Messi is overrated now ahaha the Poch cultists have gone completely loco.
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Manager Mauricio Pochettino
- Thread starter WHITE&BLUE
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Trophy counts and sorry it's two off, my bad. (If Poch wins the 4 he's expected to this season that would make 6 in total, to Klopps 8 (obviously Klopp could add more this season but doubt it will be 4). That's all, that's why to him they are important, they silence those that use trophies like some dick-measuring contest.
Klopp is levels ahead.Oooof that's extremely over-generous.
Klopp:
...And that's for 2 teams significantly financially out-gunned in their respective leagues.
Vs flat-tracking the shit out of France with unlimited resources.
The twitter hoards would gleefully (yet rightfully) shut your claim down in seconds.
Dortmund hadnt won their league for a decade before Klopp. With him they won it twice and without him a decade has passed and they havent won it again. They hadnt won their FACup in 30 years before Klopp as well.
With liverpool he's gone even further.
Comparing Poch to Klopp is nonsense. It would be kind of similar if he had joined Marseille or Lyon or something and won the league with them. Winning french stuff with PSG is worth nothing at all. All their managers do it. They have to win or at least reach the final of the Champions League to be considered a decent season.
100%
Pochettino is a good manager. He might even be very good and he certainly took us up a level but Klopp is much better. Simple fact.
Psychologically stronger, able to inject the right mentality into his players and fearless in how he treats them. He is the boss, simple.
Put even more succinctly Klopp is right up there with the very best managers of the last decade.
Pochettino isn't in the same league, and even with the same resources I don't believe would have done as well.
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I'm NOT fucking comparing him. I say FOR THOSE THAT DO, those that play top trumps with trophy counts as proof of anything and everything in football, for those that lack the intelligence to see the context in football, then for those people the noisiest cunts on the internet are silenced because he has (will have) trophies under his name. Read the very first post again for what I said. (I don't give a fuck about trophies when assessing how good a coach his, same when talking about a player). I have made NO argument of comparison between the coaches.
Wouldn’t say it’s that big a gulf but it’s clear Klopp is the better manager. Klopp is great but he does have the backing of a seriously well run club, all their players are bought with care to fit his way of playing, they have an elite operation. For me Liverpool is the best run club in the league.
Can't you see no-one will give a fuck if he wins ligue un? Certainly not the 'noisy cunts' you speak of..... (I don't know why you're so up tight about this..... For the Nth time: peeps are fully aware the claim you made wasn't based on your opinion of Poch and that you were discussing the perception of others.).
He's on a hiding to nothing there......
I can agree with a lot of this but think you are being harsh on Poch .
Poch did finish above Klopp every season until Klopp's board backed him (Coutinho money).
We can't totally equalise resources but Poch did vastly improve our full backs, Dembele, Alli, a raw Kane.
With regard to purchases, Klopp seemed to have the benefit of a committee insisting on the more astute buys; Poch has, so far, been found to be wanting in this regard. But again, with time and being injury free, could he have got Lo Celso and N'Dombele to work.
Winning against us in Madrid was Klopp's first 'success' in GB (if measured purely by trophies). He'd already lost a Europa final, a semi against a relegation threatened Villa , a League Cup final v City and finished below Poch every year.
However, his record in Germany is evidence we have for him being better. He is clearly a great of modern times.
Poch tried to inject us with a great mentality and came a long way. Luck plays a part in finals and semis. Klopp lost a lot too. Where Klopp was streets ahead mentally I think, comes from reading about Liverpool players at the airport returning home from losing to Madrid. Apparently he was getting them in a positive frame of mind to get back next year and win the thing.
Poch went away for a few weeks straight after our defeat in Madrid, maybe something to do with his emotional personality, but it can't be discounted that Klopp knew he had been backed, knew his team could come again; Poch knew the opposite. What would Klopp's reaction have been to a defeat and knowing he wasn't going to be backed.
For many of those that use trophies as a dick measuring tool of cause it shuts them up because they simply don't use nuance or context at all. Then there will be another layer on top of that, another subsection of fans, those that want to break down the leagues in which those trophies were obtained, made up of mostly rival fans who hate him for smashing their team at some point and probably a bunch of our own fanbase who thought that he was shit!
He's not on a hiding to nothing, he would have won stuff, got to a CL semi-final, walk away from them as a multimillionaire (his staff too), and straight into another job at one of the biggest clubs in the world (just like Tuchel).
I mean even Pep gets called out as shit because he's had Messi in his team and because at every team he's ever managed they had the best players, spent some of the most on those players etc...Is there any end to these shit managers that manage the best clubs in the world, if only the good ones like Warnock got their chance then we'll all see. C'mon!
You're kidding yourself if you don't think this element makes up the majority of the "noisy cunts" you originally spoke of though.
Him winning Ligue Un will only silence a tiny fraction; those who'm aren't informed enough to know the diff between the league and the club wealth involved or those that can't use wiki..... My ol' Dad basically.... And he's not exactly a twitter warrior to begin with.
You know exactly what I mean when I say "hiding to nothing"....
Besides; you got all uppity when I mentioned Kudos attached to the trophies (on topic!), so why are you suddenly bringing his wages (off topic) into it?
A CL-semi with PSG isn't exactly gonna trump a final with us either (which was already on his CV!), is it?
Fucking hell!! Alright mate! Honestly I don’t give a shit, never have. I don’t make my assessments on Managers this way, I’ve said this till I’m blue in the face.
If you do then fine, but I’m not going to be drawn on it because I don’t. And as you have already acknowledged that I wasn’t attempting to, so not much point in trying to do that with me as your response.
Calm down.... How many more times..... You're not being perceived to think that way..... Chill out and you might finally get that basic point.
The "noisy cunts"
No-one, not once, not evet has accused you of being one of them.
I don't either. But ONE of us (clue: Not you!) understands all along that that's not what's being quesitoned here.....
Not drawn, but launched into 'angry man mode' about it from the off - as if you were being insulted - without any discernable reason.
Ahhh, I"m sorry for trying to discuss something said with you, mate......
You made an assertion about the mentality of mainstream fan; I challenged it.... . :roll:
Thanks for finally 'acknowledging' my 'acknowledgement' though... On that basis you might even be humble enough to concur that I had a point all along (I accept that you won't though).
I assume we're done here. Fine by me.
It's just the multiple posts on a point that I wasn't even arguing, which you also acknowledge. I don't get what's even being said anymore so far away from the original point being made. Seems just a pointless avenue to take this.
See Poch still turning in disappointing results for PSG despite clearly leading the farmers league. Has the Harlem Globetrotters of a frontline and they can’t beat Lens.
See he still integrates players slowely, Donnarumma, Wijnaaldum etc. want the. Want him to succeed but as my PSG supporting pals tell me - it’s a slog and when knocked out of CL he’s done.
See he still integrates players slowely, Donnarumma, Wijnaaldum etc. want the. Want him to succeed but as my PSG supporting pals tell me - it’s a slog and when knocked out of CL he’s done.
Mauricio what are you doing? This passmap is hideous.
The guy on the left of Lens' back 3 Medina looks some player.
A quick look through a few PSG forums shows that Poch is quite unpopular.
A general feeling that he's tactically useless, now where have I got that feeling before?
A general feeling that he's tactically useless, now where have I got that feeling before?