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Too many pages to read. My views are that another oil rich owner pumping obscene amounts of money into the club is something I am not happy with. However it took MC a few years and hopefully it will take Newcastle a few years. They also need like MC a top manager and I wait to see who they appoint.
For players they are unlikely to be in the CL or win anything soon. Also Newcastle is not everyone's ideal place to live. Will they get the best players. Kane for example would be taking a risk going there next summer as in 2 years he will be a free agent and the chances of winning something before then is not that high.
 
Brian Fantana said:
The Potter links will be bullshit as it’s The Star but does anyone else think they are behaving in a particularly cuntish fashion towards Steve Bruce? Sacking him and replacing him with his right hand man is a bit of a two fingers up at him.
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It is usually normal practice for an assistant to take over for a few games when a manager is sacked. It would be worse if they let Bruce stay there for a couple of weeks while finding his replacement.

Look at us. We sacked Mourinho before a bloody cup final and put a random childrens coach in charge instead. They are 19th, hes not being deprived of a chance to lead them in any special game.
 
COckneY Spurs said:
Newcastle don’t have much to revamp, they were the second biggest stadium behind Utd for years….Their fans don’t give a second thought to the bells and whistles, they just want to see top players back at St James Park like the 90’s challenging for trophies again, and this time they will hope to get over the line….
Their fans are gonna love this ride that’s coming their way….Might take a season or two but it’s coming…
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Totally disagree with this.

One of the biggest legitimate complaints laid at the door of Ashley is that he didn't invest at all in Newcastle's infrastructure. Not a penny has been spent on the stadium in nearly 30yrs and their training ground is one of the worst in not just PL but Championship too!

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Their fans have been non-stop complaining about this state of affairs too, so it's rubbish to say they "don't give a shit" when evidence to the complete opposite exits.

Those "top players" that they will want to bring in are also being courted by PSG, Man City, Liverpool, Man U, Chelsea, Real Madrid. The next tier down of Spurs, Juventus, Woolwich, Bayern (I've put Bayern in this tier and not above because all they seem to do is take from other Bundesliga Clubs like Dortmund and now RB), Barca(??), Dortmund. Every single one of these Clubs has established elite infrastructure from the stadium to training grounds.

So, if you are a player looking to play for an elite club now Newcastle sure as hell ain't the club you will be choosing. In fact, if you were say Saint-Maximin at Newcastle now and anyone of those Clubs came in for you you would be off like a shot (even if wages were matched). Why would he stick around for a project that will take a decade to come to fruition when the possibility of joining an elite or 2nd their elite club now? A footballers career is a short one.

Also, none of these Clubs are going anywhere. City is a good example to look at, they have laid the groundwork for the revenues to stream in, an academy that's established and a worldwide club network for players to be transferred between their franchises etc. This has taken 13yrs and we've yet to see the true benefit of that infrastructure kick in yet (maybe Foden and Sancho are the two successes of the academy and they couldn't hold onto Sancho).

But however you look at this they absolutely have to build an infrasture that enables them to compete with PSG, City and the rest because that's the reality that they will be facing when fighting over the same players and this is even assuming that Newcastle is at a comparable level and the player is making his mid up over what team will give him his best prospects.

What is the unique selling point that Newcastle offers the players/coaches that they wouldn't get at all those other Clubs mentioned?

People thinking that this is going to happen in 3yrs are getting totally carried away with this circus, it took City 6yrs to win PL part of this was accelerated by the infrastructure that was put in place, a new stadium (paid for by the taxpayer) & a brand new academy and an investment of approx £1.5b to underpin it all. (It's been 9yrs since the Qatari's took over PSG and like City haven't won a CL yet, they've dominated the domestic league because there's no competition to them unlike there is in PL).
 
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Guido said:
Totally disagree with this.

One of the biggest legitimate complaints laid at the door of Ashley is that he didn't invest at all in Newcastle's infrastructure. Not a penny has been spent on the stadium in nearly 30yrs and their training ground is one of the worst in not just PL but Championship too!

