that summer.

Again, where's the history of 'being allowed time' coming from?

Porto - first season, he won league, domestic cup and UEFA Cup.
Chelsea - first season, he won league and domestic cup
Inter Milan - first season, he won league
Real Madrid - first season, won domestic cup with most expensive squad ever assembled
Man Utd - first season, won domestic cup and Europa League.

Average time spent at a club over his 19 year career = 2.5 years

So far, he's been here for 15 months.

- Knocked out of Champions League by RB Leipzig
- Knocked out of the FA Cup by relegated Norwich City
- Knocked out of the FA Cup by Everton, conceding 5 goals
- Finished 6th in the league
- Currently sitting in 9th in the league.

However he has a cup final to look forward to and still in the Europa League.

If he doesn't end the season with a trophy or qualification for Champions League football next season -we have ZERO reason or ZERO proof that he should be given a second full year and a total of 30 months. When his average expectancy at a club is about that in the first place, but usually with the grace of having provided trophies for those previous clubs.

 

[False 9]

Sacking Mourinho while Daniel Levy & Enic are running Spurs

 

[sammyspurs]

Am I the only one who thinks that keeping Jose and changing the players is the answer ?

MOTD showed that both he and Poch got the same results from this bunch of players !

We are going to go through a huge change in the next 24 months and I cannot see anyone else better.

The easiest thing is to sack Jose and get another guy in to try.

So someone who hasn't worked in the Prem or someone else's cast off? Is Potter, Howe a better choice ?

I simply put this out for discussion as Gross, Ramos, Graham AVB and even Harry have come and gone.

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

In an ideal world I’d swap out the entire squad (bar Hojberg and the kids) just not an option though

Yes there’s talent, but we have a team of no heart bottle jobs

 

[sammyspurs]

Are Liverpool sacking Klopp ?

On that note, the common theme is that Klopp isn’t good now all of a sudden.

Flavours of the month like Nagelsmann (same age as half our squad) will apparently command respect and have us win the league

 

[halothagod]

Keep. Sell dross. Go again.




No improvement = instant sack.

 

[H4SPURS]

I'd love for someone to change my mind - but they can never really provide me with any evidence from his history that tells me it'll end up working out well.

- 3 year max life expectancy at most clubs
- Usually spends a fortune or takes over a club that had previously spent a fortune
- Usually manages the clubs with the best resources and chairman willing to spend money
- Usually manages the biggest clubs in their domestic league

We tick none of the last 3 boxes - and we're nearly half way into the first one and we're actually getting worse.



I'm almost expecting a League Cup win with Mourinho - that's why he was brought in, no? To bring success to the club? For 15,000,000 a year it's the least I expect.

However, I don't think he'll win it regardless of his previous achievements at bigger and better clubs.

And even if he does. Well done him. He'd be the most successful Spurs manager of the last 30 years alongside George Graham and Juande Ramos.



Again, where's the history of 'being allowed time' coming from?

Porto - first season, he won league, domestic cup and UEFA Cup.
Chelsea - first season, he won league and domestic cup
Inter Milan - first season, he won league
Real Madrid - first season, won domestic cup with most expensive squad ever assembled
Man Utd - first season, won domestic cup and Europa League.

Average time spent at a club over his 19 year career = 2.5 years

So far, he's been here for 15 months.

- Knocked out of Champions League by RB Leipzig
- Knocked out of the FA Cup by relegated Norwich City
- Knocked out of the FA Cup by Everton, conceding 5 goals
- Finished 6th in the league
- Currently sitting in 9th in the league.

However he has a cup final to look forward to and still in the Europa League.

If he doesn't end the season with a trophy or qualification for Champions League football next season -we have ZERO reason or ZERO proof that he should be given a second full year and a total of 30 months. When his average expectancy at a club is about that in the first place, but usually with the grace of having provided trophies for those previous clubs.

Well, even at those really successful first and second season gigs, he got knocked out of some of the competitions.

The difference is that he had the puzzle pieces that enabled him to achieve what he was able to. Porto went and got him the pieces he was looking for. Inter went and got him the pieces he was looking for. Madrid had many of the pieces and went and got him more. Chelsea was the same.

We are not that kind of club that can get him all the pieces all at once, so we need to give him time so that the club can spread out the gathering of what he is building. Provided he doesn’t lose patience first from hating the aspects of losing while getting there.

If the trend of his tenure holds true, then all of you who want him out wouldn’t have to wait much longer. So, why not support our club and support our current manager as well as players in the mean time?

 

[MVP]

We won't change the players, got no money.