EPCfJtbWoAAT-Jd.jpg


Their fans have been non-stop complaining about this state of affairs too, so it's rubbish to say they "don't give a shit" when evidence to the complete opposite exits.

Those "top players" that they will want to bring in are also being courted by PSG, Man City, Liverpool, Man U, Chelsea, Real Madrid. The next tier down of Spurs, Juventus, Woolwich, Bayern (I've put Bayern in this tier and not above because all they seem to do is take from other Bundesliga Clubs like Dortmund and now RB), Barca(??), Dortmund. Every single one of these Clubs has established elite infrastructure from the stadium to training grounds.

So, if you are a player looking to play for an elite club now Newcastle sure as hell ain't the club you will be choosing. In fact, if you were say Saint-Maximin at Newcastle now and anyone of those Clubs came in for you you would be off like a shot (even if wages were matched). Why would he stick around for a project that will take a decade to come to fruition when the possibility of joining an elite or 2nd their elite club now? A footballers career is a short one.

Also, known of these Clubs are going anywhere. City is a good example to look at, they have laid the groundwork for the revenues to stream in, an academy that's established and a worldwide club network for players to be transferred between their franchises etc. This has taken 13yrs and we've yet to see the true benefit of that infrastructure kick in yet (maybe Foden and Sancho are the two successes of the academy and they couldn't hold onto Sancho).

But however you look at this they absolutely have to build an infrasture that enables them to compete with PSG, City and the rest because that's the reality that they will be facing when fighting over the same players and this is even assuming that Newcastle is out a comparable level and the player is making his mid up over what team will give him his best prospects.

What is the unique selling point that Newcastle offers the players/coaches that they wouldn't get at all those other Clubs mentioned?

People thinking that this is going to happen in 3yrs are getting totally carried away with this circus, it took City 6yrs to win PL part of this was accelerated by the infrastructure that was put in place, a new stadium (paid for by the taxpayer) & a brand new academy and an investment of approx £1.5b to underpin it all. (It's been 9yrs since the Qatari's took over PSG and like City haven't won a CL yet, they've dominated the domestic league because there's no competition to them unlike there is in PL).
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To add to this.

Rafa Benitez publicly complained whilst Newcastle manager that he could not even get Ashley to spring for new paint for the training ground. Let alone any actual renovations.
 
4-5 years to become a top 6 team, 6-8 to crack the top 4, and within a decade they will have a league title. That's the timeframe I'd bet on, and I would be surprised if they haven't set a similar one themselves. They do have a lot of work to do as the league has plenty of depth, and for a while they will have to overpay for middling talents.
 
Raumdeuterz said:
4-5 years to become a top 6 team, 6-8 to crack the top 4, and within a decade they will have a league title. That's the timeframe I'd bet on, and I would be surprised if they haven't set a similar one themselves. They do have a lot of work to do as the league has plenty of depth, and for a while they will have to overpay for middling talents.
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It was 6yrs before City won the league and that was during a time where Utd had just dropped off as Fergie was no longer manager (Utd had had pretty much a clear run to their last handful of titles with the only challenger being Chelsea).

They now have to compete with City, Liverpool, Chelsea all capable of winning the league. In addition, there is Utd who's revenue will always make them relevant within the discussion, they actually have the squad but lack a readable manager, it would be a shock if OGS remains manager beyond this season if they fail to win anything. These clubs aren't going anywhere, year on year they are getting stronger and stronger (or more powerful within the football ecosystem however it is dissected and analysed).

Whilst Spurs are outsiders to this party the revenue stream that's been built does put us back in the frame as a giant hurdle that have to be negotiated, we require a decent manager to make us perform better than the sum of our parts but within the time frame, you mention a CL place is entirely possible for us which as it's rare that Chavs, Liverpool, City and Man U are all competitive at the same time as at least one of those is usually having a poor season/and/or a transitional one. The revenue that we generate from the stadium (assuming a full season and other events) is equal to us getting into CL qualification.

We've seen constantly now that even if one of those teams has an absolute cluster fuck they don't go away, that they for all of the media talk of "disaster" they are still finishing 6th/7th/8th ready to go again the next year and rich enough to hire a has been manager paying him 3rd highest salary in the world and spunk £150m on new signings.

Assuming they are in it for the long haul then I think it will be closer to 15-20yrs before they are seriously challenging for a PL title (it will take a rare event of all of the big 6 simultaneously not performing to expectation and them to have a good and well-managed team for them to achieve win PL within 15-20yrs).
 
Guido said:
It was 6yrs before City won the league and that was during a time where Utd had just dropped off as Fergie was no longer manager (Utd had had pretty much a clear run to their last handful of titles with the only challenger being Chelsea).

They now have to compete with City, Liverpool, Chelsea all capable of winning the league. In addition, there is Utd who's revenue will always make them relevant within the discussion, they actually have the squad but lack a readable manager, it would be a shock if OGS remains manager beyond this season if they fail to win anything. These clubs aren't going anywhere, year on year they are getting stronger and stronger (or more powerful within the football ecosystem however it is dissected and analysed).

Whilst Spurs are outsiders to this party the revenue stream that's been built does put us back in the frame as a giant hurdle that have to be negotiated, we require a decent manager to make us perform better than the sum of our parts but within the time frame, you mention a CL place is entirely possible for us which as it's rare that Chavs, Liverpool, City and Man U are all competitive at the same time as at least one of those is usually having a poor season/and/or a transitional one. The revenue that we generate from the stadium (assuming a full season and other events) is equal to us getting into CL qualification.

We've seen constantly now that even if one of those teams has an absolute cluster fuck they don't go away, that they for all of the media talk of "disaster" they are still finishing 6th/7th/8th ready to go again the next year and rich enough to hire a has been manager paying him 3rd highest salary in the world and spunk £150m on new signings.

Assuming they are in it for the long haul then I think it will be closer to 15-20yrs before they are seriously challenging for a PL title (it will take a rare event of all of the big 6 simultaneously not performing to expectation and them to have a good and well-managed team for them to achieve win PL within 15-20yrs).
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One benefit I think they'll get is the fact that players are more likely to run their contracts down now. That's more common than it was when either Chelsea or City were originally purchased. This summer for example (if they remain a Premier League side) I imagine they will make 3-4 free signings of a decent level. The wages they will offer will be significant, but I'd also expect them to get money to some of these players via the back door, in order to keep their overall wage bill down.

With the level the Premier League is now, I also think they'll be able to attract a higher calibre of players than teams will have been able to in the past. We've seen mid-table sides attract good players before, and they're not even part of the super rich. More than ever this league is THE destination in world football, and players have seen teams like Newcastle before. Everyone has full faith they'll reach the top and that it's just a matter of time. They still won't be able to get top players, but ones like Rudiger, Sule or Kessie? It's doable.

With the position they're currently in, they can spend 200 million without a worry about FFP regulations. Many foreign clubs are still suffering post covid, and that amount of money with the correct scouting could buy you a hell of a lot. Especially when you're bringing in a handful of free players who have no impact on the FFP rules. It's all down to a lot of luck whether those players are mostly a success, and down to whether they get their managerial appointments right, but I believe it's possible.

But you may well be right and the timeframe will be off. It depends on how aggressive they are, how shady they're willing to be with sponsors and backhanders. Also how well they nail the overall strategy concerning how they play, the managers they want to appoint and the profile of players they're interested in. City made a lot of errors in that respect early on, and I'll be interested to see if Newcastle have learned from that. I read they were interested in Potter as manager .. which would be very interesting.
 
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Raumdeuterz said:
One benefit I think they'll get is the fact that players are more likely to run their contracts down now. That's more common than it was when either Chelsea or City were originally purchased. This summer for example (if they remain a Premier League side) I imagine they will make 3-4 free signings of a decent level. The wages they will offer will be significant, but I'd also expect them to get money to some of these players via the back door, in order to keep their overall wage bill down.

With the level the Premier League is now, I also think they'll be able to attract a higher calibre of players than teams will have been able to in the past. We've seen mid-table sides attract good players before, and they're not even part of the super rich. More than ever this league is THE destination in world football, and players have seen teams like Newcastle before. Everyone has full faith they'll reach the top and that it's just a matter of time. They still won't be able to get top players, but ones like Rudiger, Sule or Kessie? It's doable.

With the position they're currently in, they can spend 200 million without a worry about FFP regulations. Many foreign clubs are still suffering post covid, and that amount of money with the correct scouting could buy you a hell of a lot. Especially when you're bringing in a handful of free players who have no impact on the FFP rules. It's all down to a lot of luck whether those players are mostly a success, and down to whether they get their managerial appointments right, but I believe it's possible.

But you may well be right and the timeframe will be off. It depends on how aggressive they are, how shady they're willing to be with sponsors and backhanders, and how well they nail the overall strategy concerning how they play, the managers they want to appoint and the profile of players they're interested in. City made a lot of errors in that respect early on, and I'll be interested to see if Newcastle have learned from that. I read they were interested in Potter as manager .. which would be very interesting.
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You make some good points especially the running of contracts down but if those players e.g. M'bappe (who I personally think is one of the most overrated players on the planet but for the sake of this argument no one else seems to agree with that and he's spoken in terms of one of the best) he will not go to Newcastle he'll go to the elite clubs, he's not wasting any time going to a "project club" he doesn't have to. They might well attract the likes of Thiago, Vertonghen or Ramos basically players towards the end of their career, where the % chance of them declining is more likely than them maintaining their performance levels. I don't see this is an appropriate strategy to win a PL in the highest pressing league on the planet.

I hear Ragnick being linked as DoF, I think this will be a good move, as I'm sure he could build a squad of a younger profile of player and possibly bring in a young and up and coming manager that players a style of football that marries with the profile too. Basically, do a Red Bull. I'd be more concerned of them achieving something under the time frame I mentioned if they went this route. But if they went the route of PSG then I don't ever see them gaining any serious traction in the PL.
 
Guido said:
You make some good points especially the running of contracts down but if those players e.g. M'bappe (who I personally think is one of the most overrated players on the planet but for the sake of this argument no one else seems to agree with that and he's spoken in terms of one of the best) he will not go to Newcastle he'll go to the elite clubs, he's not wasting any time going to a "project club" he doesn't have to. They might well attract the likes of Thiago, Vertonghen or Ramos basically players towards the end of their career, where the % chance of them declining is more likely than them maintaining their performance levels. I don't see this is an appropriate strategy to win a PL in the highest pressing league on the planet.

I hear Ragnick being linked as DoF, I think this will be a good move, as I'm sure he could build a squad of a younger profile of player and possibly bring in a young and up and coming manager that players a style of football that marries with the profile too. Basically, do a Red Bull. I'd be more concerned of them achieving something under the time frame I mentioned if they went this route. But if they went the route of PSG then I don't ever see them gaining any serious traction in the PL.
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Bit off topic but I'm not sold on Mbappe as a future Ballon d'or winner either. The money Madrid offered for him as a player whose contract was about to run out was staggering. But willing to bow to those with more knowledge on this one, clearly he's rated by a lot of the right people.

But yeah, they won't get the top tier of players. But the ones below that who aren't necessarily as old as a Ramos (Kessie is a really good example) may consider them if the wages are ludicrous and they believe in the 'project'. Those kind of players could propel them in to the top half quite quickly if they attain enough of them.

The strategy is the most important thing, absolutely. It's why I said Potter going would be very interesting. He wouldn't want a bunch of past it big names, he'd want hungry and talented players who he can mould. So if that's what the aim is, I'd actually be more worried than if they went for a Conte, who has always been a more short term option, and I think would struggle with a poor squad of players at first.

Getting someone like Ragnick in and establishing a consistent theme to their signings/structure would be very important. I expect them to have learned from other clubs who have done the same thing, they've the advantage of that knowledge. It'll be interesting to watch unfold .. horrible, but interesting.
 
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